Forums > Health and Nutrition > What's your SPM (Steps per Minute)?
lace 'em up!
When my legs aren't tired, I'm much closer to 180 SPM. When I do strides, I"m over 180, close to190.
Anyeone else experience this?
Jack Daniels actually did a study on this by counting steps at U.S. Olympic Trials. He arrived at 180 as an average. (Daniels Running Formula).
I subscribed to this method years ago, and it really did improve my economy! Still (being 99.9% slow twitch blessed) can't seem to get above 172-176, no matter how hard I try!
Still (being 99.9% slow twitch blessed) can't seem to get above 172-176, no matter how hard I try!
I'd be curious to hear what specific exercises you have tried exactly to improve your stride frequency.
I would say more than 90% of people never really properly practice to improve their stride frequency. Many people are probably aware of SF and, if nothing else, try to "will through" increaging it by thinking about it. That's probably the extent majority would do. And that doesn't really cut it.
One of the best ways to increase stride frequency is to do some fast leg-speed exercise on downhill. It shouldn't be too steep; the distance can be as short as 30~50m or so. You start running about 20m before the downhill to pick up the speed, and stride down the hill by MOVING THE LEGS AS FAST AS YOU CAN. Being on downhill, you should feel your legs moving faster than your legs can actually move and you feel burning sensation deep down in your abdominal (hip flexors). This way, you can overcome muscule viscosity and be more efficient at it.
Just like everything else, improving your stride frequency is a learnt skill. Sure, some has faster SF than others, some have slower; but we can all improve to some extent; and "thinking about it" is not the best way to go about.
Resident of Pennsyltucky
Interesting thread.
I've checked on several runs. I did it on an easy 4 miler (8:00 pace), one where I was at 7:24 pace, and on my 9 mile long run yesterday - both at the beginning when I was fresh and at the end when I was not. All of them were dead on 150 per minute. I'm sure if I did a 200 I'd come in with more but probably not over 165 since I'm 6-3 and have a very long stride...I once measured how many steps it took me to do a 200m interval and it was 101 - basically strides are 6.5 feet.
When I'm going downhill I can't do the 'let the legs move as fast as you can' thing - too much pounding on my not-so-great knees, but its a good suggestion for others. Its not like I'm slow - I can still run 28-29 in the 200m.
Wonder if I should experiment and see if it helps, though right now I'm sure the increase in mileage I'm doing will overshadow that.
Interesting thread. I've checked on several runs. I did it on an easy 4 miler (8:00 pace), one where I was at 7:24 pace, and on my 9 mile long run yesterday - both at the beginning when I was fresh and at the end when I was not. All of them were dead on 150 per minute. I'm sure if I did a 200 I'd come in with more but probably not over 165 since I'm 6-3 and have a very long stride...I once measured how many steps it took me to do a 200m interval and it was 101 - basically strides are 6.5 feet. When I'm going downhill I can't do the 'let the legs move as fast as you can' thing - too much pounding on my not-so-great knees, but its a good suggestion for others. Its not like I'm slow - I can still run 28-29 in the 200m. Wonder if I should experiment and see if it helps, though right now I'm sure the increase in mileage I'm doing will overshadow that.
I doubt your stride frequency, running 200m fast, was 101. That sounds waaaaaaaay too slow to be natural at all. 150 I can see. You may get an advice to shorten your stride and quicken your SF. I wouldn't recommend that. Sounds like you have beautiful long strides; why even kill that advantage? You might want to however to work on your stride frequency. I understand what you mean by downhill running giving you too much pouding but that it because you can't move your legs fast enough--chicken first or egg???
It's easier for a tall guy with long legs to take choppy strides than a short guy with short legs to take long strides. There had been some great distance runners with very long legs actually taking very fast strides like 200 steps per minute. One had a beautiful knee lift and moved his legs "like a circle", not swinging his legs forward much at all. The other one didn't have much knee lift at all but very efficient quick leg swing (both of them from Finland, interestingly...). I can remember a couple of very short, stocky runners who looked like they were sprinting the entire marathon distance but I'll bet their stride length didn't even approach close to 6 feet at all.
You may be able to do other leg speed exercise--do this on a very slightly downhill (somewhere in a parking lot even) with the wind behind you. All you should concentrate is to move your legs fast. If you do it correctly, watching from the side, you'd be moving your legs like a circle (good knee lift but bring your leg down directly). Done correctly, you'll feel a burning sensation in your deep abdominal (hip flexors). You should also feel like, when you try to come downstairs by putting your foot on each step (not missing one) and try to come down as quickly as you can. You can also do some "Quick Steps" like some football players might do. With 28-second 200m speed, if you master good stride frequency, you may post a damn good 800~mile.
I doubt your stride frequency, running 200m fast, was 101. That sounds waaaaaaaay too slow to be natural at all. 150 I can see. You may get an advice to shorten your stride and quicken your SF.
Sorry I meant I took 101 steps in that particular 200m total...since I ran it in 29.something that means I was up around 200 for a minute had I held the pace out.
The 150 steps/minute has been proven a few times on training runs at various paces. I did get advice to shorten my strides and increase turnover in college. I wasn't able to do it consistently. I've started doing striders again - limited by the weather - to try and spark some of the dormant fast-twitch muscles. I'll have to experiment with having them on a downhill - I usually run them on a slight uphill. Now that I feel my strength coming back with higher mileage I am interested to see what the spring holds.
