Why the Kenyans are so fast (Read 691 times)

jamezilla


Follower of Forrest

    I have no degree worth mentioning and I am not well read in 'expert' running theory.  We would never make progress if we did not question what we "know" so I appreciate that undertaking at some level by sportjester.  There are some things that make me question whether or not seeking an increased running efficiency through "inline running" is a worthy endeavor.

     

    Where does the 20% increase figure come from?  From what I have seen through this thread, this number comes from the measured efficiency of women who regularly carry heavy weights on their heads.  They maintained their 02 consumption rate while carrying 20% more weight (making them 20% more efficient).  Is this correct?  The question that you have answered and nobody else has is "how do they maintain this efficiency".  You have not really directly answered the question of how they do this, but from putting fragments together it seems like they (A) use less vertical leg lift and (B) walk in a very straight line.  I buy that these are ways to increase efficiency.  What I question is whether or not maximizing efficiency really can be translated into faster speed.  The study you site is an impressive example of converting efficiency into load bearing ability, but does not show that the same efficiency can be converted into speed (in the real world, not theoretically).

     

    Anecdotally, when I watched the NYC marathon, the women's winner Priscah Jeptoo seemed to have an obviously inefficient form, but still beat the field.  This was eye opening for me because I was holding stock in the idea that running form was a major component of speed, but this makes me question that whole idea.  Do you have good evidence that the most efficient runners are the fastest ones or that running efficiency has been successfully converted to an equivalent (or close to it) increase in speed?  That seems like the first piece of evidence I would need to see to buy into "inline running".

     

    Another issue I have with the 20% figure is...if Kenyan's are utilizing the secret to running 20% faster, then why aren't they running 20% faster best times?  They are faster overall but not anywhere near 20% faster.

    6/21 - Manitou's Revenge 54mi

     

    A man may never run the same trail twice for it is not the same trail and he is not the same man


     


    Interval Junkie --Nobby

      Anecdotally, when I watched the NYC marathon, the women's winner Priscah Jeptoo seemed to have an obviously inefficient form, but still beat the field. 

       

      Wasn't that incredible to watch.  She looked like she was put together by left-over parts that didn't quite fit.  I expected screws to start popping out and springs to fly loose at any moment.  The torque on her joints must be incredible.

      2014 Goals:  sub-3 Marathon 

      Current Status 08/28: Slowly working back up from a pelvic stress fracture.  4mil distance PR w00t!


      just a simple cat

        I looked up the Women's world records in track and field.  No Kenyans.

         

        Running is stupid

          I looked up the Women's world records in track and field.  No Kenyans.

           

          So you can't explain the women of Kenya.

          Well at least someone here is making relevance to the subject.

          JimR


             

            So you can't explain the women of Kenya.

             

            They're tiny.  20% of their weight is the equivalent of a coconut.

              I've seen Joan Benoit Samuelson run quite a few times and am always struck by how "funny" she runs.  Works for her!  I also run funny - doesn't work so well for me.

                 

                Wasn't that incredible to watch.  She looked like she was put together by left-over parts that didn't quite fit.  I expected screws to start popping out and springs to fly loose at any moment.  The torque on her joints must be incredible.

                 

                I swear my IT bands cringe every time I watch her run.

                  Do you have good evidence that the most efficient runners are the fastest ones or that running efficiency has been successfully converted to an equivalent (or close to it) increase in speed?  That seems like the first piece of evidence I would need to see to buy into "inline running".

                    

                   

                  Jamezilla,

                  This doesn't answers your question, but you may find this video interesting.  

                  The girl at the left (Mirinda Carfrae) was the 3rd fastest runner in Ironman Kona in '13.  Two men were faster than her 2:50 marathon.  

                  She's an inline runner.  From 1:05 through 1:25 or so, you'll see her running from the back.

                  In the 10 seconds or so prior to 1:05, you'll see the minimal arm action (relative to the lady at the right).

                   

                  FWIW, the girl at the right is the Olympic distance triathlete world champion (I think).  She may be faster, but I doubt she could go for 8 hours with that energy consumption.

                   

                  I know very little, but I agree with your "efficiency" versus "speed" questions.  I think there's certainly something to be made of overly efficient running for certain types of races. 

                   

                  Cheers,

                  2014 Goals:

                  #1: Do what I can do. <DOING>

                  #2: 365 Hours training <NOPE, INJURED>

                   

                  zonykel


                     

                    She's an inline runner.

