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Fluid Replacement Drinks??? (Read 1057 times)

    Can I get some input from some of the more experienced people as to what you would recommend as a fluid replacement drink. One with lots of electrolytes and trace minerals that is good to drink after a long run or just a good sweaty workout. Rich


    A Dance with Monkeys

      There is tons and tons of science and opinion on this. But in the end, it is all about taste. Whatever you prefer to drink is what you should drink. Unless you are training for a race, in which case you need to get used to the drink they have on the course.
        I understand that every individual has specific likes and dislikes. What I want to know is which drinks are nonsense and which are the better ones with good amounts of electrolytes and trace minerals. Rich


        A Dance with Monkeys

          That is exactly my point. What you need is a fluid with carbs, fluid and sodium. All the other electrolytes, trace minerals, etc, are not likely to make much of a difference, especially after a run. Sure, some have all this wacky stuff (molybdenum?!?), but what you need most are carbs, fluid and sodium. Maybe some potassium and magnesium, but even that is pushing it. After an exertion, you need protein, but you don't need to get that in a drink (since it is often unpalatable). The most important thing is to find a drink that you like, so that when you get it you get the carbs, fluid and sodium. Drinks that try to sell themselves on the basis of all sorts of weird electrolytes and trace elements, etc? That, my friend, is nonsense. Me, I like a good Coke or a beer after a run. They have all the things you need. Yes, I am serious.
          vicentefrijole


            Just so Trent doesn't sound like the lone psycho Wink , I'd have to agree with what he's saying. IMO fluid replacement drinks, like most sports products, are 2% science and 98% advertising/image. Which part do you suppose makes them so expensive? Big grin But I like the taste of gatorade (especially really watered-down gatorade) more than anything after a hard workout! Yes


