Goal of Sub-3 Hour Marathon (Read 15825 times)

    PS to all of you 1/2 marathoners. I only ran a 1:25:58 1/2 marathon before running (6 weeks later) a 2:56 marathon time - So I think anything 1:27 or under has a shot.
    Agree 100%. Back in 2000, when I ran my 2:58 my most recent half M time was only a 1:31, so never say never. However, the stars did line up for me for that marathon! I hope to be able to overcome a tougher course this time.
      PS to all of you 1/2 marathoners. I only ran a 1:25:58 1/2 marathon before running (6 weeks later) a 2:56 marathon time - So I think anything 1:27 or under has a shot.
      But you're not normal Wink
      Age 60 plus best times: 5k 19:00, 10k 38:35, 10m 1:05:30, HM 1:24:09, 30k 2:04:33
      DoppleBock


        Jim - What are you saying? Big grin But I do believe that a 1:26 half and high 39, low 40 10k gives you a good shot if you hit a good weather day and run a smart race. The other major factor is endurance - What Jim was refering to was that when I did it, I was running 90+ MPW. This allowed me to hold a pace much longer without haing as much relative speed.

        http://a-big-horse.blogspot.com/ 

        2013 Goals ~ Mar < 3:00, 5M < 29, 10k < 35  

         


        Right on Hereford...

          Dakota, I don't know if you were asking me about the taper, but I did include a light workout on Wednesday (4 x 800 plus 8 x 100 strides). Usually if I do something like that and follow with 3 very easy days I feel fully recovered for a Sunday race. That said, the taper can be a highly individual thing and would be a good topic for an entire thread. As I've said several times before, I don't respond well at all to an extreme taper or a lot rest days but I know of some runners who do. While I'm at it, I was impressed with the way you ran in Chicago half, especially considering the lower mileage you've run since I've known you from the forums. You have stepped it up a lot lately, so I don't want to take that away from you, but when you compare with many of us your mileage is still on the low side. It really does make a difference and there is a major cumulative effect after 2-3 years of it. At first I thought you were just a guy who didn't run a lot who had good natural speed. Now I see that you might actually be best at longer distances. Even though you are pushing 40 I see a lot of upside from here if you keep going with your recent trend of training more. No question you can break 3 hrs if you train for it, and probably with lots of room to spare if you train a lot.
          Jim, thanks for the comments. I know you're right that I don't run as much as the rest of you guys. Before this year, my excuse was that I was primarily a triathlete, so I had two other sports to train for as well. But this year (after my little girl arrived), I decided it would be easier to forget triathlons for a while and just focus on running. So...the upshot is that I no longer have any excuses not to increase my mileage! My current 40-45 mpw does represent a significant increase for me already, but I think I would like to get that up to 50-60 consistently. Hopefully that will help! Regarding whether I'm better at shorter or longer distances, I always thought I was best at 5k-10k, but my recent half marathon would indicate otherwise. But remember, the HM was at sea level, while most of my races are at altitude. That seems to make a huge difference! Bottom line, I really have no idea what distance is my "best" race distance. My wife, a former XC runner, did tell me when I started running that she thought I would turn out to be a marathoner. I didn't believe it then, but it seems more feasible now...
            Jim - What are you saying? Big grin But I do believe that a 1:26 half and high 39, low 40 10k gives you a good shot if you hit a good weather day and run a smart race. The other major factor is endurance - What Jim was refering to was that when I did it, I was running 90+ MPW. This allowed me to hold a pace much longer without haing as much relative speed.
            The miles really DO matter. Even though I've been running forever it still ceases to amaze me what a difference the mileage makes. It was only 2 years ago that I'd reach the 2 or 3 mile mark feeling the very same way I do now. I woudln't be struggling but became acutely aware that I was racing. It was just a matter of time before I would start to slow down. Now I can get that same feeling at 5 or 6 miles but continue on twice as far wtihout backing off. I might even speed up, even though I'm really tired. I don't panick and think, "oh no, I'm going to start slowing down". Not that I don't sometimes fade, but I don't assume anything unless it actually happens. That is the difference that mileage with plenty of threshold running makes. And compared to you, D Bock, I don't even run enough to make up a hard taper. If there was one thing I could do over again it would be to put in at least a few years of high mileage...like a 100 mpw or more. And one more thing...even amongst high-mileage runners there are very few who have as small a delta between short and long race times as you. When you factor in how damn big you are it is pretty remarkable. You have to be very efficient to say the least.
            Age 60 plus best times: 5k 19:00, 10k 38:35, 10m 1:05:30, HM 1:24:09, 30k 2:04:33
            DoppleBock


