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fraud (Read 678 times)

    Don't debit cards always have a pin number?  Usually a debit card is useless without the pin.

     

    You can use a debit card as a credit card and buy things with just a signature.  I wouldn't think you could buy a gift card that way, though.

    Well at least someone here is making relevance to the subject.

    JimR


      You can use a debit card as a credit card and buy things with just a signature.  I wouldn't think you could buy a gift card that way, though.

       

      I might be wrong but I don't think that's true of pure debit cards, only of combination debit/credit cards.  Not sure of B of A though.


      Wandering Wally

        You can buy a gift card that way online, and I have.  From Cabela's even.  Not recently though.

        Run!  Just Run!

         

        Trail Runner Nation Podcast

        smarterblonde


        IronSnatch

          Too bad you don't have a lawyer friend you could feel comfortable asking for advice.

          JimR


            You can buy a gift card that way online, and I have.  From Cabela's even.  Not recently though.

             

            Yeah, I just looked it up.  yech...pinless debit cards

              Debit card transactions can either be signature or PIN based.

               

              If the transaction processed as PIN based, then you might be in trouble because they somehow got your PIN.  Most likely they didn't unless you were careless with the Personal Identification Number.


              Likely, the transaction processed as a Signature based transaction, and the merchant (Cabela's) has an obligation to verify that the person making the transaction is the cardholder by verifying your signature on the back of the card to the signature that they used to buy the item.  Likely, the signature is different (since you weren't there).

               

              When you called BofA to dispute the transaction, the dispute team reaches out to the merchant to view the signature (as well as other known merchant signature transactions) to compare your signature to the signature on the Cabela's transaction.  Likely, they're not the same.  They'll also have video footage of the buyer, and they likely look different than you (even though they don't know what you look like).  The fraud analysts goes into a lot of detail to figure out whether its systematic fraud or incidental fraud. 

               

              Therefore, BofA will have Cabela pay for the transaction, and you'll be clear.  BofA might have some fraud research cost (don't think so though).  You get your money back pretty quick (as you already likely have) since it's a debit card and you need the cash in your checking account in order to function while they do their research.

               

              Believe it or not, this is pretty common. 

              I don't believe that you're in your best interest in going to the police, as you'll be made whole and Cabela's will eat the expense (as I understand it).  As frustrating as your situation is for you, it should be a comfort for you that you don't have to do much to be made whole. 

               

              MTA: re-read OP.  Sounds like it may have been an online transaction, and in that case, there's other fraud steps to unravel the mystery.  Basically, the merchant processor (on behalf of Cabela's) and the debit issuer (BofA) will work hard to find the origin of the transaction, and will try to stop them.  May track the purchase order (gift certificate) and wait for them to buy at Cabela's or see where the order is mailed to (if online order).  The email address will likely also be used, but I'm guessing that their investigators will be able to do more with it than you can.

               

              The bank does their part to minimize fraud.
              The merchants do their part to minimize fraud.

              We, as consumers, do our part to minimize fraud.

              But, it'll still happen.

              (I'm in the card industry, not BofA)


               

              2014 Goals:

              #1: Do what I can do. <DOING>

              #2: 365 Hours training <NOPE, INJURED>

               

                Last year I noticed a Cabelas charge on my Visa statement.  I called Cabelas and they gave me the info.  It was a $200 online gift card purchase.  The email associated with the charge was closed by the time I investigated.  Visa closed the account and sent me a new card.  But it was a pain.

                 

                Seems like credit card numbers are getting jacked more frequently.

                s k i p p y


                  You can buy a gift card that way online, and I have.  From Cabela's even.  Not recently though.

                   seems a bit suspicious.... you being in this thread and all  

                   

                   

                  SB you made me laugh, again

                   

                  HM I can't believe cabela's coughed up the email address, they were insistent on a subpoena

                   

                   

                   

                   

                  so I went to the local police station.  officer Kevin was pleasant and thought my story was a bit silly.   just as I was afraid of.   but I have a file now. first time for that, guess that's a good thing.   

                   

                  freakin fraud.   don't people know that what comes around goes around


                  Feeling the growl again

                    My Cabela's VISA number was stolen a little over a year ago and they racked up roughly $1K in charges before I caught it.  I think it was a stupid kid, because he purchased something off Ebay and shipped to the default address for the card -- my address.  That's how we caught on.  And he did it with another item from another vendor. 

                     

                    The second vendor actually read off the email address given for the purchase, which appeared on the surface to be the kind of format of a valid family-type email address.  So, when we reported it to Cabela's fraud dept we were able to give them that email address to go after them.  He also made charges to an online gaming service, which should provide another traceable link.

                     

                    Now here's the tough part.  In the end, you'll never know if they caught them or not, they are not going to spend the time/money to notify you.  I assume they had enough to catch the punk who stole mine but I'll never know for sure if they followed through.

                     

                    In the end, I just had to fill out a form listing the fraudulent charges and I got them removed by signing off on that, no further drama.  One of the vendors had some idiot who tried to force me to pay return shipping on a $300 item; I refused, he threatened me, I told him to go pound sand.  It's still sitting my my garage unopened if he wants to come pick it up.