            A Dance with Monkeys

              Basically, you need to replace two things you lose while running: sweat and calories. Sweat contains water and sodium chloride (i.e., salt) and very little else. Calories need to be replaced as carbs. Protein helps your muscles recover AFTER the run, so you don't really need it DURING the run. It is safe to run dry and to stay dry after the run. It is less safe to overhydrate. Most sports drinks contain a higher ratio of water to salt than sweat contains, so if you drink too much, you actually get too much water. For example, Gatorade Endurance Formula contains approximately twice the amount of sodium (200 mg/per 8 oz) of Gatorade Thirst Quencher to help meet the needs of athletes during prolonged exercise. 200 mg of sodium ~ 500 mg of salt. As before, there are 2200 - 3400 mg of salt per liter of sweat. Eight oz of fluid = 0.24 liters, and one liter is about 34 oz, or 4 1/4 x 8oz bottles. A liter of Gatorade Endurance, therefore, contains about 2125 mg of sodium, which is nearly within the range of sweat sodium concentration. Most sports drinks resemble standard Gatorade, so they have a lower amount of salt. But the lower amount of salt is only a problem if you drink too much over a sustained period. This can lead to a condition called hyponatremia. As I have previously posted: hyponatremia is a serious disease that merits watching out for. Hyponatremia is a condition in which you dilute your blood salt (sodium) with too much liquid, and it can be fatal (probably fewer than 1 marathoner dies every year from this). Fluids like gatorade and ultima still have far less salt than sweat, so drinking the same amound as you sweat can still dilute your blood. When extreme, hyponatremia causes weakness, hallucinations, lightheadedness and vomiting. Notice that these, except vomiting, are all the same symptoms as you would get with dehydration and with hypoglycemia. In a recent study in the New England Journal of Medicine, researchers found: On univariate analyses, hyponatremia was associated with substantial weight gain, consumption of more than 3 liters of fluids during the race, consumption of fluids every mile, a racing time of >4:00 hours, female sex, and low body-mass index. On multivariate analysis, hyponatremia was associated with weight gain (odds ratio, 4.2; 95 percent confidence interval, 2.2 to 8.2), a racing time of >4:00 hours (odds ratio for the comparison with a time of over 3:30 hours, 7.4; 95 percent confidence interval, 2.9 to 23.1), and body-mass-index extremes. (N Engl J Med. 2005 Apr 14;352(15):1550-6.) That means, the risk factors for hyponatremia include 1. a marathon time > 4 hours (compared to time < 3:30) 2. being too big or too small, 3. being female, 4. drinking over 3 liters of fluids during the run, 5. gaining weight during the run. the researchers did not specifically look at the effect of ambient temperature, salt intake in the days leading up to the marathon, or whether drinking too much in the days leading up to the marathon contributed, but their study was performed on a hot day. remember, 3 liters is nearly a gallon; the cups at the marathon were all about 4-5 ounces full. there are 128 ounces in a gallon. that means you would need to have drunk about 25 cups of fluid in the 10 aid stations to have gotten just that one risk factor. some experts suggest weighing yourself before every marathon and writing your weight on your race tag; that way if you pass out the medics can weigh you. given the variation in scales i do not know if this would actually be useful. folks with hyponatremia have too much fluid on board, so they pee clear urine frequently. folks who pee infrequently and who have darker urine likely do not have hyponatremia. *** all that said, what you basically need are carbs, fluid and salt. all the rest is unnecessary. by and large, taste should be your guide. 3:30)="" 2.="" being="" too="" big="" or="" too="" small,="" 3.="" being="" female,="" 4.="" drinking="" over="" 3="" liters="" of="" fluids="" during="" the="" run,="" 5.="" gaining="" weight="" during="" the="" run.="" the="" researchers="" did="" not="" specifically="" look="" at="" the="" effect="" of="" ambient="" temperature,="" salt="" intake="" in="" the="" days="" leading="" up="" to="" the="" marathon,="" or="" whether="" drinking="" too="" much="" in="" the="" days="" leading="" up="" to="" the="" marathon="" contributed,="" but="" their="" study="" was="" performed="" on="" a="" hot="" day.="" remember,="" 3="" liters="" is="" nearly="" a="" gallon;="" the="" cups="" at="" the="" marathon="" were="" all="" about="" 4-5="" ounces="" full.="" there="" are="" 128="" ounces="" in="" a="" gallon.="" that="" means="" you="" would="" need="" to="" have="" drunk="" about="" 25="" cups="" of="" fluid="" in="" the="" 10="" aid="" stations="" to="" have="" gotten="" just="" that="" one="" risk="" factor.="" some="" experts="" suggest="" weighing="" yourself="" before="" every="" marathon="" and="" writing="" your="" weight="" on="" your="" race="" tag;="" that="" way="" if="" you="" pass="" out="" the="" medics="" can="" weigh="" you.="" given="" the="" variation="" in="" scales="" i="" do="" not="" know="" if="" this="" would="" actually="" be="" useful.="" folks="" with="" hyponatremia="" have="" too="" much="" fluid="" on="" board,="" so="" they="" pee="" clear="" urine="" frequently.="" folks="" who="" pee="" infrequently="" and="" who="" have="" darker="" urine="" likely="" do="" not="" have="" hyponatremia.="" ***="" all="" that="" said,="" what="" you="" basically="" need="" are="" carbs,="" fluid="" and="" salt.="" all="" the="" rest="" is="" unnecessary.="" by="" and="" large,="" taste="" should="" be="" your="" guide.=""></ 3:30) 2. being too big or too small, 3. being female, 4. drinking over 3 liters of fluids during the run, 5. gaining weight during the run. the researchers did not specifically look at the effect of ambient temperature, salt intake in the days leading up to the marathon, or whether drinking too much in the days leading up to the marathon contributed, but their study was performed on a hot day. remember, 3 liters is nearly a gallon; the cups at the marathon were all about 4-5 ounces full. there are 128 ounces in a gallon. that means you would need to have drunk about 25 cups of fluid in the 10 aid stations to have gotten just that one risk factor. some experts suggest weighing yourself before every marathon and writing your weight on your race tag; that way if you pass out the medics can weigh you. given the variation in scales i do not know if this would actually be useful. folks with hyponatremia have too much fluid on board, so they pee clear urine frequently. folks who pee infrequently and who have darker urine likely do not have hyponatremia. *** all that said, what you basically need are carbs, fluid and salt. all the rest is unnecessary. by and large, taste should be your guide. >


              Needs more cowbell!

                But I like the taste of gatorade (especially really watered-down gatorade) more than anything after a hard workout! Yes
                Me too...during long runs, as well. The straight stuff tends to make me queasy, also. Another thing to try is Endurolyte capsules with the beverage of your choice. k

                I shoot pretty things! ~

                '14 Goals:

                • 2 olympic distance duathlons -- 6 days apart -- PR at least 1

                • 130#s (and stay there, gotdammit!)

