5k PR... lots of easy miles paid off

Ed4

Barefoot and happy

posted: 11/22/2007 at 11:39 PM

Several folks asked me to keep them updated on how my low heart rate training is working out. Today was my first race since I started a LHR program five months ago. I took about 1.5 minutes off my 5k and ran an 18:39. My easy running pace was initially about 10:00 min/mile, and it has gradually drifted down to about 8:45. I did all my running at this easy level of effort, except for four workouts over the past month, which I used just to remember my faster paces. So I was able to race well at 6:00 min/mile pace despite doing almost no training faster than 8:30. And I'm not really focused on the 5k distance anyway -- it's a fast race that would probably benefit a lot from some speedwork now that my base has improved. But I'm focused on a fast marathon, so I'm going to keep building base as long as my paces keep improving. Consistent miles are what really matters. By running easy I've been able to put in more miles without injury or burnout. I wish I figured this out sooner. Smile

Curious about running barefoot? Visit the ~~new~~ barefoot running group.

JohnnyDx

Into the wild

posted: 11/23/2007 at 3:40 AM

Hi Ed, I'm delighted to hear that. I'm in something of a base building stage too and recently committed to an ultra. As soon as I did that I started looking around at schedules and ideas that would get me to the start line in my best shape..they all pointed to getting the mileage in each week, generally achieved through 5 runs a week with very long, and long, mixed with various recovery/easy runs. The most important thing, it seems to me, is getting there injury free: I haven't time in my schedule for down time - this is made possible by dropping the pace. Oh, and nice PR Smile

Shut _up ^and _run

clhagan

posted: 11/23/2007 at 9:09 AM

Great job, congratulations!!

---- Cynthia

BadDawg

posted: 11/23/2007 at 10:03 AM

Quote from Ed4 on 11/22/2007 at 11:39 PM:

Consistent miles are what really matters. By running easy I've been able to put in more miles without injury or burnout. I wish I figured this out sooner.

A classic example of better late than never, and you've now shared your hard earned knowledge with billions of your fellow internet citizens. Now that's got to make you feel even better about your outstanding PR. Well done on all counts, congrats Ed!

E.J.
Greater Lowell Road Runners
Cry havoc and let slip the dawgs of war!

May the road rise to meet you, may the wind be always at your back, may the sun shine warm upon your SPF30, may the rains fall soft upon your sweat-wicking hat, and until you hit the finish line may The Flying Spaghetti Monster hold you in the hollow of His Noodly Appendage.

mikeymike

posted: 11/23/2007 at 10:23 AM

Nice work! Yup, easy miles work.

Runners run.

rvelich

Another Passion

posted: 11/23/2007 at 12:26 PM

Nice job, Ed. Quite a strange revelation... run slower to ultimately run faster. Works though, since you've tried it and it is proving to be true. Good luck with your continued training and goals.

Rick
"The will to win means nothing without the will to prepare." - Juma Ikangaa
"I wanna go fast." Ricky Bobby
runningforcassy.blogspot.com

zoom-zoom

Fanatic #3965

posted: 11/23/2007 at 12:50 PM

Sweet! Just as soon as Winter leaves I will be trying to really up my miles before my first marathon next Fall. I've definitely increased my own pace in the past year, and that's with minimal speedwork. But my miles are definitely higher. k

Kirsten

'07: 1324.5 | '08: 1561 | '09: 1810.9 run ~ 208.7 bike | '10: 1,000.3 run ~ 3513.5 bike | '11: 710.3 run ~ 4157.9 bike '12: 659.9 run ~ 3365.6 bike (100% benched by ortho last 4.5 weeks while in long-arm cast)

'13 Goals:

• DON'T BREAK ANYTHING!!!

• get within 5#s of 130#s (and stay there, gotdammit!)

• 1st olympic distance duathlon

• 1st Iceman Cometh mtn bike race

• Half Fanatic

• punch Type 1 in the junk

trishierunner

esq.

posted: 11/23/2007 at 3:20 PM

Consistent miles are what really matters. By running easy I've been able to put in more miles without injury or burnout.

I've noticed the same thing! Congrats on a great race and PR!

2009: BQ?

Bonkin

posted: 11/23/2007 at 3:38 PM

Nice PR! Thanks for the update, Ed. I've been thinking of trying a period of low HR training after my next marathon is done. Reading the positive results you and others (in the Low HR forum) have had are very encouraging.

Passion is a rather frightening thing because if you have passion you don't know where it will take you.

When it’s all said and done, will you have said more than you’ve done?

