Hanson's Marathon Project (Read 2126 times)

Venomized


Drink up moho's!!

    Yeah the speed sessions and the strength sessions are running 3 miles at prescribed pace PLUS the warm up and cool down.  The book recommends a 1-2 mile warmup and cooldown.

     

    The first speed session is 12X400m with 400m recoveries.  3 miles at pace for the intervals, 3 miles of recovery plus another 2 - 4 miles in the warmup and cool down.  The final speed session is 3X1600m with I think 400m recoveries plus the WU & CD

     

    Tempos are actual marathon pace runs and they build to 10 miles in distance PLUS the WU & CD.


    I'm back!

      I am having a hard time with tempo = MP. To me tempo = LT, significantly faster than MP. Is there any LT work?

      onemile


        I am having a hard time with tempo = MP. To me tempo = LT, significantly faster than MP. Is there any LT work?

         

        There are 5k paced intervals and MP runs (what they call Tempo) for the first half of the plan and then in the second half, the 5k paced intervals are replaced with Strength intervals (which are MP-10 seconds).   In the book, they say this ends up being close to HMP, but for me it is 10 seconds per mile slower than HMP.


        I'm back!

          Huh. In Pfitzinger plans it is almost the other way around. The first half of the plan features a lot of LT work (slightly faster than HM pace), which is replaced with 5k-pace intervals in the second half.

            I'm using the purchased "20 Week 40-60 Miles Per Week" plan for the Shamrock in Virginia Beach, VA 03/17/13.  I'm liking it and think I should be able to maintain the paces.

            Venomized


            Drink up moho's!!

              For the strength workouts if you are targeting a 4:00 marathon then they prescribe a pace of 9 minute per mile so about what onemile is saying MP - 10 seconds.  But also the long runs are MP + 5% roughly where something like Pfitz will prescribe MP + 10 to 20% pace.

               

              The more I look at the plan the more I am convince you have to look at the whole week at 1 time as each of the individual run days does not jive with other plan conventions.

              onemile


                I'm using the purchased "20 Week 40-60 Miles Per Week" plan for the Shamrock in Virginia Beach, VA 03/17/13.  I'm liking it and think I should be able to maintain the paces.

                 

                How does that plan compare to the free advanced plan on the website?  Is the LR capped at 16?


                Was it all a dream?

                  I've had a good amount of success using the hanson's plan over the past couple years.  As Jeff pointed out, the whole 16mi long run is percentage based, with your long run ~20-25% of your weekly mileage.  If you are running 60mpw and covering 22mi during your LR, that's significantly weighting your training towards the long run.  Your risk of injury is higher and the recovery needed may compromise one or both of your weekly workouts.  The "short" long run allows for moderate mileage runner to put in sold efforts at the midweek tempo intervals and MP tempo.  If your weekly mileage increases to closer to 100mpw, 20-22mi on sunday becomes more reasonable. 

                  I'm in the business of misery...


                  Was it all a dream?

                    I am having a hard time with tempo = MP. To me tempo = LT, significantly faster than MP. Is there any LT work?

                     

                    The "tempo" runs are meant to prepare for goal race pace.  There's some tempo intervals (3 x 2mi, 3 x 5k, etc) that are closer to LT.

                    I'm in the business of misery...

                      How does that plan compare to the free advanced plan on the website?  Is the LR capped at 16?

                       

                      It has three 18 milers in it.  Remember, the idea is to not have the long run exceed 30% of the weekly mileage, so if the weekly mileage is 60 then 18 is right on.  Their higher mileage plans even have 20 mile long runs in them.

                      onemile


                        It has three 18 milers in it.  Remember, the idea is to not have the long run exceed 30% of the weekly mileage, so if the weekly mileage is 60 then 18 is right on.  Their higher mileage plans even have 20 mile long runs in them.

                         

                        That's interesting because in the book it tells you how to add mileage and they say DO NOT ADD MILES TO THE LR.  That is the last place to add mileage.  They suggest adding 2 miles to each easy run which brings the peak mileage up to 70 miles per week.   Or they suggest an easy run on the rest day or adding a longer WU/CD for the speedwork. But they specifically say not to add to the LR.  But that may just be because the 16 mile LR is sort of the signature of their plan - what makes it different than other plans.

                          20% of my projected 60 mpw that I'm planning on would only be a 12 miler!

                           

                          Also that was the first I heard that the long runs should be MP + 5%.  For me that's 30 to 45 seconds per mile faster than I was planning on running them.

                           

                          Lots more to this plan that the little chart in the runnersworld article.  I may have to break down and buy the book.

                          Age: 46 Weight: 200 Height: 6'2" (Goal weight 195)

                          Current PR's:  Mara 3:48:09; HM 1:43:26; 10K 43:59; 5K 21:27

                          onemile


                            20% of my projected 60 mpw that I'm planning on would only be a 12 miler!

                             

                            Also that was the first I heard that the long runs should be MP + 5%.  For me that's 30 to 45 seconds per mile faster than I was planning on running them.

                             

                            Lots more to this plan that the little chart in the runnersworld article.  I may have to break down and buy the book.

                             

                            The book is worth the $12.  Easy runs should be 1-2 minutes per mile slower than MP but the LR should be a little faster like Venom said.  The book tends to suggest 25% for the LR but they also explain that 2-2.5 hours of running is long enough to get the physiological benefits of the run without breaking you down for the rest of the workouts.

                              That's interesting because in the book it tells you how to add mileage and they say DO NOT ADD MILES TO THE LR.  That is the last place to add mileage.  They suggest adding 2 miles to each easy run which brings the peak mileage up to 70 miles per week.   Or they suggest an easy run on the rest day or adding a longer WU/CD for the speedwork. But they specifically say not to add to the LR.  But that may just be because the 16 mile LR is sort of the signature of their plan - what makes it different than other plans.

                               

                              Here is a quote from the purchased plan:

                               

                              "The simplest answer is that a 20 mile long run for
                              someone running 40 miles per week just doesn't make sense. It is agreed by most, that the
                              long run shouldn't exceed 30% of one's weekly mileage. Also, as a factor of time, a 20
                              mile run will pass the point of diminishing return. For example, if a runner runs 9:00 per
                              mile, then a 20 mile run would take 3 hours. For the most part, anything over 2.5 hours is
                              creating more damage than desirable training effect. Meanwhile, a 16 mile run at the
                              same pace is 2.4 hours, maximizing the desired training effect of long runs."

                              onemile


                                Here is a quote from the purchased plan:

                                 

                                "The simplest answer is that a 20 mile long run for
                                someone running 40 miles per week just doesn't make sense. It is agreed by most, that the
                                long run shouldn't exceed 30% of one's weekly mileage. Also, as a factor of time, a 20
                                mile run will pass the point of diminishing return. For example, if a runner runs 9:00 per
                                mile, then a 20 mile run would take 3 hours. For the most part, anything over 2.5 hours is
                                creating more damage than desirable training effect. Meanwhile, a 16 mile run at the
                                same pace is 2.4 hours, maximizing the desired training effect of long runs."

                                 

                                That sounds consistent with what they say in the book.