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| Weight Loss and Running (Read 841 times) |
| view log Ball Tongue |
posted: 5/8/2008 at 7:31 PM |
| Quote from Ennay on 5/8/2008 at 7:12 PM: If I eat very very very clean, never have a meal or snack without protein
That basically describes my diet in one sentence, but I always try to inlcude fiber as well. |
| The Gaijin Samurai. a.k.a The attorney dissin' attorney.
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| view log Its a New Season |
posted: 5/8/2008 at 7:32 PM |
| Quote from DJ Marcus on 5/8/2008 at 6:52 PM: I am still baffled. I am sure if I stopped lifting I would have lost weight these last few months. I have gained a lot of upper body muscle before and then lost it when I resumed significant running and ceased resistance training. I could smell that I was losing muscle too because my sweat smelled like ammonia.
In theory if I wanted to be a little faster I could reduce or cease resistance training and probably lose close to 10 pounds. But I don't race for a livning and DW really likes how I look now compared to before. Plus it took a lot of work to build what I have. My legs grow like weeds but my upper body grows as slow as glacial movement and takes a ton more work.
I'm quite a way behind you in training both in miles and weights. I agree there is a struggle about running performance and/or specific look. I say go with what your DW likes - it makes for a happy home as well as being healthy.
Being a former soccer player, it has taken some time to change leg shape and upper body chages for me are also glacial. I have noticed a change in quads and calves but it has taken more than three years. I also notice that my shots on goal don't have the same power Currently, I've been trying to build base so I can be a 40 mpw runner all of the time with the ability to push into 50 and more as I train for something specific. With our little kids, its hard to find the added time for more. I run at non-family hours now and ca't compromise this.
Additionally I am also looking to reduce the weight to get faster and be able to handle the increase in miles. Based on more miles and reduced portion sizes, I've been able to drop about .75 lbs per week since Jan 1. I still have lots of extra but will hit that area in about 2.5 months. Once there, I plan to add specific strength training for upper body and am interested in seeing what happens to my overall weight loss or gain.
Sorry for the long thread but this whole subject is very interesting as you hear lots of people running to drop weight but you hardly ever hear the discussion of what happens as you get fitter, faster and the weight at that point. |
Illegitimis non carborundum
2008 goals:
1) run a fall marathon (Indy)
2) stay injury free
3) PR 5K, 10K, HM & M
4) get my kids to start running with me
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| view log Ball Tongue |
posted: 5/8/2008 at 7:46 PM |
| Quote from CarmelRunner on 5/8/2008 at 7:32 PM:
Sorry for the long thread but this whole subject is very interesting as you hear lots of people running to drop weight but you hardly ever hear the discussion of what happens as you get fitter, faster and the weight at that point.
I agree this is interesting. Here is something to consider. After being very ill for a couple of years by May 2005 I was up to about 210. Not pretty. Started lifting 3 X per week with an hour of cardio everyday (no running). Also cleaned up diet. Actually I ate very little.
By November 2005 I was down to 160. In Spring of 2006 I started lifting heavy to build up the upper body. Got up to about 180 by Fall 2006, then spent the next 3 months losing the excess fat I had gained. By January 2007 I was down from 180 to 170, so I had gained about 10lbs of pure muscle.
Decided to go heavy again, got up to almost 200 by Fall 2007. Spent three months losing the extra fat.
So after two intentional growth phases I am 15 lbs heavier but it's all muscle and today I am leaner than I have ever been in my life. I have never had a six pack before, but do now at age 37.
It is very, very hard to gain only muscle. I learned this from bodybuilder friends who go through bulk phases followed by cutting phases to lose the extra fat gained with the muscle.
So my point is that once you strip yourself down of all extra weight, anything is possible when it comes to rebuilding your body if you do it correctly. |
| The Gaijin Samurai. a.k.a The attorney dissin' attorney.
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| view log Village Idiot |
posted: 5/8/2008 at 8:06 PM |
| Quote from CarmelRunner on 5/8/2008 at 5:47 PM:
I wonder if there isn't a limit to the weight loss/maintenance and body efficiency much like reaching the edge of an intergral solution. The elites don't seem to have much body fat left but I don't know their diets and Ultraman Dean K seems to have reached stability. Just curious since they a really the test lab for something like this.
