RunningAHEAD - Topic: Why do I always bonk between miles 12 and 14?

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Why do I always bonk between miles 12 and 14? (Read 1237 times)

chimera view log	posted: 1/15/2008 at 1:13 AM
	I have been running for only 3 years, but have completed 5 half marys over these years and my first full yesterday. No matter what, no matter how well I'm doing, I seem to implode between miles 12 and 14 EVERY time! I do intervals, I started only walking then worked up to R4 min/W 1 min. After my last half in Aug, I started training with a R4/W2 plan that feels really comfortable. My problem is that after about mile 12, I can't maintain my intervals and start slipping to more walking than running and eventually, only walking. Even in my half PR, I bonked at about 12 and walked it in. The best I've done was in my 16 miler while training for the full...I managed to keep up until mile 14, then fell apart. For my full yesterday, I dropped back to R3/W2 in an effort to keep going longer, but still only made it halfway and walked the last 10 miles. What am I doing wrong? I do live in S. FL and train in heat/humidity most of the year. My toughest runs are with high humidity. I know that's a factor, but I was born here. Shouldn't I be acclimated by now? I'm not fast and I never will be. I would just like to be able to continue improving my endurance. I guess I'm trying to figure out if I'm losing the physical or the mental battle and what I can do to fix it. TIA for any thoughts/help!
	Mel // Join us in the Back of the Pack!// "A lot of people run a race to see who's the fastest. I run to see who has the most guts." - Steve Prefontaine

willamona view log Hawt and sexy	posted: 1/15/2008 at 2:13 AM
	You are not going to like this, but you bonk because you are running to fast. Drop the intervals and slow down. Just keep running slowly, it will come to you. It's an easy fix, but no one likes to hear it.
	Running is like sex; the more you do the more you want.

PowerOfQ view log Line of Eld	posted: 1/15/2008 at 2:15 AM
	Not too sure, and I've only been running less than a year, but it seems like you might want to be running more often. Your long runs are making up a significant portion of your overall mileage. Just my 2 cents. GOOD LUCK!
	The man in black fled across the desert, and the gunslinger followed.

Trent view log ʎǝʞuoɯ ʎʞunɟ	posted: 1/15/2008 at 2:17 AM
	Looking at your log, you are not putting in even close to enough miles to be running 14 mile runs. Your longest runs should not be any more than about 30-50% of your weekly miles. So to run 14 miles comfortably, you need to be running a total of about 30-45 miles per week minimum. And regularly. For months. You will find that this will also make you naturally faster.
	noʎ ɥʇıʍ ǝq ʎǝʞuoɯ ǝɥʇ ʎɐɯ

willamona view log Hawt and sexy	posted: 1/15/2008 at 2:19 AM
	Holy hell, I did not even think about looking at the running log. Still getting used to that. Yeah, run more. You do two days of speedwork and a long run each week? No easy days at all? Well, there's your problem. You are tripleing your weekly mileage on long runs. STOP THAT! Do some easy runs during the week. Do some reading about how to train. That should help. Read about Jack Daniel's Pete Pfitzinger and those types.
	Running is like sex; the more you do the more you want.

BadDawg view log	posted: 1/15/2008 at 3:48 AM
	I followed Galloway's run/walk "to finish" program, which is just about the lowest mileage plan that I've seen. I think I was averaging 100 miles per month, which is more than appears on your training log. More miles at an easy pace would probably help. Are you eating before your long runs? I usually try to eat an hour in advance, but sometimes the planning's a little lacking and I'm eating on my way out the door. Are you refueling during your long runs? I currently use Sport Beans, but most seem to use Shot Bloks or Gu. The Prefontaine quote in your signature is certainly appropriate, I don't think I have the guts to run for seven hours. Bonk or not, congrats on finishing and keep up the good work!
	Ed Tuesday Good Times 5K series in Lowell, MA HTFU "The truth is that there is nothing noble in being superior to somebody else. The only real nobility is in being superior to your former self." Whitney Young

Figbash

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posted: 1/15/2008 at 4:08 AM

Your training is haphazard and inconsistent. You aren't running near enough miles for a half marathon and many weeks consisted of only a long run. Consequently, you are spending most of your time recovering from that long run and aren't developing the necessary endurance to run a half marathon which explains your fatigue late in the race. Get your weekly mileage up to a consistent 25 plus miles a week and follow a structured training program to help you prepare. It will make a world of difference in your performance.

