12

The Half Marathon in the middle of Higdon's Intermediate 1 Marathon training plan (Read 1463 times)

    Hi Folks

     

    I have a v ery specific question about Higdon's Intermediate 1 Marathon training plan.

    I am currently following this plan pretty closely for a 04 December Marathon, which will be my first.

    I skipped the first few weeks because of a HM that I was running and now am on week 6.

    Things seem to be going OK.

     

    In a few weeks time I'll be up on "the Half Marathon" that is scheduled in week 9.

    I have actually switched weeks 9 & 10 around due to race availability locally.

     

    Here's the question: Am I supposed to race this HM as an all out, shoot for a PR type of race, probably around 1:50 for me, or at marathon pace ,somewhere around 2:05? or something else?

     

    I may be over thinking this a little (it has been known to happen) but I know that if I run this as I would a goal HM it will affect my next week's marathon training.

     

    Log is, of course, open for stalking if that's of any value.

     

    Thanks in advance for the advice.

     

    Cheers

     

    MattJ

    2013 Goals
    1) Break 1:50 in a HM (PR 1:52:19)
    2) Break 4:00 in a Marathon (PR 4:20:39)


    day after day sameness

      Matt -- look at the next week in the plan, following the 1/2 marathon.  You want to be able run that week's workouts with quality, so if running all out on Sunday will take more recovery than the Monday easy run Hal has your running after the 1/2, you'll want to ease off.

       

      I think Hidgon's notes for the plans tell you that he puts that 1/2 in there for a confidence boost, some race practice, and to give some variety. I'd suggest running faster than your planned marathon pace, but not all out.

      Choosing my words carefully has never been my strength I've been known to be vague and often pointless

        If you go all out on your half, you definitely will be sore during the next week of training (or at least for 2-3 days).

         

        Then again, running a half hard will give you a much better idea on how well you can run a marathon.   It's always fun to go after a PR or a good time.  You could take your time and plug this number into the running calculators for a goal marathon time based on your current fitness.


        Consistently Slow

          Plug your last race into RA predictor and go for it. There is no speed work in the plan.Run easy the rest of the week.

          Run until the trail runs out.

          2014***1500 miles 09/28/14

          50miler 13:26:18

          Race Less Train More

           

          Ana Trason  "Living Her Life"

          "The Marble in The Groove"

           

          unsolicited chatter

          http://bkclay.blogspot.com/


          tomatolover

            Great question- I had the same concerns about running a 1/2 before my full in october and have to admit, I bagged the half.  I know it sounds dumb, but I had a fear that I'd run balls to the wall like i did my last half, as it's a race environment and land up setting myself back some (it took me about 4 days to recover & even then my body wasn't the same for about 1 1/2 months afterward.  I didn't know what kind of effort I should put into the half were I to run it (long aerobic run pace? half MP, half aerobic?)

            I Look forward to reading suggestions & answers.

              I always view it as a proper "fitness test."  Use a race predictor from and run it all out which will give you confidence for your Dec marathon [especially considering that you aren't tapering for this race].  Even an epic fail will tell you something about your fitness and pace expectations for the marathon [which is the goal race.] 

               

              Good luck!

              2012= under-goaled


              Prince of Fatness

                I'd race it all out.  It wouldn't be the end of the world if you backed off training a little if you feel the need the week following the half since it's a couple of months before your goal race.  It doesn't make sense to me to enter a race and not race.  If that's the case save your time and money and go run a 13 mile MP run anywhere.

                 

                I don't like the 2 rest days before the half, either.  I'd rest 2 days prior and at least get a short run in the day before the half so I was loose for the race.

                 

                Good luck.

                Semi-retired.

                  I'd not rest at all and race it on tired legs.  The only way it should affect the next week is that you may have to run easy.  Your next "pace" run isn't until the following Friday, so it shouldn't be an issue.

                   

                    Matt -- look at the next week in the plan, following the 1/2 marathon.  You want to be able run that week's workouts with quality, so if running all out on Sunday will take more recovery than the Monday easy run Hal has your running after the 1/2, you'll want to ease off.

                     

                     

                    I disagree with this - I'd sacrifice the next quality workout for this one really good workout (race) for a lot of reasons (confidence, race pace, race prepration, etc.)  You are so far out from the marathon goal that it shouldn't have any material effect on your training. 

                     


                    Feeling the growl again

                      I disagree with this - I'd sacrifice the next quality workout for this one really good workout (race) for a lot of reasons (confidence, race pace, race prepration, etc.)  You are so far out from the marathon goal that it shouldn't have any material effect on your training. 

                       

                      Without looking at the actual plan...

                       

                      If it wants you to do a real workout 2 days after the race, then this infers that he does not want you to all-out race the HM....assuming there was actually that much thought put into writing the plan.  For HH's sake I'll assume he thought about what he was writing!

                       

                      Philosophically, I agree with L Train.  If I were designing the plan, I'd have you race the HM for the reasons he listed and more, then leave out the next workout so you get to run easy from the weekend until like Thursday when you resume workouts.

                      "If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does.  There's your pep talk for today.  Go Run." -- Slo_Hand

                       


                      Prince of Fatness

                        Without looking at the actual plan...

                         

                        I looked at the plan.  He's switching weeks 9 and 10 so his next big run would be an 18 miler a week after the half.  The plan calls for 5 running days a week, one cross training day, and one rest day.  So I think that there is time to recover before the next workout if he races the half.

                        Semi-retired.


                        Feeling the growl again

                          I looked at the plan.  He's switching weeks 9 and 10 so his next big run would be an 18 miler a week after the half.  The plan calls for 5 running days a week, one cross training day, and one rest day.  So I think that there is time to recover before the next workout if he races the half.

                           

                          Yup.

                          "If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does.  There's your pep talk for today.  Go Run." -- Slo_Hand

                           


                          A Saucy Wench

                            You are supposed to race it.  But you are supposed to race it without tapering so it isnt likely to be your best possible race.  But it is supposed to be a race effort from what I recall of Higdon's plan. 

                            I have become Death, the destroyer of electronic gadgets

                             

                            "When I got too tired to run anymore I just pretended I wasnt tired and kept running anyway" - dd, age 7

                              The HM race will suck, but that is the whole point of it, supposed to get you used to how the legs will feel over the second half of the marathon.  If you get anywhere close to your PR without tapering, I guess the training is working and you can reset your expectations higher.

                                Thanks for the replies everyone. If I read the overall sentiment of the replies it looks like most are saying it should be raced but to expect that it will both suck and not be as PR-able as if it were a goal race.

                                 

                                I guess I should have posted this earlier. Here's what the week before and after the HM look like in the current plan:

                                10/3 10/4 10/5 10/6 10/7 10/8 10/9 Week Total  
                                Easy 4 Easy 5 Rest Easy 4 Cross Rest Race 13.1 26.1  
                                10/10 10/11 10/12 10/13 10/14 10/15 10/16 Week Total 2 Week Total
                                Easy 5 Easy 8 Easy 5 Rest Easy 8  Long 18 Cross 44  70.1

                                 

                                To this rookie it's funny that the experienced ones amongst you consider the "easy" runs as recovery after the HM.

                                I can tell you now that my Monday 10/10 recovery after the HM won't include any running and, comparing to past experience, it's going to need me to HTFU to get out there on Tuesday but that is obviously going to have to happen.

                                 

                                So here's the new plan for those two weeks:

                                I will race the HM but will do so on "tired legs". I did not like the rest day before the race and the mini-taper that's built into that week so I changed it up a little. I will give myself the Monday off after the race but I will get out there on Tuesday. My overall mileage for the 2 weeks is unchanged.  It looks like this:

                                10/3 10/4 10/5 10/6 10/7 10/8 10/9 Week Total  
                                Easy 4 Easy 8 Cross Easy 5 Rest Easy 4 Race 13.1 34.1  
                                10/10 10/11 10/12 10/13 10/14 10/15 10/16 Week Total 2 Week Total
                                Rest Easy 5 Easy 5 Rest Easy 8  Long 18 Cross 36  70.1

                                 

                                Will let you know how it goes. Thanks again folks.

                                2013 Goals
                                1) Break 1:50 in a HM (PR 1:52:19)
                                2) Break 4:00 in a Marathon (PR 4:20:39)

                                12