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Running as a bandit - can it be justified? (Read 449 times)

     

    Things paid for by your tax dollars which you are not allowed 24/7 access to:

    • High school tracks
    • Public roads blocked off by police (races, parades, etc)
    • Park areas with restricted access for events or even other reasons
    • The White House
    • Area 51

    In short, the argument that "my tax dollars paid for it" holds no water.  I have seen a couple drivers pulled over and ticketed by police working an event for deliberately navigating around barriers and driving onto road race courses.  Public entities are allowed to restrict access to property/facilities.

     

    Yeah, I knew my argument was pretty weak :-)  That pretty much reaffirms that banditing cannot be justified.

     

    Since I have just retired, and since that means less income, I really can't run every race I want to.  (Even a 5k for me and the wife is 80 bucks a week.)  Too much for me to be comfy with.   My solution:  Run less races, run more training runs.   But no banditing.

    The Plan (big parts)→  /// April:  Hampton, VA 24 Hour Run for Cancer (PR 80 Miles) ///  Nov:  New York Marathon  ///  Dec:  Seashore State Park 50K  ///  ∞

    DollarBill


      There's the poor college student living in Philly who bandited the Philly half a couple of years ago because he couldn't affort the fee.  Tried to not run over the finish line but the volunteers made him..   Also tried to tell them he didn't want a medal since he didn't pay for the race but they insisted on giving him one.  Yes this was my son.

        • High school tracks
        • Public roads blocked off by police (races, parades, etc)
        • Park areas with restricted access for events or even other reasons
        • The White House
        • Area 51

         

         

        Yeah, I knew my argument was pretty weak :-)  That pretty much reaffirms that banditing cannot be justified.

         

        Since I have just retired, and since that means less income, I really can't run every race I want to.  (Even a 5k for me and the wife is 80 bucks a week.)  Too much for me to be comfy with.   My solution:  Run less races, run more training runs.   But no banditing.

         

        No, your argument isn't that weak. There are National Security issues involved with restricting access to political and military installations. There are safety issues involved in restricting vehicle access access to certain parades and road races (not the vast majority of races in which I run, however). I bet if you wanted to join your average small- to mid-sized town parade on foot you would be welcomed. Macy's parade not so much. And, obviously, there are safety and public policy reasons to have limited access to places where children congregate, school grounds, etc. I don't see the same compelling arguments to an unrestricted or vehicle only restricted stretch of 3.1, 5, 6.2 mile stretch of road that hundreds of my fellow citizens are using to do essentially the same thing I want to do. Particularly if that is somewhere that you run frequently.

         

        But as I said earlier, I am agnostic about banditing. When I run a race, I run it to race. I want to compete with my peers and see the results. Hard to do that if you don't pay the entry fee. If one of my children or a friend wants me to pace them in a race, I would likely (but not definitely) do that without entering. That has happened once in my hobby jogger life (although I was supposed to pace EJ for the last 10 of one of his marathons back in 2008, but I was so beat after finishing the related half, I couldn't answer the bell), not so sure I will be pacing someone  ever again.

        RunnerJones


          I'm wondering how people define banditing, and I'm wondering this because of some recent races I've run (as a paid entrant) which used all or part of various local public multi-use trails.  It didn't appear that those trails were closed to non-racers, because I saw a few dog walkers, bikers, and joggers out along the course during these events.  Were these people "bandits"?  They mostly just appeared to be typical trail users who might not even have known, when heading out for their weekend workout, that a race was going to be held on their local trail.  I have no issue with that sort of "bandit".

          jimmyb


            The audience at Woodstock '69 was 50% bandits.

            Log    PRs

              I'm wondering how people define banditing, and I'm wondering this because of some recent races I've run (as a paid entrant) which used all or part of various local public multi-use trails.  It didn't appear that those trails were closed to non-racers, because I saw a few dog walkers, bikers, and joggers out along the course during these events.  Were these people "bandits"?  They mostly just appeared to be typical trail users who might not even have known, when heading out for their weekend workout, that a race was going to be held on their local trail.  I have no issue with that sort of "bandit".

              Trails usually remain open to the general public during races. You may find other trail users out there during a race. They are not bandits. They're just doing their thing. Some might be spectating and cheering people along or taking pictures to help describe the course / race for others.

              "So many people get stuck in the routine of life that their dreams waste away. This is about living the dream." - Cave Dog
              ShuffleFaster


                I'm wondering how people define banditing, and I'm wondering this because of some recent races I've run (as a paid entrant) which used all or part of various local public multi-use trails.  It didn't appear that those trails were closed to non-racers, because I saw a few dog walkers, bikers, and joggers out along the course during these events.  Were these people "bandits"?  They mostly just appeared to be typical trail users who might not even have known, when heading out for their weekend workout, that a race was going to be held on their local trail.  I have no issue with that sort of "bandit".

