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Cholesterol and Statins (Read 167 times)


Feeling the growl again

    Most, if not all statins are patent expired. Generic versions are available cheaply, and not from the big pharmaceutical compsnies.

    I believe Crestor may be the only one still on patent.

     

    Generic makers are still pharmaceutical companies, and some of them are big.  Smile

    "If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does.  There's your pep talk for today.  Go Run." -- Slo_Hand

     


    Petco Run/Walk/Wag 5k

      >snip<

       

      Are there any runners out there who are taking statins and who find them ok? Or do they suffer mild side-effects which they figure are a price worth paying? I would like to hear from them.

       >snip<

       

      Direct answer, yes - I'm a runner who takes statins as well as many other heart, blood pressure, bladder, and stomach medications... Am currently on Atorvastatin (aka Lipitor) because Simvastatin interactions with other medications resulted in having to take such a low dose that numbers went up. I'd say I'm ok with taking them but then I was on them since mid 90's before I started running in 2008. In my case they did not prevent a 2008 heart attack but circumstances indicate nothing would have because of exposure to Agent Orange during two tours in Vietnam with Navy Seabees (65-67). The only side effect is having to give up Grapefruit which I grew up on! I thought about maybe one/week until I found out it accelerates absorption of statins for up to 4 days! To much for me to risk eating a formerly fav food!

       

      As to the fatigue your experiencing, not sure if statins contribute. I get fatigued but it's also known side effect from more than one of my meds. I do know that if I run in the morning it pushes the fatiguing feeling further into the day.

       

      Good luck! Keep us informed.

      bob e v
      2014 goals: keep on running! Is there anything more than that?

      Complete the last 3 races in the Austin Distance Challenge, Rogue 30k, 3M Half, Austin Full

      Break the 1000 mi barrier!

      History: blessed heart attack 3/15/2008; c25k july 2008 first 5k 10/26/2008 on 62nd birthday.

        I take them, a high-dose and I haven't had any issues whatsoever. The whole reason I started running was so I won't  have to take those stupid pills, but obviously have been unsuccessful in that. High cholesterol and diabetes run in my family, luckily I just have high cholesterol so far so I'm happy with that!


        Hobby Jogger Especial!

          I'm another one who does not believe in cholesterol medications.  If you have time, watch the Statin Nation documentary and/or read Cholesterol Clarity by Jimmy Moore.

           

          http://tv.greenmedinfo.com/the-great-cholesterol-cover-up-statin-nation-full-movie/


          Feeling the growl again

            It may be more useful to look at actual data on the subject rather than biased sources with an agenda.

             

            From what I can see, this Jimmy fellow is nothing but a blogger with no credentials or relevant experience whatsoever.  Why should someone take health advice from him?

             

            I'm another one who does not believe in cholesterol medications.  If you have time, watch the Statin Nation documentary and/or read Cholesterol Clarity by Jimmy Moore.

             

            http://tv.greenmedinfo.com/the-great-cholesterol-cover-up-statin-nation-full-movie/

            "If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does.  There's your pep talk for today.  Go Run." -- Slo_Hand

             


            Hobby Jogger Especial!

              It may be more useful to look at actual data on the subject rather than biased sources with an agenda.

               

              From what I can see, this Jimmy fellow is nothing but a blogger with no credentials or relevant experience whatsoever.  Why should someone take health advice from him?

               

               

              The book was also co-authored by Dr. Eric Westman and has numerous quotes and information from a wealth of medical doctors.


              Feeling the growl again

                 

                The book was also co-authored by Dr. Eric Westman and has numerous quotes and information from a wealth of medical doctors.

                 

                A blogger and a single doctor write a book and have the opportunity to selectively pick quotes supporting a biased position.  Why is this better evidence on which to base one's healthcare choices than the consensus recommendations of an entire panel of top cardiologists, who review and grade the strength of all supporting data?  This Dr. Westman does not appear to be certified in cardiology or a related specialty.

                 

                LINK

                "If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does.  There's your pep talk for today.  Go Run." -- Slo_Hand

                 


                Hobby Jogger Especial!