                     

                    I have no idea what that means. As opposed to what? An online runner?

                       

                      I have no idea what that means. As opposed to what? An online runner?

                       

                      One thing I know for certain... Offline runners are 100% faster than online runners.

                       

                      Approve

                      The Plan (big parts)→  /// April:  Hampton, VA 24 Hour Run for Cancer (PR 80 Miles) ///  Nov:  New York Marathon  ///  Dec:  Seashore State Park 50K  ///  ∞

                         

                        I have no idea what that means. As opposed to what? An online runner?

                         

                        think of running on the solid white line of the road.  Both feet land on the line.  Fully 'inline' would have both feet landing in the center of the line.  It's like running on a balance beam.

                        2014 Goals:

                        #1: Do what I can do. <DOING>

                        #2: 365 Hours training <NOPE, INJURED>

                         


                        HobbyJogger & HobbyRacer

                          I looked up the Women's world records in track and field.  No Kenyans.

                           

                          Look at the KENYAN national track and field records. They're FULL OF Kenyans!

                          It's a 5k. It hurt like hell...then I tried to pick it up. The end.


                          Labrat

                            I finished the Atlanta half today over 20% faster than my previous run. (2010)

                             

                            I have 4 theories

                            1 I ran like an Ostrich

                            2 I was carrying goats at the weekend

                            3 I trained my ass off and am about 15 pounds lighter

                            4 I was injured in 2010.

                             

                            I will say a combination of 3 and 4 is the reality. (About half the difference due to each)

                            5K  23:21*  (Vdot 41.53)   10/13/12

                            10K  46:35  (Vdot 43.47)  10/4/14

                            HM 1:46:23 (Vdot 41.95) 11/9/13

                            FM 4:28:33 (Vdot 33.01) 11/12/11

                            *Gun time, all others are chip time

                            sport jester


                            Biomimeticist

                              Where does the 20% increase figure come from?  

                               

                              The 20% figure in running efficiency improvement is what would happen to any athlete from a historically shoe wearing culture were to learn how athletes who have never worn shoes actually run. I What I claim and do teach is simple; that if I put you on a treadmill and let you run at whatever speed and incline level you're comfortable with, that I can use that heart rate measure as my benchmark.

                               

                              That in approximately an hour to an hour and a half after instructing how ancient athletes actually ran, you can be returned to the treadmill and at the same speed and incline levels with an average 20% decrease in heart rate to achieve the identical power output.

                               

                              What you do with that energy savings is up to you; run further, or run faster. The choice is yours.

                               

                              And if you choose to run faster, then 20% improvement in speed is easily achieved. The speed is through decreasing the natural friction of the body in forward movement.

                               

                              Why run with an inline landing? Because every high speed running athlete, regardless to the number of legs they have, all make the same gait alteration either naturally, or by coaching. The modern shoe wearing athlete is the only exception to that speed development rule.

                               

                              The technique has been found in dinosaurs dating 163 million years ago and found in England and known as the Ardley trackways, the factual record of the genetic grandparent of Tyrannosaurus Rex, and the modern ostrich figured it out a long time ago.

                              http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v415/n6871/fig_tab/415494a_F1.html

                               

                              That humans documented to be faster than Usain Bolt utilized the same parallel gait to inline transition for peak speed was no coincidence. And that the inline technique was used, isn't even mentioned in any formal current speed extrapolation studies.

                              http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2005/12/21/1135032083655.html?from=top5

                               

                              The aborigines did it for the same reason Theropods do; maximizes stride length, a much more efficient application of tendon elasticity, elimination of lateral displacement forces, as well as increases ground force application through using stronger muscles to run than a conventional parallel leg swing runner does. How would such logic not apply to increase speed?

                               

                              What's the biomechanic advantage to the distance runner? The increased power generation comes by explanation that strength trainers will tell the modern athlete to do squat exercises if seeking to train the Gluteus Maximus. Conventional strength training describes the muscle as a torso stabilizer. T-Rex and the Aborigines aren't that stupid, given all of their power comes from using the gluteus Maximus as the source of power to run instead of the conventional reliance upon the quads as runners are taught.

                               

                              Galloping inline answers a much more logical approach to its functional explanation. Why would the strongest muscle in the human body, and attached to the femur, not be used to reach peak physical running speed????

                               

                              The biological difference between an inline gallop and parallel leg swing running is that the inline landing utilizes the gm for optimum power application, while a parallel leg swing runner simply can't...

                               

                              The primary advantage of energy conservation is that it reduces significantly the physical displacement variable to run. While most runners hit the ground with an impact force multiples of their bodyweight, in contrast, that while a crude measure, the runner on this video can run control the sound of belt impact merely by changing how she runs even up to completely silent in step clearly demonstrates the reduction in ground force an inline technique creates.

                              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qexXefs3F_s&feature=c4-overview&list=UU3l_gBpuAKDgVfO2aEhyo9Q=

                               

                              Or you can tell me the opposite, how would running inline slow you down if it doesn't speed you up?

                              Experts said the world is flat

                              Experts said that man would never fly

                              Experts said we'd never go to the moon

                               

                              Name me one of those "experts"...

                               

                              History never remembers the name of experts; just the innovators who had the guts to challenge and prove the "experts" wrong

                                I have no idea what you are saying here but you should join the holiday run streak. It's simple. 20% of those who choose to join will be faster. It's that easy. The choice is yours.

                                 

                                 

                                The 20% figure in running efficiency improvement is what would happen to any athlete from a historically shoe wearing culture were to learn how athletes who have never worn shoes actually run. I What I claim and do teach is simple; that if I put you on a treadmill and let you run at whatever speed and incline level you're comfortable with, that I can use that heart rate measure as my benchmark.

                                 

                                That in approximately an hour to an hour and a half after instructing how ancient athletes actually ran, you can be returned to the treadmill and at the same speed and incline levels with an average 20% decrease in heart rate to achieve the identical power output.

                                 

                                What you do with that energy savings is up to you; run further, or run faster. The choice is yours.

                                 

                                And if you choose to run faster, then 20% improvement in speed is easily achieved. The speed is through decreasing the natural friction of the body in forward movement.

                                 

                                Why run with an inline landing? Because every high speed running athlete, regardless to the number of legs they have, all make the same gait alteration either naturally, or by coaching. The modern shoe wearing athlete is the only exception to that speed development rule.

                                 

                                The technique has been found in dinosaurs dating 163 million years ago and found in England and known as the Ardley trackways, the factual record of the genetic grandparent of Tyrannosaurus Rex, and the modern ostrich figured it out a long time ago.

                                http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v415/n6871/fig_tab/415494a_F1.html

                                 

                                That humans documented to be faster than Usain Bolt utilized the same parallel gait to inline transition for peak speed was no coincidence. And that the inline technique was used, isn't even mentioned in any formal current speed extrapolation studies.

                                http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2005/12/21/1135032083655.html?from=top5

                                 

                                The aborigines did it for the same reason Theropods do; maximizes stride length, a much more efficient application of tendon elasticity, elimination of lateral displacement forces, as well as increases ground force application through using stronger muscles to run than a conventional parallel leg swing runner does. How would such logic not apply to increase speed?

                                 

                                What's the biomechanic advantage to the distance runner? The increased power generation comes by explanation that strength trainers will tell the modern athlete to do squat exercises if seeking to train the Gluteus Maximus. Conventional strength training describes the muscle as a torso stabilizer. T-Rex and the Aborigines aren't that stupid, given all of their power comes from using the gluteus Maximus as the source of power to run instead of the conventional reliance upon the quads as runners are taught.

                                 

                                Galloping inline answers a much more logical approach to its functional explanation. Why would the strongest muscle in the human body, and attached to the femur, not be used to reach peak physical running speed????

                                 

                                The biological difference between an inline gallop and parallel leg swing running is that the inline landing utilizes the gm for optimum power application, while a parallel leg swing runner simply can't...

                                 

                                The primary advantage of energy conservation is that it reduces significantly the physical displacement variable to run. While most runners hit the ground with an impact force multiples of their bodyweight, in contrast, that while a crude measure, the runner on this video can run control the sound of belt impact merely by changing how she runs even up to completely silent in step clearly demonstrates the reduction in ground force an inline technique creates.

                                http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qexXefs3F_s&feature=c4-overview&list=UU3l_gBpuAKDgVfO2aEhyo9Q=

                                 

                                Or you can tell me the opposite, how would running inline slow you down if it doesn't speed you up?