                Scout7


                CPT Curmudgeon

                  If you're talking about after a workout, I know people who swear by chocolate milk. I prefer the Carnation Instant Breakfast, myself. It's got protein, carbs, everything you need. I've made my own sports drink for during workouts. It was sugar, some salt, and some lemon juice, mixed with water. Got the recipe online, I have a link somewhere.....Here: http://www.dissidents.com/articles/sportsdrink.htm
                    Check out 'e load': http://www.eload.net/eHome.htm Not sure if it is widely available in the US, but can be found in most running specialty shops here in Canada (i.e., Running Room, etc.). This stuff is gold. It comes in two flavours: lemon and strawberry and has just enough flavour to be tasty, but doesn't get syrupy in the heat like other drinks. On the right hand side of the website you can see how it stacks up against: Gatorade (Thirst Quencher, Endurance Formula), Cytomax Energy Drink, Accelerade, Hammer HEED, GU20, Cliff Shot Electrolyte, etc. I can't say enough about this product. Try it. You won't be disappointed.
                      Drinks that try to sell themselves on the basis of all sorts of weird electrolytes and trace elements, etc? That, my friend, is nonsense. Me, I like a good Coke or a beer after a run. They have all the things you need. Yes, I am serious.
                      I agree 100% with Trent and Vincente, especially the above quote and the bit about marketing. And Trent's not kidding about the beer. I'm not sure what it is, maybe some specific mix of sodium and carbs, but I crave it after a marathon like nothing else, and in the last 10 miles, taking a few swallows gives me a boost that Gatorade can't touch. No joke - I'm seriously considering filling a bottle on my fuel belt with beer for my next marathon. I'd be curious to compare the actual components of a beer (maybe non-alcoholic) to the average sports drink. Modified to add: in fact, Trent, one of the few improvements that could be made to the Monkeython would be a beer offering at that aid station near mile 21-22. With that and a roaring bonfire at the end, and you'd have perfection. No, wait, add the beer, the roaring bonfire, and the Dallas Cowboy cheerleaders waiting at the finish line ... THEN you'd have perfection. You're so close.
                      E-mail: JakeKnight2002@aol.com
                      -----------------------------


                      A Dance with Monkeys

                        I agree 100% with Trent
                        Crap. JN, there WAS beer on the course, I understand. It was even forbidden, which added to the appeal. Big grin After enough beer, even the monkeys look like cheerleaders in a bonfire. Wait. What was the question?
                        Scout7


                        CPT Curmudgeon

                          Modified to add: in fact, Trent, one of the few improvements that could be made to the Monkeython would be a beer offering at that aid station near mile 21-22. With that and a roaring bonfire at the end, and you'd have perfection. No, wait, add the beer, the roaring bonfire, and the Dallas Cowboy cheerleaders waiting at the finish line ... THEN you'd have perfection. You're so close.
                          I can't promise fire or cheerleaders (unless you bring your own), but there are a number of trail runs here near Philly that have a tendency to serve..."alternative beverages" at certain water stops. Doing one on the 21st, in fact. Best part: The location of the finish line is right at the German social club, which will be pouring for minimal fee. If you wanna do an ultra, there's the Blues Cruise 50k. The one stop is Margaritaville.


                          A Dance with Monkeys

                            When I finished Pikes Peak marathon, it was about a half block to the nearest bar. Unfortunately, they were serving two-for-one beers, so I had to drink two pints of the lovely local dark microbrew. Big grin


                            Cryptic

                              hot chocolate is great on a cold day. I believe it was scout who suggested chocolate milk that is good too. Trent thanks for the posts above I learned something new today.
                                The South Beach Diet pretty much forbids beer because maltose is the sugar most rapidly absorbed by the body. South Beach is all about avoiding the rapid peaks & falls in blood sugars. That's why they want you to eat complex carbs instead of simple:whole wheat bread vs white, brown rice versus white, etc.. South Beach hates beer. Which is a major reason I don't do it anymore. So, beer might be a good choice of beverage during a run. Why hasn't anybody thought of this before? This would change the look of marathons in the future. I can see it now...all aid stations after the 18 mile mark would be equipped with kegs of beer & teams of volunteers standing by with funnels, to aid in rapid beverage deployment. The downside would be convincing the cop who pulls you over the reason you reek of beer is because you just ran a marathon.

                                The secret of life is honesty and fair dealing. If you can fake that, you've got it made.

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