              Jim my goal for 2009 is to stop proving fat boys can run fast and kick off the 1st year of my Masters career (40 in Febraury) going after your 40s PRs - Why am I targeting your 40s PRs - Because thay are darn good and a fellow has to have goals. Today I ran 8 with 3x1 mile @ perceived LAT - It felt nice and smooth. I usually run 2 x 1 mile @ MP 3 days out of marathon, so this is an experiment. I usually go into a marathon feeling flat, which is not all bad as it keeps me slower and in control in the 1st few miles. My goal for Saturday is to ease out in 6:40-7:00 pace the 1st 2 miles and then if I feel decent - Lock in at 6:40 the 1st 20. I am hoping it feels fairly comfortable and I can run a fast last 10k. Of couse that will have to be adjusted for course conditions - My only worry is that the crushed limestone may be overly soft or muddy - then I will just run the whole race by feel. Weather forecast - Friday night low 46F / Saturday high of 63F cloudy 30% chance of rain. Headwind of 5-8 MPH. It all sounds very manageable.

              http://a-big-horse.blogspot.com/ 

              2013 Goals ~ Mar < 3:00, 5M < 29, 10k < 35  

               

                Jim, I would say you are definitely ready for a sub 3 hour marathon based on your awesome 1:24:09 half marathon performance last week! Congratulations.


                Slow-smooth-fast

                  JIM, put me down. I am doing the London Marathon, 26th April 2009. I would love to go sub 3, and will defo give it a good shot. I dont jnow how realisitic it is though, I have just recently broke 40 mins for 10k, but know that I have a lot of time left to get in the training. I need help though guys. When should I start marathon specific training? How do I know what exactly to do? I am someone who thrives of MAF running to get the miles in safely, and know that I could peak at some insane weekly mileage, like 80/90 miles. Would this help? Please help

                  "I've been following Eddy's improvement over the last two years on this site, and it's been pretty dang solid. Sure the weekly mileage has been up and down, but over the long haul he's getting out the door and has turned himself into quite a runner. He's only now just figuring out his potential. Consistency in running is measured in years, not weeks. And over the last couple of years, Eddy's made great strides" Jeff 14 Jan 2009

                    Ok Eddy. You are on the list. Good luck.
                    Age 60 plus best times: 5k 19:00, 10k 38:35, 10m 1:05:30, HM 1:24:09, 30k 2:04:33
                      ON DECK: busiman - 10/11/08 Hartford, Hartford CT Dopple Bock - 10/11/08 Whistle Stop, Ashland WI dcv2002 - 10/12/08 Chicago, Chicago Good luck to you guys this weekend. Looking forward to the reports.
                      Age 60 plus best times: 5k 19:00, 10k 38:35, 10m 1:05:30, HM 1:24:09, 30k 2:04:33
                      DoppleBock


                        JIM, put me down. I am doing the London Marathon, 26th April 2009. I would love to go sub 3, and will defo give it a good shot. I dont jnow how realisitic it is though, I have just recently broke 40 mins for 10k, but know that I have a lot of time left to get in the training. I need help though guys. When should I start marathon specific training? How do I know what exactly to do? I am someone who thrives of MAF running to get the miles in safely, and know that I could peak at some insane weekly mileage, like 80/90 miles. Would this help? Please help
                        Welcome aboard - Depends of what you mean by training - I like to keep up with a certain number of miles year round ... so "Training" usually means speed work. If you feel you want to build up to a higher mileage base then you are currently at ... You will need longer. Personally I like to have run a few months of the mileage I want to train at ... Mostly slow miles with maybe a moderate speed workout each week. Then I like 16 weeks to get my game face on. I would day you should decide what plan of training you are going to follow and back into the "Start" date. A decent course of action might be to build mileage until November 30th and Start an 19 week plan on December 1st. Many people seem to like Pfitzinger and Daniels. There are more plans than marathons. I personally like to do my own thing that incorporates some Daniels and Some Tinman (Therunzone.com) For the Marathon I like: Longer V02 max work (5x5 minutes) CV (Tinman) - 5x5 minutes. - either CV or Vo2 max in a week, not both Lots of LAT pace - 20-25 minutes a staple, but 5x2 mile and 25-20-15-10-5 minutes @ LAT with 5-4-3-2 minutes rest. Long progressive runs (Start slow and build to MP then finish with a couple @ LAT) Long Tempo runs (10 easy + 10-12 @ MP) and finally some just long slow runs What are you current average miles per week? Marathon expericence? What plans are you considering?

