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Effects of running on knees and bone health (Read 1220 times)

    Before this thread goes off on a rabbit chase and never returns, I finally found the article that prompted this thread in the first place. Now everyone can read it for themselves and maybe generate some additional comments. Enjoy-- Baby Boomers: Medical Problems Waiting To Happen John

    Discipline is never an end in itself, only a means to an end. (RF)


    Needs more cowbell!

      Besides, I've seen hundreds of joggers and never a happy one. So if their agonized expression is the same as the pain experienced by their joints, small wonder hips and knees give out at a young age. Jogging is frequently a disaster waiting to happen, as it involves intense pressure, particularly on the knees. ~~~~~~~~~~ Guess he's never seen any of us blissfully Zen'd-out. Granted, many of my runs aren't so pleasant, but I don't think I look like I'm in agony most of the time. I'm no masochist--I wouldn't keep doing anything that's truly excruciating. And there's no form of exercise that isn't somewhat uncomfortable at times--otherwise there would be no reason for people to quit a fitness program. Perhaps he is only seeing patients with serious issues because those are the ones coming in to his practice for treatment. Squeaky wheel getting the grease, and all. How is he so certain that there wouldn't be MORE health issues if fewer Baby Boomers embraced jogging? Besides, by his logic we women should stop having babies. Childbirth is painful and does a lot of damage to a woman's body (my bladder will never be the same and I have an 8" scar on my lower abdomen from my son's surigical birth). I knew the risks going into it (though I did have my tubes tied a few years after his birth, LOL...fool me once, shame on you...ha!). One has to wonder what this guy looks like? DH had a doctor at one point who chastised him for his weight and cholesterol/triglycerides and prescribed exercise and weight loss--meanwhile this physician didn't practice what he preached in any evident fashion. Perhaps the author of the article is jealous of fit runners and figures if he can't (won't) join them, then he might as well beat them by belittling their efforts. k

      I shoot pretty things! ~

      '14 Goals:

      • 6 duathlons (1 Olympic distance)

      • 130#s (and stay there, gotdammit!)


      Needs more cowbell!

        Heh, and I'd partake in that rabbit chase, but I'd probably damage my joints, or something...

        I shoot pretty things! ~

        '14 Goals:

        • 6 duathlons (1 Olympic distance)

        • 130#s (and stay there, gotdammit!)


        A Dance with Monkeys

          Boomeritis: that a lot of people are now living longer and there are more knees being replaced does NOT mean that the activities that led to their living longer caused the knee damage. This is pure speculation based on anecdote. The knee damage may be present in everybody and now enough people are living long enough to make it evident. This is classic confounding. While anecdote may be the first step in good hypothesis generation, it may also be hopelessly confounded by bias and other unmeasured variables. The only way to test whether this observation is valid is in a controlled study. In this case, a case controlled design with 1-n controls per case would seem appropriate. Until this is done, keep running. Low cal: Science in mice has shown this. Doing this study in humans is probably not ethical and has not been done to my knowledge. I personally eat 1200-1500 kcal/day base when trying to keep my weight down during running season. I spike the calories to match miles when running long weeks, but no more than necessary. I love food, am a big eater and a heck of a gormand, but I don't feel like I am missing out on life when I am keeping my cals low. I eat the same variety, just in smaller portions. But then again, my own experience is just a single anecdote. Yes
          Mile Collector


          Abs of Flabs

            "mile collector": what do you research?
            I did research in neurobiology a LONG time ago, more specifically neurogensis in the avian and mouse brains. I love that stuff, but found computer science a little easier.
            Mile Collector


            Abs of Flabs

              I agree completely with Kirsten about the squeaky wheel gets the grease. The style of the article is more like an editorial, and as such, it should be taken with a grain of salt. It's short on statistics (although there were some), and heavy on anecdotes: "One of my patients, at 50 years old, has been running several kilometers every day for years... she's no longer able to run even a hundred yards a day" This is misleading since it could be two years, or could be 30. The fact that he didn't provide an approximate number of years leads me to believe it's closer to two. As for seeing "hundreds of joggers and never a happy one", all I know is that when my club goes for the weekly tempo run, we all look happy as can be. Maybe he'll find more happy runners outside of the clinical setting?