Tom

chimera view log	posted: 1/15/2008 at 4:24 AM modified: 1/15/2008 at 4:26 AM
	Wow, y'all are fast! Thanks for all the input. Looks like the consensus is more mileage. My marathon training was inconsistent due to family and work stressors, but not quite as bad as it looks. I don't usually miss a run (though I don't always input them into the log here), but I did often short them when I couldn't get started until 9pm after my youngest is in bed. Even when I'm totally religious about the short runs, I only do them 2 days a week with a long run on the weekend. I have followed the training program from Marathoning for Mortals by John Bingham. Looking back to my half PR, even with fabulous consistency the LR were often still more then 50% of total mileage. Maybe due to the training plan...it calls for minutes of running for the short runs rather than mileage. So the 10 mile week for the half training is 2 60 min SR then 1 10 miler. I can maintain a 12 min mile for 60 min, but not always and that sometimes cuts me short for mileage Maybe I'm ready to graduate from Bingham to something with more mileage? I have read 3 of Galloway's books, one of Higdon's and one by Glover. I'm working through Lore of Running now. I like Galloway's approach, but the training plan that takes you all the way up to a 26 miler kinda scared me. That's a huge time commitment for me on a weekend with family things to do as well. I do eat before a long run and take Gu every 3 to 4 miles or so. I'll likely stick with half marys for the foreseeable future due to time and injury. I have PF in my right foot which is pretty stable now with custom orthotics (high arches). I also just found out I have a tarsal coalition on the left...doc says the foot may just not tolerate high mileage well, though I can do a half with only moderate discomfort. I'd like to be sub 2:30 someday so I'll make my 2008 goal to increase weekly mileage and improve consistency. Thanks again!
	Mel // Join us in the Back of the Pack!// "A lot of people run a race to see who's the fastest. I run to see who has the most guts." - Steve Prefontaine

Trent view log ʎǝʞuoɯ ʎʞunɟ	posted: 1/15/2008 at 4:26 AM
	Less time reading. More time running.
	noʎ ɥʇıʍ ǝq ʎǝʞuoɯ ǝɥʇ ʎɐɯ

willamona view log Hawt and sexy	posted: 1/15/2008 at 4:30 AM
	Drop the intervals too. The PF will probably go away magically after you do that. It worked for me back in the day.
	Running is like sex; the more you do the more you want.

pinwheel view log	posted: 1/15/2008 at 7:14 AM
	Coolrunning has some good running programs; I've never run a marathon, but I've enjoyed them for shorter distances. http://www.coolrunning.com/engine/2/2_4/143.shtml

JakeKnight view log	posted: 1/15/2008 at 12:15 PM
	Uh, yeah. What everybody else said. Run more, run more often, run more (easy) miles. A lot more. I looked at your log - and you're making the same mistake I made in the winter of 2006: you're overemphasizing your long runs and doing very little else, except the intervals that either you don't need or which may even be hurting you. You're running before your marathon was two long runs in 2 weeks - nothing else - followed by 3 intervals (in a row, nothing else) over the course of the next two weeks. You might find some of the discussion in this thread useful: http://runningahead.com/forums/topic/34ada011f0704106b93c8aae61742566 And here's a random guy's log that you might like to peek at; his mileage isn't huge, but look at his consistency. Not one really long run, but with that base I'll bet he could do one effortlessly. (Hope you don't mind me publicizing your log, MikeJ) http://runningahead.com/logs/4a1349031cdc41bd8dadbae89c5fe7dd All of the problems you mention are caused by a lack of consistency and overemphasizing long runs.
	E-mail: JakeKnight2002@aol.com -----------------------------

Thunderthighs Beatin' on the Rock	posted: 1/15/2008 at 12:45 PM
	Quote from chimera on 1/15/2008 at 4:24 AM: Wow, y'all are fast! Thanks for all the input. ... That's a huge time commitment for me on a weekend with family things to do as well. Hi, fellow Floridian! I am having good success so far with hal Higdon's Beginner's Half Marathon Training program. http://www.halhigdon.com/halfmarathon/novice.htm Highly recommend it. As a homeschooling mom of 4 very athletic, busy kids, I use their practice time to run. Every one of their practices is at least 2 hours, and that's time I might otherwise be sitting on my duff, or shopping. Save money; go for a run! (See you at the Grouper!)
	Be yourself. Those that matter, don't mind. Those that mind, don't matter.

tbarton view log	posted: 1/15/2008 at 8:11 PM
	Definitely not an expert but are you using anything like energy gels? I find that if I am going farther than 8 or 9 miles I have to have something or I just run out of gas. Teresa
	I'm Running to Eat

Mr Inertia

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Heck of a Guy

posted: 1/15/2008 at 8:40 PM

Quote from tbarton on 1/15/2008 at 8:11 PM:

Definitely not an expert but are you using anything like energy gels? I find that if I am going farther than 8 or 9 miles I have to have *something* or I just run out of gas.

Teresa

That's not from glycogen depletion. You typically carry enough glycogen for a good 18-20 miles. If you're running out of steam before that, something else is going on; you don't really need additional carbs before 18 miles or so.

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