Eddy

Slow-smooth-fast

posted: 11/26/2007 at 7:19 AM

way to go ed, That is fantastic. I cant believe how well this has worked for you. I am lately back from injury. So let me get this clear, as I am going to start doing as you have done. How often do you run at this pace> and am I right it assuming it is at a pace that the heart rate is MAF?

"I've been following Eddy's improvement over the last two years on this site, and it's been pretty dang solid. Sure the weekly mileage has been up and down, but over the long haul he's getting out the door and has turned himself into quite a runner. He's only now just figuring out his potential. Consistency in running is measured in years, not weeks. And over the last couple of years, Eddy's made great strides" Jeff 14 Jan 2009

DrewEOB

Idiot

posted: 11/26/2007 at 9:24 AM

Ed, fantastic job. I've been looking forward to seeing how your training was going to work out. Looks good! Eddy, welcome back. Haven't seen you around in a while.

Yes, I do "run in this." So should you. The weather is never as bad as it seems from behind your office or car window.

jEfFgObLuE

More Cowbell!

posted: 11/26/2007 at 11:03 AM
modified: 11/26/2007 at 11:04 AM

Nice job Ed4! Big grin

I'm intrigued by the run slower go faster mantra, but I wonder about something. Anyone have an idea at what point it breaks down? By that, I mean there has to be a point at which you're not going to get any faster running slow. I suppose it's different for everyone based on their physical make-up and experience/aerobic base, as well as what distance your training for, but I have a hard time believing I will ever run 16:23 (5k) again, for example, without doing some serious speedwork. Anyone have an idea what the threshold for diminishing returns is for running lots of slow miles? (BTW, I know my current mileage definitely doesn't fall into the "lots of" category, so I know I'm not there yet.)

When you're on your deathbed, you won't be wishing that you'd spent more time at the office. But you will be wishing that you'd spent more time running. Because if you had, you wouldn't be on your deathbed.

Scout7

CPT Curmudgeon

posted: 11/26/2007 at 11:31 AM

Quote from jEfFgObLuE on 11/26/2007 at 11:03 AM:

Nice job Ed4! I'm intrigued by the run slower go faster mantra, but I wonder about something. Anyone have an idea at what point it breaks down? By that, I mean there has to be a point at which you're not going to get any faster running slow. I suppose it's different for everyone based on their physical make-up and experience/aerobic base, as well as what distance your training for, but I have a hard time believing I will ever run 16:23 (5k) again, for example, without doing some serious speedwork. Anyone have an idea what the threshold for diminishing returns is for running lots of slow miles? (BTW, I know my current mileage definitely doesn't fall into the "lots of" category, so I know I'm not there yet.)

There is a point, yes. That point will very for each individual. Regarding all mileage being slow, I think that's about as good an idea as all mileage being fast or hard. Balance in all things. The MAJORITY of miles should be easier, this is true. But not all of them. And I'm willing to bet that not all of Ed's miles were always "easy". Periodization is key. There is a time and place for everything. Regarding your 5k PR: yes, you will need speed work to get there. But there's a limit to how much intensity your body can physically handle. To get the most out of that intensity, you need to have a base of strong bones, muscles, and connective tissue, along with the cardiovascular and muscular adaptations that easier miles bring. Once you have that, I think the general consensus is somewhere between 8-12 weeks of greater intensity/speed work to produce the best results.

mikeymike

posted: 11/26/2007 at 11:34 AM

Jeff, I don't think it breaks down at a certain speed, but rather the returns diminish after a certain amount of time of training at a high level. Still, the limits of aerobic base building are measured in years (or decades) so most people will never get there. I bet you could run 16:23 again without any real speedwork, but it would take a sustained period of mileage you've not come close to in years, if ever. I bet I could too but I haven't figured out how to fit that much running into my regular life over the long haul yet--I may never. Also I don't think the message here is that you need to do no fast running, but rather that you need to do lots of easy running. If you look at the logs of just about any successful distance runner you'll see the same thing. Lots of running, with 80-90% of their weekly mileage at a relaxed and easy pace.

Runners run.

va

posted: 11/26/2007 at 11:36 AM

Congrats, Ed! jeffgoblue, Good question. I read the following recently... "Over time, however, you will get the maximum benefit possible from doing just aerobic training. At that point, after several months of seeing you pace get faster at your maximum aerobic heart rate, you will begin to slow down. This is the sign that if you want to continue to improve on your speed, it is time to go back to the high end interval anaerobic training one or two days/week." - Mark Allen on Heart Rate Training

5k PR... lots of easy miles paid off (Read 1918 times)

'13 Goals: