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Recovery Time - long runs (Read 1402 times)


Beware, batbear...

    I recently shifted long run strategy to go from running for a certain amount of time to running a prescribed distance.  Last week I ran a 12 mile long run (my longest by about a mile and half in this cycle) and it took three days to recover fully.  I'm wondering if there's any reason not to take NSAIDs or Aspirin if I'm still sore after 48 hours. 

    2014 Goal -- Run 5X per week, pain-free (relatively) by end of summer.


    Interval Junkie --Nobby

      I'd be interested to know how you know it took 3 days to fully recover.

       

      Regarding NSAIDs: 

      NSAIDs (Ibuprofen, Acetaminophen/Paracetamol) for runners, impairs healing and interferes with hydration

      If Fellrnr is to be believed, then you should lay off the NSAIDs completely during your training period -- but may have specific benefits in keeping you race-ready.

      2014 Goals:  sub-3 Marathon 

      Current Status 06/19: Pelvic stress-fracture = 6-weeks of no running.

      JML


        You may want to consider an ice bath after a long run as you increase your distance and duration.  This approach has served me well as I find that any residual soreness is gone the next day if I take a 10 minute ice bath immediately after a run.  You may also find (as I did) that your legs will acclimate as you build mileage over the long run to he point where muscle soreness is no longer an issue.    Good luck.

         2014 goals: run a bunch....race some.....repeat...


        Interval Junkie --Nobby

          You may want to consider an ice bath after a long run as you increase your distance and duration.  This approach has served me well as I find that any residual soreness is gone the next day if I take a 10 minute ice bath immediately after a run.  You may also find (as I did) that your legs will acclimate as you build mileage over the long run to he point where muscle soreness is no longer an issue.    Good luck.

           

          Also questionable: MYTH #7: ICE BATHS SPEED RECOVERY

          There was a better article on it in a recent RunningTimes, I think.  But I didn't find it easily.

          2014 Goals:  sub-3 Marathon 

          Current Status 06/19: Pelvic stress-fracture = 6-weeks of no running.

            Based on a quick perusal of your log, I'd say you need more running during the week to support a long run in the twelve-mile range. To support a twelve-mile long run, I would want to have my total weekly mileage somewhere in the 40-50 range. 

            It should be mathematical, but it's not.

              Based on a quick perusal of your log, I'd say you need more running during the week to support a long run in the twelve-mile range. To support a twelve-mile long run, I would want to have my total weekly mileage somewhere in the 40-50 range. 

               

              I think you nailed the problem ----

               

              If I were you, I'd probably cut the Long run back to about 8 miles and slowly increase my mileage on the daily runs.   Work your weekly mileage up slowly and as you increase and get comfortable with a more consistent weekly mileage, you will find you can more easily increase your long run...

               

              ALSO - what is your definition of recovery...are you simply tired and finding it hard to run or does something hurt??

              Champions are made when no one is watching

                Two day soreness is a definite sigh of overdoing it. I feel recovered after a very easy day Monday.  Also the first time I run over 10 miles in a season, I feel no way can I run for another 8 -10 miles. However, it did not get any worse as I increased the long run to 16-18 miles (2:30-2:50) the last 2 years I trained for a marathon.  No NSAIDS/painkillers ever for me as it can mask some injury and also delay recovery. A little pain is not a bad thing as long as it is not sharp and localized.  A dull ache tells me I am training and it's supposed to feel this way.

                 

                My plan this year, run 60-90 Minutes on Saturday and 2 hours on Sunday. Increase that to 90 minutes on Saturday followed by a 2:30-3:00 hour run Sunday, a midweek run of 70-90 minutes (maybe push the pace a bit the last 15-20 minutes, alternate week do a hill run) and run another couple of days for whatever duration/effort I can handle, that's a total of 40-45 miles. Not ideal, but is all I can do.

                 

                MTA, the point I am trying to say posting the plan is the long run is not going to be more than twice the length of any other run, and not more than 30-35% of my overall weekly mileage.  When it gets to the 40% range is when the recovery becomes an issue.

                  Here is a recent relevant RT article (alluded to by another poster above):

                   

                  http://runningtimes.com/Article.aspx?ArticleID=26720

                  - Joe

                  all running goals are under review by the executive committee.

                    Based on a quick perusal of your log, I'd say you need more running during the week to support a long run in the twelve-mile range. To support a twelve-mile long run, I would want to have my total weekly mileage somewhere in the 40-50 range. 

                     

                    This.  I run at least a 10-12 mile medium long run in addition to a 15+ long run the same week during marathon training.  I'm usually at the gym later that afternoon after the 10-12 miler taking an x-bike class and doing a core workout.  Once you started getting that mileage up, I think you'll see those 12 milers result in alot less stress on your body.


                    HobbyJogger & HobbyRacer

                      My legs feel kind of sore today, after doing what wasn't really a long run two days ago -- rather it was a medium run with a fast mile near the end, then a later medium run that evening.

                       

                      I'm not particularly worried about it, myself. I expect that I'd be less sore if I'd taken it easier & shorter yesterday.

                       

                      It is my suspicion that soreness varies not only with the surrounding exercise, but also how much rest & sleep one gets.

                       

                      But I'm no expert, just a guy who runs as a hobby, and does whatever he feels like.

                      It's a 5k. It hurt like hell...then I tried to pick it up. The end.

                      EliBuford


                        I'm probably about to crash hard for not taking a recovery day. On Saturday I did a 5k race. Sunday 10 mile long run which was way to fast because I finished in 1:06:04 (6:37 pace) and today we have a track workout. 

                          I'm probably about to crash hard for not taking a recovery day. On Saturday I did a 5k race. Sunday 10 mile long run which was way to fast because I finished in 1:06:04 (6:37 pace) and today we have a track workout. 

                           

                          I'm surprised your coach, now that CC practice has officially started in most schools,  hasn't put a stop to weekend 5ks.

                          It might be worthwhile to tell your coach...

                            There's sore and there's sore. I think that I have grown accustomed to a low-level degree of soreness as an adult runner that's pretty much omnipresent--at least when I am training hard. But the soreness and creakiness should disappear in the first 10-15 minutes of the run. 

                             

                            The soreness that I would worry about would be soreness that doesn't go away once you are warmed up. That could be indication of a mild strain. Even then, there's not much you can do about it except run very easy or rest a bit. I am not a big fan of NSAIDS for general soreness. It's good to know what your body feels like. 


                            The Runner Life

                              I forget where I read it, but I've heard that NSAID's can actually inhibit your ability to regenerate muscle tissue after long term use.  I would not steer clear of them unless absolutely necessary or else your long term running development could be impacted if it really does interfere with the muscles.

                                I'm surprised Trent hasn't dropped his NSAIDs rant yet:

                                 

                                 

                                < rant>

                                Pain.

                                or Dialysis. Forever.

                                I'll take pain.

                                -----------------------------------

                                Blood flows into your kidneys in arteries. The arteries branch smaller and smaller until they are tiny little arterioles. These deliver blood to the microscopic unit in the kidney responsible for making urine, called the glomerulus. Those arterioles delivering blood to the glomerulus are called afferent arterioles. Those collecting the blood out the other side are called efferent arterioles. There are several hormonal mechanisms for making sure that the pressure head on the blood is sufficient so that you make appropriate urine even when you are dehydrated.

                                Ibuprofen and other NSAIDs mess with the hormonal control over the arterioles and essentially causes the blood to stop flowing to the glomerulus. This can cause a sharp decrease in urine and in oxygen delivery to the kidneys. The latter can kill off kidney cells in great number.

                                The effect of NSAIDS is mitigated by adequate hydration. If you are dehydrated, the protection is gone and the effect of the NSAIDS on the hormonal control over your afferent arterioles is gone. You can cause substantial and permanent kidney damage. Bad.

                                When glomerular filtration is limited, your body may try several mechanisms to fix the problem using other hormonal systems. This combined with reduced renal function can cause a dangerous increase in potassium and a drop in your sodium. Also bad.

                                -----------------------------------

                                You never know the day that your ibuprofen or other NSAID you take while running will cause renal failure, and it is not wholly dependent on hydration.

                                The pain of marathoning and training can be expected. Why do you feel the need to stop that pain? Because you don't like it? Marathoning is supposed to hurt. I'm not talking about the pathologic pain of injury; if you have that, address the injury (rather than hiding it under some drug). I see way too many people in my practice and in the world who want to run but don't want to hurt while running. Sadly, it does not always work that way. Don't risk your health to hide the pain. Learn to accept it, to feel it flow through you, to guide you and teach you. Pain is not your enemy.

                                Jeff, a local RA member, a 2:35 marathoner and professional philosopher (really) once wrote this: "For me, racing is not about overcoming pain. It's about as running fast as I can. The pain is just the way the body speaks to you, a side phenomenon. It's silly to try to overcome it or attack it. We talk about the "pain" of running as if it were a single phenomenon. Actually, in running as in life there are many different sorts of pains, and one can learn to distinguish these pains in order to respond to them differently. It is very rare that generating the sensation of "pushing through it" is the appropriate response to pain. My sense is that generating that feeling is just layering one type of pain on another."

                                -----------------------------------

                                The standard nonprescription dose of motrin/ibuprofen/advil is 400 mg every 6 hours. Not 600 mg. Not 800. And certainly not 1000 mg. Sure, your doc may prescribe doses higher than 400 mg, but you are NOT your doctor (nor should you be, even if you are a doctor). The higher the dose, the greater the risk of injury to your kidneys, to your electrolytes and to your GI tract.

                                < /rant>

                                Runners run.

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