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How to treat skiing (Alpine) in context of training (Read 110 times)

Mrsducky


    Hello - I'm new!

     

    We're anxiously waiting for snow here in VT, but I am wondering how to integrate downhill skiing into a training regimen and avoid burnout.

     

    I finished training for (and raced) a half at the beginning of Oct. I've recovered and I'm back to basically general training - strength 2x week, tempo 1x week, 1 semi-long run, 1 trail run, and 1 med-length easy run (4-5 mi), plus some light XT.

     

    We're hoping to downhill once a week, and I'm also going to use XC ski as XT once a week.

     

    Last year skiing really killed my legs. I know I didn't recover well from each ski day or prepare well for ski season as a whole. I'm definitely prepared more this year, but how would you work skiing into your training schedule? What would you scale back on, speed or distance? or would you just treat skiing as XT and move on? I really want to be fresh come May, when I'm hoping to start training again for a trail race series, but I don't want to lose the gains I've worked hard for.

     

    Thanks for your input.


    day after day sameness

      Why scale back instead of add-on ?  Perhaps I'm not understanding...but you're going to add in a pretty small number of ski days or ski hours -- and other than core strength and quad endurance there isn't much correlation to running.

       

      Personally, I don't ski much lately but when I did, on the days I ski in the evening, I just move that day's run from after work to lunch time.  If I do a full day skiing on the weekend, then I usually do have to make that an off-day just for time.

       

      mta...I guess the above reaction assumes (even though you're in VT) that you're not skiing every day, or 12 - 16 hours every weekend for the full season.

      Choosing my words carefully has never been my strength I've been known to be vague and often pointless


      delicate flower

        Mount Snow season pass holder here.  Skiing will by my cross training day.  I really only get to ski Sundays most of the season due to DW's work schedule, so I ski Sunday and run most other days.  I had ACL surgery this past February, so I will be keeping the aggressiveness dialed way back this year.  As it is, I'm not cleared for skiing until January.  A full day of skiing at Mount Snow has no impact on my training schedule the rest of the week.

        proud sherpa


        Boston Strong in 2014!

          I don't ski often, but when I do, I also treat that as a "rest" day. However, your comment that skiing takes a toll on your legs is a concern. I'm a long-time intermediate level skier and will probably remain so, but I find that if my legs are sore it means that I'm doing something wrong and it's time for a tune-up lesson to get me back on track. On the other hand, if you are doing lots of moguls, then yeah, it will take a toll on the legs. I'd plan to follow that up with a recovery run instead of a quality run.

          2014 goals

          2000 miles; 5k < 24:30; HM < 1:56Century Bike Ride

           

          Upcoming:

          NYC Half Marathon 3/16Boston Marathon 4/21

            If you're advanced enough a skiier to really get a workout, I'd treat it as a long ruck march, but most people don't do long ruck marches. It also doesn't have the same continuous cardio that running or marching does, so it really isn't much except strength training as far as training. I'd do an easy (short & slow) run the day of skiing if you can find the time, and the long run day before or day after would be fine - just slow down the long run.  I'm assuming you're restricted on both skiing and long runs on the weekend there - no problem to do them on consecutive days.

            2013 Goal: Make 3:00:16 go away - FAIL.

            2014 Goal: Make 3:00:16 go away.

            Mrsducky


              Hm - some context: last winter was when I started seriously running, moving from run/walk to running, strength training, tempo runs, etc. It was also the first winter I was able to ski more than one weekend out of the year. I am a solid intermediate skier skill-wise, but I definitely did not have a solid fitness base going into the season. Some nice sheer faces can do a number on your quads. Smile Adding both sports in like that probably had a lot to do with feeling tired, now that I think about it.

               

              Your comments are reassuring - maybe this year will be different as I'm in better shape. Throwing in a recovery run sounds like a good idea though.

               

              The question about scaling back was specifically about quality workouts - related to wanting to be fresh for late April/May - I want to do a race series that begins in June. I was hoping to find a balance as I just finished training for my first major race (half marathon) so I don't want to overdo it too quickly - I'm still pretty fresh to running and figuring things out. I was hoping to use ski season to develop strength, primarily, and maintain my distance, to then bring speed workouts back in the spring to start racing again on stronger legs.

               

              Thanks for your feedback.

               

              Baboon - sorry about the surgery! feel better soon.

               

              jerseyrunner - heck no on the moguls. I like my knees!


              on my way to badass

                I've been a ski instructor (no big deal). Skiing to me is about the legs. Stand in your living room and squat down and stand back up. Do that 100 times and you get the feeling of going down a long steep run, perhaps such as at Stratton, top to bottom. A lot of Mt. Snow runs are more gradual, so they are more like squating half way down in your living room and holding that for a while before slowly standing back up.

                 

                This falls under cross-training as a rest day from running, doesn't it? But if no lift lines and you can make a lot of runs, one after another, then it can become more aerobic and probably replace a run day. If you go to Sugarbush and do runs like FIS, then it is pretty much aerobic no matter the lift lines. This assumes top to bottom skiing, and not stopping on the trail every other minute.

                Still waiting for the perfect race picture. 5K PR-35:38 , 10K PR 1:11:16 First HM 9/21/2014

                Mrsducky


                  StoneFence, I've not done FIS (that I can remember) but World Cup at Okemo sounds very similar. Very very fun run but I think my quads doubled in size that day after doing it! haha.