              A Dance with Monkeys

                I think the author is right on. I'm never happy when jogging. I'm only happy when running! Cool
                  Dose the doctor really expect to see a jogger in his office without problems? I don't think so. So his statement that he has never seen a happy jogger maybe true, but not representitive of joggers ( runners) in general. A meaningless article.
                  Age is not an illusion
                    Could it be more t o do with the style of med practiced in Canada? My understanding, (I'll be correted if I am wrong) is that in Canada there is a long wait between requesting and appointment and actual seeing of the Doc. Thus it would lead to making whatever issue that prompted you to call the Doc worse I would think. Here in Indiana if I call for a Doc appointment I can be seen by him inside of 72 hours. Which means much less chance of me making it really bad.

                    To paraphrase an old poster: Today is the first day of the rest of your training. It doesn’t matter where you started or how far you’ve come. Today is the day. Your training didn’t start 6 weeks ago. Your training started the last time you hit the road. John “the Penguin” Bingham Life is not tried, it is merely survived if you're standing outside the fire

                      What do you get when you have 10 doctors in a room?? 14 opinions Dr. W. Gifford-Jones is the pen name of Ken Walker, MD. He's a weasel.
                        What do you get when you have 10 doctors in a room?? 14 opinions
                        Oh, my! That is PRECIOUS! BTW, you sure it's only 14? Wink

                        Roads were made for journeys...

                          Dose the doctor really expect to see a jogger in his office without problems? I don't think so. So his statement that he has never seen a happy jogger maybe true, but not representitive of joggers ( runners) in general. A meaningless article.
                          Honestly, other than the occasional physical, who goes to the doctor just to visit? You go because you have A PROBLEM!!! So yes, of course the joggers are injured when he sees them. So are the construction workers with the back pain, the receptionist with carpal tunnel, the hockey player with the broken teeth & nose. What a dumbass this guy is! Big grin
                          So do not get tired and stop trying. - Hebrews 12:3
                          vicentefrijole


                            Just gave it a read... not impressive, as you all noted, but at least it's giving us lots of great conversation! Another possible complicating factor: far more people are receiving joint (esp hip) replacement that ever before because doctors are finding ways to decrease the invasiveness of these procedures, decrease the recovery time, decrease the cost, and can perform them on older people than ever before. In the past, these procedures weren't available to many people (just the wealthy and the fast-healing youth)... now they're far more accessible to older and less-well insured patients... So is this increase in numbers of hip-replacements really a bad thing or a sign that medicine is serving the public better? Also, that comment about Vitamin C at the bottom of his column exposes this guy for the quack he really is... I seriously doubt that many people are developing degenerative knee or hip conditions because of Vitamin C deficiency (scurvy)... he's correct that our bodies don't produce it naturally... (that's why it's an essential nutrient.... duh) but it's got to be one of the most easily available vitamins...
                              Does anyone have any substantive information or can cite any studies on the long-term effects of running?
                              Here are a couple of article I use in my practice to refute the idea that running is “bad for your knees!” http://intmedweb.wfubmc.edu/grand_rounds/1998/osteoart.html#Is%20Running%20Associated%20with%20Degenerative%20Joint%20Disease? Check out the above link and “click” on the question “Is Running Associated with Degererative Joint Disease?” These may help also: http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/513027 http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/121/7/502
                                ttmalek, Here is a tip to help us use these web addresses better. Click on modify, highlight each web address separately and then click the link icon in the formatting list above. That way these will become live links that we can click on conveniently. Thanks! Also, in case anyone didn't see it, I did find the original article in question. Baby Boomers: Medical Problems Waiting To Happen

                                Discipline is never an end in itself, only a means to an end. (RF)

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