                  First, there is NO proof lowering your cholesterol with medication will help avoid heart disease.

                   

                  Second, check this out.  Many doctors, professors, professionals are saying cholesterol and saturated fat isn't the culprit in heart disease.

                   

                  http://www.abc.net.au/catalyst/heartofthematter/

                   

                  Here's the article:

                   

                  http://healthimpactnews.com/2013/abc-australia-exposes-cholesterol-lowering-statin-drug-scam-and-pharmaceutical-criminal-activity/

                   

                  Okay, so I don't have 50 links to scientific studies, but I believe statins are BAD. If you don't, that's okay, you have to choose what's right for you.

                  lap


                    I am  not a medical doctor, but I have read a bit in this area after my own experiences.

                     

                    I went on statins after I had a myocardial infarction (i.e., a heart attack).  My cholesterol levels went down after being on statins.  Of course, there are other confounders, but others who share my genes have had similar experiences with statins.  I have had no noticeable side effects, but those vary across individuals, as with most  drugs.

                     

                    And if you search hard for the grapefruit interactions, the evidence is not very compelling to me, unless one is eating 5 grapefruits a day or something like that.  Perhaps more recent research has uncovered larger effect sizes, but I'm skeptical.

                    2014 goals:
                    don't get injured


                    Feeling the growl again

                      First, there is NO proof lowering your cholesterol with medication will help avoid heart disease.

                       

                      Second, check this out.  Many doctors, professors, professionals are saying cholesterol and saturated fat isn't the culprit in heart disease.

                       

                      http://www.abc.net.au/catalyst/heartofthematter/

                       

                      Here's the article:

                       

                      http://healthimpactnews.com/2013/abc-australia-exposes-cholesterol-lowering-statin-drug-scam-and-pharmaceutical-criminal-activity/

                       

                      Okay, so I don't have 50 links to scientific studies, but I believe statins are BAD. If you don't, that's okay, you have to choose what's right for you.

                       

                      From your link:

                       News in Australia has done an incredible investigative report on cholesterol-lowering statin drugs, daring to expose organized crime in the pharmaceutical industry in the U.S. This is an area where no mainstream media outlet in the USA dares to go, due to the influence of the pharmaceutical industry.

                      In this excellent investigative documentary, cardiologists are interviewed to reveal the fraud of cholesterol-lowering statin drugs, and the criminal activity that has allowed this class of drug to become the best-selling class of drugs all-time.

                      After ABC Australia aired Part 1,  The Heart of the Matter, Australia’s top medicine safety expert, Emily Banks, urged ABC not to air the follow-up, because it might encourage people to go off their anti-cholesterol statin drugs. “If people stop using their statins . . . it’s very likely that it will result in death,” she said.

                       

                      Well, this is the sort of pseudo-information that I honestly find very annoying.  Australia's top official indicates that it is dangerous to scare people from going off their medication without a physician's guidance, and we are supposed to take the viewpoint of a self-aggrandizing, conspiracy theory-selling reporter over her?  I don't understand the logic here.

                       

                      As for your assertion that there is no proof that lowering cholesterol with statins reduces the risk of heart disease, let's just pull one of many, many such studies at random:

                      LINK - Figure 1, page 16.

                       

                      I'm curious why such data, of which there are volumes, are dismissed.  Perhaps you are parsing the meaning of the word "proof".  Proof is a strong word in any scientific field, but I have never seen someone scoff and a hazard ratio of 0.064 and a P value of 0.0005 as demonstrated in the above figure.

                       

                      There is just so much junk on the internet.  I don't mean to insult you personally at all, but when one has seen people who turned down treatment for their cancer that was 95-98% likelihood of cure because they read material from Suzanne Sommers on the internet telling them about alternative treatments and "secret cures" only to come back a year later with metastatic, incurable disease, one feels obligated to poke a stick in the eye of misinformation.

                       

                      If one doubts the treatment being recommended, ask your doctor for reliable sources of data to back up the prescribed treatment plan.  Go through reliable and impartial academic institutions for information.