I think this has to be true. I've been stuck at 130 for a few months, trying every plateau breaker (changing how I eat, calorie cycling, six meals, alternating the number of meals per day) and thimk I'm at my set point. I know the plateau is not for a lack of exercise, I burn about 3500 calories a week from cardio (it became too crazy to track the cross training in my running log, but I do about 6 hours of kickboxing, 2 hours of strength training, 3 hours of tennis and 1-2 hours on the bike a week on top of my running).
I'm at the point where I may abandon my 120lb goal and focusing on knocking my BMI down from 22.6% to about 18%, which means I will be adding in many more strength training sessions.
Marcus--with your experience, are there places you recommend to do focused strength training to build muscle mass? For me that seems to be the next logical step.
Chris |
| Chris
2008 goal: Consistent 25-30 mpw by Dec. 31.
5K PR: 29:58 (6/6/2008)
HM PR: First Race 9/21/2008
Running in the 2008 Philadelphia Distance Run (eep!)
My running blog--the Road to 13.1 |
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| view log Ball Tongue |
posted: 5/8/2008 at 8:19 PM
modified: 5/8/2008 at 8:20 PM |
| Quote from celiacChris on 5/8/2008 at 8:06 PM: Marcus--with your experience, are there places you recommend to do focused strength training to build muscle mass? For me that seems to be the next logical step.
Chris
First let me recommend you not get caught up in BMI numbers. If you're an athlete BMI is very misleading because it does not account for muscle mass. According to BMI standards I am overweight. Same would be true of almost every professional baseball and hockey player. BMI is a reference measurement for sedentary adults, not athletes.
With that said, you can build muscle anywhere you want. I got my wife to start lifting with me twice a week back in January. We keep it pretty simple: 3 sets of one exercise for every major muscle group. Since January she has lost 12 lbs and 6% body fat with no diet changes. I can't really see that she's any more muscular but she feels much firmer all around. To my eyes she is more toned, but not bigger per se.
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| The Gaijin Samurai. a.k.a The attorney dissin' attorney.
Read and Listen
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| view log |
posted: 5/8/2008 at 9:12 PM |
FWIW, I cannot 'easily' lose weight unless I am exercising almost everyday. My feet will not stand up to that kind of pounding so that means I don't lose weight until the nicer weather comes around and I can start biking. I lift weights in the winter to try to keep fat % down but my weight does not change (I convince myself any weight gain is muscle  )
I like my food and drink too much to do something drastic like reduce the intake. |
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mom2three view log |
posted: 5/8/2008 at 9:39 PM |
| This an interesting topic. But are we talking about the person who wants to loose 10lbs, or the person who wants to loose 60? I mean there is a dfference IMO. I'm trying to loose 60. I don't think my body would, anytime soon, set some sort of efficency standard for calories burned. I'm still a new runner so my milage is low anyhow. I can see this idea holding true for somebody who is already very fit, but wants to loose that x-extra amount of lbs. Would that sound about right? |
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| view log Funky Monkey |
posted: 5/8/2008 at 9:50 PM |
| Quote from milesoftrials on 5/8/2008 at 3:58 PM: he is burning the same 1185 calories.
Very well said, totally agree. |
| It's all fun and games until the flying monkeys attack. |
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| view log Hurdle the Dead |
posted: 5/8/2008 at 9:59 PM |
| Quote from DJ Marcus on 5/8/2008 at 6:52 PM: I am still baffled. I am sure if I stopped lifting I would have lost weight these last few months. I have gained a lot of upper body muscle before and then lost it when I resumed significant running and ceased resistance training. I could smell that I was losing muscle too because my sweat smelled like ammonia.
High-jack: how has the increased upper body mass and strength affected your running?
I recently realized that all of the running has left me a weak, flabby girlyman and I'm starting to lift again - and I'm wondering what's going to happen in 3 months or 6 months or a year. Are you slower? Faster? |
E-mail: JakeKnight2002@aol.com
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"The past is nothing but a series of recollections; it does not own you ... if we are prisoners of the past, we are jailer as well."
~~ Jack Kerley, The Hundredth Man
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| view log Ball Tongue |
posted: 5/8/2008 at 10:09 PM |
| Quote from JakeKnight on 5/8/2008 at 9:59 PM: High-jack: how has the increased upper body mass and strength affected your running?
I recently realized that all of the running has left me a weak, flabby girlyman and I'm starting to lift again - and I'm wondering what's going to happen in 3 months or 6 months or a year. Are you slower? Faster?