                  TripleBock


                    Cross Country skiing is great exercise -

                     

                    I live in WI - season pass to a little 700 vertical foot ski hill - 80 runs.  Skiing is a family thing and to fight boredom, my goal is to make as many turns as possible in a run - basically it looks like I am skiing moguls w/o moguls.  At the end of the day, my legs are very tired.  Last year I was trying to run @ 100 mile per week and ski weekends.  This did not go well.

                     

                    My rules would be

                    1)  Plan the week the best you can - If you are going to downhill ski Sat-Sun ... Run M-F, easy on Friday.

                    2)  Cross Country skiing is a nice aerobic cross training - No need to run and CC ski same day.

                    3)  Be flexible - Really tired on Monday ... run easy or skip Monday.

                    4)  Make sure to fit in some speed - do not just run easy every day

                    5)  Fit in a long run once in awhile

                    6)  Have fun and use this to maintain fitness, but build other strengths

                     

                    Hello - I'm new!

                     

                    We're anxiously waiting for snow here in VT, but I am wondering how to integrate downhill skiing into a training regimen and avoid burnout.

                     

                    I finished training for (and raced) a half at the beginning of Oct. I've recovered and I'm back to basically general training - strength 2x week, tempo 1x week, 1 semi-long run, 1 trail run, and 1 med-length easy run (4-5 mi), plus some light XT.

                     

                    We're hoping to downhill once a week, and I'm also going to use XC ski as XT once a week.

                     

                    Last year skiing really killed my legs. I know I didn't recover well from each ski day or prepare well for ski season as a whole. I'm definitely prepared more this year, but how would you work skiing into your training schedule? What would you scale back on, speed or distance? or would you just treat skiing as XT and move on? I really want to be fresh come May, when I'm hoping to start training again for a trail race series, but I don't want to lose the gains I've worked hard for.

                     

                    Thanks for your input.

                    I am fuller bodied than Dopplebock

                      Last winter, I skied about 30 days, which is the most I have ever skied.  This was also the first winter when I also tried to run.  I was only trying to run 25 MPW, but I found that skiing made it harder for me to get my runs in.  I ski fairly aggressively and my legs were shot after the first couple weekends of skiing. I generally took Monday off and sometimes Tuesday. As the season progressed, my legs got much stronger and needed less time to recover.  If we finished skiing by 4pm, on a Saturday, I would often do an easy run afterwards. I think it actually helped me recover.

                       

                      When ski season ended, I quickly ramped up my mileage to 40 MPW without any issues.  That is not a lot of miles for many people around here, but it was the most I had run in my life.  I think that the strength training I got from skiing (quads, core, etc.) helped me increase my mileage without injury.

                      2013 goals: 800m: 2:20 | mile: 4:59 | 5k: 18:59 | 10k: 39:59 | HM: 1:32 | Marathon: 3:20

                      TripleBock


                        Skiing helps to build all the smaller support muscles in knees and hips ~ My plan is to see what I can fit in and not use it as an excuse, but listen to my body.  I also add snowshoing and Classic CC skiing.

                         

                        Our ski area opens this weekend, we will go on Sunday ... It is ski season!

                         

                         

                        When ski season ended, I quickly ramped up my mileage to 40 MPW without any issues.  That is not a lot of miles for many people around here, but it was the most I had run in my life.  I think that the strength training I got from skiing (quads, core, etc.) helped me increase my mileage without injury.

                        I am fuller bodied than Dopplebock

                        ilanarama


                        Hi, Mom!

                          I ski once or twice a week all season.  I run daily unless I'm doing something else physical - like skiing.  I don't run and ski on the same day.

                          PRs: 10 1:12:59 (4/2014) 13.1 1:35:55 (10/2013) 26.2 3:23:31 (12/2013)

                          Next up: Durango Double 10/11-10/12, Deadhorse 50K (*gulp*) 10/18

                          bloggy stuff at http://ilanarama.dreamwidth.org


                          not lazy, just tired

                            I usually ski 3 or 4 times a week, but sometimes 5. I skied 64 days last season, 45 the year before (late start to the season, early end that year). I've tried to run after skiing, but it didn't work out great. I try to run most days I don't ski, generally with one day off to vegetate. At 60 yo I guess I just need a bit more time to recover. Anyway, for me, as much as I like running, it takes a back seat to skiing during the winter. Tomorrow will be the start of my ski season - can't wait!

                            Not if it makes sense.

                              Squats with weights once or twice a week will work wonders- not sure how you would work it into training schedule, maybe on an easy run day.

                              Nasreddin Hoja


                                Skiing affects my mileage.  My Wyoming trip in March, I ran 1 mile on the hotel tread before flying home, just to make sure there were no issues.  That was it.  Took me a couple of weeks after to move up to anything resembling a long run.  Get up before light, hurry to get in the first tracks, runs all day, hot tub dinner and crash.  Pretty much it.  Not much time for running to say nothing of will.

                                 

                                I like to take the sports one at a time.  Train for then run a winter half and fly off to go skiing.  Takes an extra day to work up to altitude though.  At Telluride, I barfed at 12,500ft after a night at 8,000, 3 days after a half.  Normally, I could've taken the 12,500 after a night at 8 np.

                                 

                                In September, I was blindsided by how wrecked I was after a day of seakayaking.  Not only killed the long run that week, but pulled down my overall mileage.  Just because you're not running, doesn't mean you're not working.

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