                        http://a-big-horse.blogspot.com/ 

                        2013 Goals ~ Mar < 3:00, 5M < 29, 10k < 35  

                         

                        DoppleBock


                          Jim - I am in the "on-deck circle" feeling confident are relaxed. Ready to stare down at my opponent and get a hit for our sub 3:00 team. Of course I realize that my most feared opponent is myself. Here's to Busiman, DCV2002 and myself - May we have fair seas and following winds! Let's all run a smart race, except a high level of pain, be safe and have fun!

                          http://a-big-horse.blogspot.com/ 

                          2013 Goals ~ Mar < 3:00, 5M < 29, 10k < 35  

                           


                          Slow-smooth-fast

                            Welcome aboard - Depends of what you mean by training - I like to keep up with a certain number of miles year round ... so "Training" usually means speed work. If you feel you want to build up to a higher mileage base then you are currently at ... You will need longer. Personally I like to have run a few months of the mileage I want to train at ... Mostly slow miles with maybe a moderate speed workout each week. Then I like 16 weeks to get my game face on. I would day you should decide what plan of training you are going to follow and back into the "Start" date. A decent course of action might be to build mileage until November 30th and Start an 19 week plan on December 1st. Many people seem to like Pfitzinger and Daniels. There are more plans than marathons. I personally like to do my own thing that incorporates some Daniels and Some Tinman (Therunzone.com) For the Marathon I like: Longer V02 max work (5x5 minutes) CV (Tinman) - 5x5 minutes. - either CV or Vo2 max in a week, not both Lots of LAT pace - 20-25 minutes a staple, but 5x2 mile and 25-20-15-10-5 minutes @ LAT with 5-4-3-2 minutes rest. Long progressive runs (Start slow and build to MP then finish with a couple @ LAT) Long Tempo runs (10 easy + 10-12 @ MP) and finally some just long slow runs What are you current average miles per week? Marathon expericence? What plans are you considering?
                            My experience is of just 10k s really. In the past when I have done MAF training I have had heavyish months - 250miles. My body can handle 70miles weeks. Just need some direction.

                            "I've been following Eddy's improvement over the last two years on this site, and it's been pretty dang solid. Sure the weekly mileage has been up and down, but over the long haul he's getting out the door and has turned himself into quite a runner. He's only now just figuring out his potential. Consistency in running is measured in years, not weeks. And over the last couple of years, Eddy's made great strides" Jeff 14 Jan 2009

                              Welcome to the sub-3 wannabes! I looked at your log and see lots of 40, 50 even 60 mile weeks but there always seems to be a 10, 15 or 20 mile week or two every month thrown in there. The best thing you can do is to eliminate those low mileage weeks starting now. Then later you can select a plan that you think fits you best and work it. Good luck and post on the thread.
                                Jim - I am in the "on-deck circle" feeling confident are relaxed. Ready to stare down at my opponent and get a hit for our sub 3:00 team. Of course I realize that my most feared opponent is myself. Here's to Busiman, DCV2002 and myself - May we have fair seas and following winds! Let's all run a smart race, except a high level of pain, be safe and have fun!
                                I know you came within a couple seconds recently (saw on KR thread), which in my mind makes you a heavy favorite to go sub-3 on Saturday. I realize that your sites are higher but hopefully you will continue to contribute after you run you 2:5xx this time.
                                Age 60 plus best times: 5k 19:00, 10k 38:35, 10m 1:05:30, HM 1:24:09, 30k 2:04:33