                      "If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does.  There's your pep talk for today.  Go Run." -- Slo_Hand

                       

                          

                        There is just so much junk on the internet.  I don't mean to insult you personally at all, but when one has seen people who turned down treatment for their cancer that was 95-98% likelihood of cure because they read material from Suzanne Sommers on the internet telling them about alternative treatments and "secret cures" only to come back a year later with metastatic, incurable disease, one feels obligated to poke a stick in the eye of misinformation.

                         

                         

                        Suzanne Sommers? Ridiculous! Everyone knows the best medical information comes from Jenny McCarthy.

                        Dave


                        Feeling the growl again

                           

                          Suzanne Sommers? Ridiculous! Everyone knows the best medical information comes from Jenny McCarthy.

                           

                          IK;R???

                          "If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does.  There's your pep talk for today.  Go Run." -- Slo_Hand

                           

                            In any statistical study you need to look at who was being studied and how closely do you fit the profile.  So, looking at the original post they were putting him on statins as part of a standard treatment for diabetes.  I would ask what is the goal of the statins and can those goals be achieved by exercise and diet?  If they can, and I believe non-drug methods should be tried first, then why not?  There are many fewer side affects to diet and exercise then drugs.

                             

                            So for me, I was put on the highest dose of atorvistatin (80mg) and had been on them for week when my GP finally saw me.  I was experience muscle fatigue and soreness, so she immediately cut back the dose to 20mg and did additional tests.  My ALT level was nearly 7 times the high range of normal and AST levels were more then twice as high.  Turns out my cholesterol levels were already well below goals for people with heart disease (LDL  of 68 before the statins - 1.75 european) - WTF!  When my ALT and AST numbers got back to normal she wanted to put me on different statin and I flatly said no, none of the studies really apply to me and the one randomized study for my problem showed much less benefit to taking statins.  IIRC the randomized study showed a 20% reduction in repeat events, but that was 4 vs 4.9 for every hundred events.  20% improvement sounds like a big number, but an actual reduction of 1% doesn't sound nearly so good.

                             

                            Look at your condition, find the studies that were done for it with the treatment proposed.  Ask what the goal is and why.  Try to read and understand it, have the doctor explain it if they can.  What are the alternatives?  Inform yourself as best you can - it's your body and be honest with yourself and the doctor about what you can do to correct things.  Remember, doctors are people, they make mistakes too.

                             

                            my 2 cents anyway...


                            Ray

                             


                            Feeling the growl again

                              In any statistical study you need to look at who was being studied and how closely do you fit the profile.  So, looking at the original post they were putting him on statins as part of a standard treatment for diabetes.  I would ask what is the goal of the statins and can those goals be achieved by exercise and diet?  If they can, and I believe non-drug methods should be tried first, then why not?  There are many fewer side affects to diet and exercise then drugs.

                               

                              So for me, I was put on the highest dose of atorvistatin (80mg) and had been on them for week when my GP finally saw me.  I was experience muscle fatigue and soreness, so she immediately cut back the dose to 20mg and did additional tests.  My ALT level was nearly 7 times the high range of normal and AST levels were more then twice as high.  Turns out my cholesterol levels were already well below goals for people with heart disease (LDL  of 68 before the statins - 1.75 european) - WTF!  When my ALT and AST numbers got back to normal she wanted to put me on different statin and I flatly said no, none of the studies really apply to me and the one randomized study for my problem showed much less benefit to taking statins.  IIRC the randomized study showed a 20% reduction in repeat events, but that was 4 vs 4.9 for every hundred events.  20% improvement sounds like a big number, but an actual reduction of 1% doesn't sound nearly so good.

                               

                              Look at your condition, find the studies that were done for it with the treatment proposed.  Ask what the goal is and why.  Try to read and understand it, have the doctor explain it if they can.  What are the alternatives?  Inform yourself as best you can - it's your body and be honest with yourself and the doctor about what you can do to correct things.  Remember, doctors are people, they make mistakes too.

                               

                              my 2 cents anyway...

                               

                              Nice post.

                              "If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does.  There's your pep talk for today.  Go Run." -- Slo_Hand

                               

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