                     

                    I called the local police to try and file a report.  They wanted nothing to do with it, nor this non-returned item that I wanted to turn in as stolen property of which I did not want posession.  In each and every interaction I have had with local police depts, if you are not reporting a murder you are simply an inconvenience forcing them to actually do some work.   So good luck getting them to actually do anything.  My wife used to work with officers from 3 departments and at the Christmas party they got some beer in them and spent a couple hours telling me all the ways they have figured out to avoid doing work.  (I am sure there are some good cops out there, BTW).

                     

                    Actually I'm a bit surprised they won't give you the email address.  It was a charge filed on YOUR card, once they verified your identity I don't understand why you don't have access to the information about charges filed on your card.  As I indicated, with a different vendor, once my wife's identity was verified they had no issues going over the order details with her and that's how we got the kid's email.

                    "If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does.  There's your pep talk for today.  Go Run." -- Slo_Hand

                     

                    aponi


                    never runs the tangents

                      I don't have anything useful to add except that this really blows. Also there was something on the news about how some asshole with some sort of gizmo can steal your credit card numbers from cards in your wallet because of some sort of thing they are sticking in cards now.

                       

                      Clearly this is the technical explaination for what is happening.

                       

                      On a personal level I am disappointed because my mom who falls for every crazy thing she reads online but does not trust the mainstream media sent me some email about this some time ago and I thought it was the usual BS.

                      when in doubt, run

                        Never been arrested? Interestimg.

                         

                        Sorry, Skippy. That really sucks. 


                        Feeling the growl again

                          I don't have anything useful to add except that this really blows. Also there was something on the news about how some asshole with some sort of gizmo can steal your credit card numbers from cards in your wallet because of some sort of thing they are sticking in cards now.

                           

                          Clearly this is the technical explaination for what is happening.

                           

                          On a personal level I am disappointed because my mom who falls for every crazy thing she reads online but does not trust the mainstream media sent me some email about this some time ago and I thought it was the usual BS.

                           

                           

                          You are referring to cards with the RFID chips, so you can just "tap" them rather than swipe them.  Rather than a scanner having to directly read a magnetic strip, it is just a proximity read of the RFID (Radio Frequency).

                           

                          So, the downside is that if someone with a scanner gets within RFID range of your wallet, they can steal your info.

                           

                          This is a lot easier than setting up fake card scanners on gas pumps and ATMS to get your info...another trick they use.

                          "If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does.  There's your pep talk for today.  Go Run." -- Slo_Hand

                           

                            You are referring to cards with the RFID chips, so you can just "tap" them rather than swipe them.  Rather than a scanner having to directly read a magnetic strip, it is just a proximity read of the RFID (Radio Frequency).

                             

                            So, the downside is that if someone with a scanner gets within RFID range of your wallet, they can steal your info.

                             

                            This is a lot easier than setting up fake card scanners on gas pumps and ATMS to get your info...another trick they use.

                             

                            The EMV chips card requires the account holder to be present to enter the PIN.

                            When the PIN is combined with the dynamic password PIN built within the card, there is additional security that makes it almost impossible for fraud theft.  The ever changing chip PIN prevent the 'steal to use later' or 'steal to use somewhere else' challenge with current magstripe credit cards.  
                            With those cards, fraudsters would require the Personal Identification Number that would not be known by the fraudster.

                             

                            Europeans know about this technology.  Americans don't have this technology yet.

                            2014 Goals:

                            #1: Do what I can do. <DOING>

                            #2: 365 Hours training <NOPE, INJURED>

                             


                            Feeling the growl again

                              The EMV chips card requires the account holder to be present to enter the PIN.

                              When the PIN is combined with the dynamic password PIN built within the card, there is additional security that makes it almost impossible for fraud theft.  The ever changing chip PIN prevent the 'steal to use later' or 'steal to use somewhere else' challenge with current magstripe credit cards.  
                              With those cards, fraudsters would require the Personal Identification Number that would not be known by the fraudster.

                               

                               

                              I known just enough to be dangerous.  I've been on a few conference calls, and talk to some of the technology and product people.

                               

                              Europeans know about this technology.  Americans don't have this technology yet.

                               

                              However I know enough to be wrong sometimes.  Wink

                               

                              Howvere the EU chip system appears to be different than the US tap system.  In the EU it looks like you must still run the card in a scanner, which you do not do with the tap system.  I would be interested in the real differences and security.

                               

                              Mta:

                              http://it.slashdot.org/story/12/01/30/177220/shmoocon-demo-shows-easy-wireless-credit-card-fraud

                               

                              After a few minutes of research, it appears that it is pretty easy to rip the number and expiration from an RFID tap card.  The security is a changing CCV#.  That may stop many transactions but not all.  Just yesterday I forgot my credit card, so my wife texted my the number and expiration date and the retailer let me use that without the card or CCV.  Many sellers do not require the CCV.

                               

                              But, feel free to correct me if I am reading this wrong.

                              "If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does.  There's your pep talk for today.  Go Run." -- Slo_Hand

                               

                                <deleted text>

                                yes, fraud happens, and you should be careful with your plastics.  Technology is trying keep up with the fraudsters and the new technology that I'm reading about is pretty interesting.   I imagine over the next 2 years many of us in the USA will know more about the technology than we do today. But, the newer stuff appears to be better than the traditional magstripe technology that we all know about. 

                                2014 Goals:

                                #1: Do what I can do. <DOING>

                                #2: 365 Hours training <NOPE, INJURED>

                                 

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