With 28-second 200m speed, if you master good stride frequency, you may post a damn good 800~mile.
I originally was 800/mile runner in high school but didn't get far (see PR's in signature). I moved to the 5000m in college.
I also wonder if extra weight has something to do with it. I am a powerful runner with really strong legs (I don't lift with legs but I'll be happy to leg press the entire rack on a bet). Right now I weigh 193...at my peak I was 170-175. I also have strong arms and have made it a point to concentrate on drive - bring elbows back further for increased push. It seems to make me feel lighter on my feet - when I was feeling really heavy or having a bad race I had noticed I barely moved my arms at all.
On another thread I was talking about whenever I dipped below the 170 mark - which I held even with high mileage - I invariably got sick and/or injured. I think I have to learn how to carry the extra weight to bring my times down further, because even running 35-40 miles per week I'm not wandering much below 190.
I'd be curious to hear what specific exercises you have tried exactly to improve your stride frequency. I would say more than 90% of people never really properly practice to improve their stride frequency. Many people are probably aware of SF and, if nothing else, try to "will through" increaging it by thinking about it. That's probably the extent majority would do. And that doesn't really cut it. One of the best ways to increase stride frequency is to do some fast leg-speed exercise on downhill. It shouldn't be too steep; the distance can be as short as 30~50m or so. You start running about 20m before the downhill to pick up the speed, and stride down the hill by MOVING THE LEGS AS FAST AS YOU CAN. Being on downhill, you should feel your legs moving faster than your legs can actually move and you feel burning sensation deep down in your abdominal (hip flexors). This way, you can overcome muscule viscosity and be more efficient at it. Just like everything else, improving your stride frequency is a learnt skill. Sure, some has faster SF than others, some have slower; but we can all improve to some extent; and "thinking about it" is not the best way to go about.
Thanks for the advice. You are correct, I've done more "willing" than "skilling". I have done some downhill (overspeed) stuff. But usually end up overstriding and defeating the purpose! Probably too steep? After reading your post I realized that. Also, I almost NEVER go "as fast as I can". But it sure makes sense. It's worth a try, so guess I'll see if this old dog can learn any new tricks!
Now I feel responsible... Yes, I think most people never go "as fast as possible" but it's probably because they had goten injured or fear getting injured.
I've often seen a comment like "I'm not fast; my 200m time is such-and-such..." and wonder if any of them actually condition themselves to run fast to begin with or if they just simply got on a track one day and see how fast they can run that one particular day...???
Once again, now I feel like I'm just promoting this, this is why I like Lydiard principles. You do long slow stuff to work on your aerobic base AS WELL AS strengthening ligaments and tendons; then you do more concentrated stuff by running up AND down the hills--not fast, not yet, but hard. Then you do some repeats--still not allout. So it could take as long as 4 or 5 months of gradually working on faster and faster effort before you even try out "as fast as possible". So by the time you actually time yourself to see just how fast you can really run, you're ready to run fast.
In your case, however, you might actually want to try to see to "move your legs as fast as you can" to see first. Like I said (I think I did here...), if done correctly, you do get this burning sensation deep down inside your abdominal area--hip flexors. If you try to run AS FAST AS POSSIBLE when not ready, it'll be a lot of stress on your Achilles/cakves so it's not advisable. You don't have to take 4 months before you try to run fast; but just go gradually. You may want to include some faster stuff for a month or so (4 weeks) and see how legs feel first.
TRIing to beat the heat!
I'm still a newbie runner, having only been at this for a little over two years. However, my right foot strike was at 92 to 94 right off the bat (so, 184 to 188 SPM). At my first tri camp last year, one of the coaches actually told me that she thought I had too high of a stride rate. Go figure?
Evidently it looks like my body has naturally taken care of the stride rate side of things, but I'm still a slowbie... so obviously I have a stride length issue going on. Any ideas on how to rememdy that?? Increasing stride length while maintaining rate doesn't seem quite as easy for me to do.
2012 Goals
Sub-1:42 for half marathon √ (1:41 at Disney, Jan '12)
Sub-22 for 5k
BQ for marathon
I'm still a newbie runner, having only been at this for a little over two years. However, my right foot strike was at 92 to 94 right off the bat (so, 184 to 188 SPM). At my first tri camp last year, one of the coaches actually told me that she thought I had too high of a stride rate. Go figure? Evidently it looks like my body has naturally taken care of the stride rate side of things, but I'm still a slowbie... so obviously I have a stride length issue going on. Any ideas on how to rememdy that?? Increasing stride length while maintaining rate doesn't seem quite as easy for me to do.
Couple of things: first, did the tri coach say your stride rate was too high because of the number or because of a flaw he/she saw in your stride? If it was just based on the number, then I submit he/she shouldn't be making such a comment. If it was because of a flaw in your form, you should get to the bottom of it, or just ignore the comment.
2nd: the way to go faster is ideally keeping your cadence the same but increasing stride length. You do that by trying to run faster, be it with 20 to 30 second strides, tempo runs were you push yourself, drills that focus on stride length, etc. Some great drills I saw on the YoungerLegsForOlderRunners site are skipping for height, skipping for distance, quick feet, karokee (sp?). Go check out the site and the tips from Pete Magill.
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