Tough question to answer because I don't have a string of race results from the last 3 years to compare.
Simple physics would say I should be slower if I weigh more. I might be able to be as fast as I was 10 years and 15 lbs ago, but only because I train smarter than I used to.
But like I already wrote, I don't get paid to race so I am not obsessed with times.
At our age...it's all about how we look nekid.  |
| The Gaijin Samurai. a.k.a The attorney dissin' attorney.
Read and Listen
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| view log Bif! Bam! Pow! |
posted: 5/8/2008 at 11:43 PM |
| Quote from DJ Marcus on 5/8/2008 at 7:31 PM: That basically describes my diet in one sentence, but I always try to inlcude fiber as well.
Oh yeah I get about 40 or so grams of fiber a day. Clean as a whistle. 
I am working on that upper bodys strength but not getting very far. |
Beware the Pink Boxing Gloves of DOOM!
"It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds" - Captain Hammer
2008 Goals New PR's in 5K 10K HM, M
Faster than a speeding toddler..... |
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| view log |
posted: 5/9/2008 at 1:54 AM |
| Quote from DJ Marcus on 5/8/2008 at 7:46 PM: I agree this is interesting. Here is something to consider. After being very ill for a couple of years by May 2005 I was up to about 210. Not pretty. Started lifting 3 X per week with an hour of cardio everyday (no running). Also cleaned up diet. Actually I ate very little.
By November 2005 I was down to 160. In Spring of 2006 I started lifting heavy to build up the upper body. Got up to about 180 by Fall 2006, then spent the next 3 months losing the excess fat I had gained. By January 2007 I was down from 180 to 170, so I had gained about 10lbs of pure muscle.
Decided to go heavy again, got up to almost 200 by Fall 2007. Spent three months losing the extra fat.
So after two intentional growth phases I am 15 lbs heavier but it's all muscle and today I am leaner than I have ever been in my life. I have never had a six pack before, but do now at age 37.
Marcus,
You hit legs at all? |
| I ran. I ran until my muscles burned and my veins pumped battery acid. Then I ran some more. |
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| view log Ball Tongue |
posted: 5/9/2008 at 2:01 AM |
| Quote from Chaloo on 5/9/2008 at 1:54 AM: Marcus,
You hit legs at all?
I will be now to avoid knee injuries (per my physical therapist). But it won't be real heavy squatting and leg presses like in the past. My legs are big enough. |
| The Gaijin Samurai. a.k.a The attorney dissin' attorney.
Read and Listen
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| view log |
posted: 5/9/2008 at 5:33 AM |
Quote from DJ Marcus on 5/8/2008 at 6:21 PM:I can't imagine any woman's genetic set-point is 170, well unless she's 6'5".
Of course there's probably a bell curve of set points for women of a given height.
I'm very familiar with a woman whose "set point" was in the 170s at 6'3" at age 25.
... Just run a lot, eat only when hungry, and eat only until you're no longer hungry. Never eat until full.
Always worked for me, but the runs had to be over 40 - 45 minutes and at a comfortable pace ...
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| view log Village Idiot |
posted: 5/9/2008 at 10:14 AM |
| Quote from mom2three on 5/8/2008 at 9:39 PM: This an interesting topic. But are we talking about the person who wants to loose 10lbs, or the person who wants to loose 60? I mean there is a dfference IMO. I'm trying to loose 60. I don't think my body would, anytime soon, set some sort of efficency standard for calories burned. I'm still a new runner so my milage is low anyhow. I can see this idea holding true for somebody who is already very fit, but wants to loose that x-extra amount of lbs. Would that sound about right?
Good point. I'm on the last 10 lbs of a 50 lb journey (40 down). Running was very effective for me for the first 20 or so, the next 20 I had to add some cross training to maintain the pattern of losses (as well as sensible eating), and now I'm stuck, so strength training is the next logical step for me.
A lot of people on my weight loss website use running as a key component of their plan, so you should be golden for several months before hitting a serious plateau, which I think is explained well by the efficiency discussion. At least that's my experience.
Chris |
| Chris
2008 goal: Consistent 25-30 mpw by Dec. 31.
5K PR: 29:58 (6/6/2008)
HM PR: First Race 9/21/2008
Running in the 2008 Philadelphia Distance Run (eep!)
My running blog--the Road to 13.1 |
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