                 

                They are certainly not bandits as AK Trail has said.

                 

                However, I've been momentarily trapped behind bikers who insisted on using the trail during a local 10K that went along a narrow pathway.  While it was certainly their right to be there, I think I would have much rather have dealt with running bandits than these folks.

                ShuffleFaster


                   

                  Things paid for by your tax dollars which you are not allowed 24/7 access to:

                  • High school tracks
                  • Public roads blocked off by police (races, parades, etc)
                  • Park areas with restricted access for events or even other reasons
                  • The White House
                  • Area 51

                   

                   

                  Man, you can say that again.   We visited DC this year and went by the White House to take a look.  The closest you can get is outside the fence which is at least a couple football fields away.  Just cops and a bunch of people milling around on a sidewalk.  Understandable, but the current situation certainly belies the phrase, "The Peoples' House".

                  jimmyb


                     

                    Man, you can say that again.   We visited DC this year and went by the White House to take a look.  The closest you can get is outside the fence which is at least a couple football fields away.  Just cops and a bunch of people milling around on a sidewalk.  Understandable, but the current situation certainly belies the phrase, "The Peoples' House".

                     

                    Sort of liking seeing the Mona Lisa at the Louvre.

                    Log    PRs

                      The audience at Woodstock '69 was 50% bandits.

                       

                      --- I was there in 1994.  I initially paid, but the thing turned into such a fiasco that I ended up receiving a full refund.  I suppose I can thank the "bandits" who overran it in '94 for that occurrence :-)

                       

                      --- Also, three tries on woodstock, and three times overrun with bandits.  I doubt any organization would ever take on the task of trying it a 4th time.  IE.  "Woodstock" cannot be turned into a "corporate run" thing, and I find that to be excellent. :-)

                      The Plan (big parts)→  /// April:  Hampton, VA 24 Hour Run for Cancer (PR 80 Miles) ///  Nov:  New York Marathon  ///  Dec:  Seashore State Park 50K  ///  ∞

                        What about running the race and NOT making a donation to charity.  Giving to charity or not is irrelevant; you can't steal (insert item here)and give the equivalent amount of money to charity and feel justified.  You are stealing and giving away someone else's time and not your own.  I guess this is why we love Robin Hood

                         

                        Now as far as banditing goes IMO, just don't take any water along the course or impede a paying runner.  You are not getting a shirt, water, food and most importantly a time.  As long as you are not impeding other runners then you are stealing nothing so bandit away.

                         

                        By the way, how is it unsafe to run the course the day before???  I hate it when the trump card(word) "Saftey" is thrown out to end all logical conversation .  No one will argue against the word "saftey" regardless of the act truly being safe or not.

                        I've been thinking about this for a while, and I guess the recent discussion about RnR / CGI has prompted me to open a discussion

                         

                        I am sometimes tempted to run races as a bandit and give the corresponding entry fee to a charity, but I have trouble justifying this. What is to stop me from:

                         

                        - paying the race fee and at the same time making an equivalent donation to a charity (expense?)

                        - not running the race and making a donation (I like running races?)

                        - running the course the day before and making a donation (safety?)

                         

                        Every way you turn it, it seems to me I would be taking advantage of the work put in by the organizers without paying for it.

                         

                        And quid for the other runners, who have paid their dues?

                         

                        On the other hand, I am quite happy to be self-sufficient and run with my hydration belt and gels, so I am not really "taking" anything from the organizers (but I'm still benefiting)

                         

                        IAnd if a steward trys to stop me or a runner makes a comment due to the fact I don't have a bib number, perhaps I can leave them a small text printed on a business card-size piece of paper explaining what I am doing?

                         

                        Thoughts and comments?

                        JimR


                          By the way, how is it unsafe to run the course the day before??? 

                           

                          Road

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                          Runner

                          "thumpathumpathump"


                            --- Also, three tries on woodstock, and three times overrun with bandits.  I doubt any organization would ever take on the task of trying it a 4th time.  IE.  "Woodstock" cannot be turned into a "corporate run" thing, and I find that to be excellent. :-)

                             

                            Clearly  you have never been to Bonnaroo.

                               I hate it when the trump card(word) "Saftey" is thrown out to end all logical conversation .  No one will argue against the word "saftey" regardless of the act truly being safe or not.

                               

                              Men without hats will argue against this spelling. They were very explicit about it.

                              Come all you no-hopers, you jokers and rogues
                              We're on the road to nowhere, let's find out where it goes
                              JimR


                                 

                                Men without hats will argue against this spelling. They were very explicit about it.

                                 

                                I CAN DANCE IF I WANT TO!!! Angry

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