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Running for weight loss and max fat burn (Read 1634 times)

    I'm a bit confused by some of the information out there about fueling for runs. My understanding is that maximum fat burn is accomplished when running on an empty or semi-empty stomach so the body is forced to use more fat early on. If this is true, will this strategy get rid of the body fat quicker than eating prior to or during a run? On the other hand, if I want maximum performance should I eat before and fuel during my longer endurance events? I'm currently running 30mpw and will soon start training for an Aug marathon. I'm 25% body fat and would love to lose much of that fat before the marathon while not compromising my overall training. Any advice from those that have gone down this road before me would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, AKFlyer Cool
    Hannibal Granite


      In training I do not consume anything unless it is a very hot day and even then I'll just take a few drinks of water/sports beverage as available - local water fountains most of the time or my wife riding her bike with me if I've been a really good boy Big grin . In a marathon I will take a GU or two throughout the race and take a drink every few miles. I may take a drink or two in a 1/2 Mar. race if it is a hot day, but any race shorter than that and I don't feel I need it. The reason I do it this way is because in training I want my body to become more efficient at using carbohydrates and when going long enough burning fat as fuel. Taking in fuel during the run would negate some of this training effect. However, in a race situation I'm not trying to gain efficiency I'm trying to go as fast as possible. As for running on an empty stomach vs. eating before there may be a slightly higher fat burn if you have less carbs in your system at the beginning of the run, but if you don't have enough energy and have to cut the run short or slow down considerably in the last miles you have not gained an advantage. Remember your weight will ultimately be determined by calories in vs. calories out regardless of when/how they are burned.

      "You NEED to do this" - Shara

        I'm sure you will get a lot of varied responses. Some of it will be based on science and some of it will be based on "science". But Hannibal nailed it here:
        Remember your weight will ultimately be determined by calories in vs. calories out regardless of when/how they are burned.
        That's all the science that really matters for weight loss. The rest is either just minor details or BS. My experience with weight loss and marathon training is to get the majority of your weight lost through smart eating before your marathon training begins. I find it very difficult to drop more than say 5 pounds in a 12-18 week training cycle. When my mileage ramps up - so does my hunger. My wife has a term for this. It is called Voracious Ravenitis. My thinking is that if I am going to invest 3-4 months of training - then I am going to make the most of it by ensuring I am properly fueled up for my workouts.

        When it’s all said and done, will you have said more than you’ve done?

        Tremont


          I lost about 15 pounds training for a marathon and found it really easy to do. It isn't rocket surgery: run a lot more without eating any more and you'll lose weight. I was already making a big commitment by doing all the extra running so it seemed to make sense to simultaneously commit to not eating any extra. Imaging myself in agony at mile 23 of the race really helped motivate me to not stuff my face during training. Plus, being lighter makes all the extra running that much easier so I had constant positive reinforcement. I'm very skeptical of the idea that you can train your body to preferentially burn fat by withholding calories during training runs but I did it anyway. I did all my runs without eating anything except for one test run where I took what I planned to take during the actual race to make sure I didn't have any problems with it. Then during the marathon I consumed about 500 calories and had no problems with cramping or bonking or hitting the wall and was able to maintain essentially the same pace throughout.


          SMART Approach

            The reason I do it this way is because in training I want my body to become more efficient at using carbohydrates and when going long enough burning fat as fuel. Taking in fuel during the run would negate some of this training effect. However, in a race situation I'm not trying to gain efficiency I'm trying to go as fast as possible. As for running on an empty stomach vs. eating before there may be a slightly higher fat burn if you have less carbs in your system at the beginning of the run, but if you don't have enough energy and have to cut the run short or slow down considerably in the last miles you have not gained an advantage. Remember your weight will ultimately be determined by calories in vs. calories out regardless of when/how they are burned.
            Like the post above. If you can't train properly, you need to consume something. As you start doing your long training runs, it is wise to consume carbs. It will enhance recovery. As far as fatburning. You may burn a slightly higher percentage of fat if you don't consume carbs before a run. Probably not enough to make a huge difference. A calorie burned is a calorie burned. I personally don't consume carbs before my training runs because I don't want the extra calories, but I am not marathon training. BUT, before a race, I will consume a few hundred calories of carbs and bit of protein 2-3 hours before race to top off carb stores. I don't want anything affecting my performance negatively.

            Run Coach. Recovery Coach. Founder of SMART Approach Training, Coaching & Recovery

            Structured Marathon Adaptive Recovery Training

            Safe Muscle Activation Recovery Technique

            www.smartapproachtraining.com

              Your runs are fueled with a combination of carbohydrates, fat and a small amount of protein. The percentage of each is determined by your pace. A faster pace will burn a higher percentage of carbs and a slower pace will burn a higher percentage of fat. The total amount of fat burned depends simply on how many total calories you burn during and after a run. generally, the faster and farther you run the more calories you'll burn and calories burned equals fat burned. Eating before or during a run will have little impact on your runs until they get long enough to deplete your glycogen (carbohydrate) stores. For most of us that means 20 miles or more. I never eat before or during any of my training runs because I feel that it encourages the body to burn more fat. I've done many 20 plus mile runs on nothing but water with no trouble. I do carb load rather extensively (2-3 days) before long runs and marathons and that seems to help a lot. Check out The Marathon Long Run on the McMillan website for more information on this technique. Tom
              Trent


              Good Bad & The Monkey

                Right. What is on your stomach has NOTHING to do with whether you burn fat or carbs. Effort alone determines this. You ALWAYS burn carbs (glycogen) and fat. ALWAYS. As your effort increases, the proportion of calories burned that comes from fat decreases. Slow easy running burns relatively more fat per mile, while hard intense running burns relatively more glycogen per mile. Check this.


                The Greatest of All Time

                  Right. You ALWAYS burn carbs (glycogen) and fat. ALWAYS. As your effort increases, the proportion of calories burned that comes from fat decreases. Slow easy running burns relatively more fat per mile, while hard intense running burns relatively more glycogen per mile.
                  Spot on. Some bodybuilders buy into the the myth vigorously however and always do morning cardio on an empty stomach. However your body is going to burn the glycogen in the muscle you are working as a primary source of glucose fuel. The liver also provides glycogen as well. And as Trent pointed out, some fat will be metabolized as well with the amount being relative to effort. There is no way, to my knowledge, that you can force your body to burn fat in place of glucose (all things being equal). So, running on an empty stomach will not likely accelerate fat burning. As already stated, if you want to lose fat take in less energy then you burn. It's that simple.
                  all you touch and all you see, is all your life will ever be

                  Obesity is a disease. Yes, a disease where nothing tastes bad...except salads.
                  Scout7


                    If I recall correctly, Noakes talks about an experiment conducted where they switched people to a high fat diet. The findings were that fat burning increased, but it ended up being temporary. At the end of about 8 weeks, overall times got worse.
                      Thanks for all of the excellent advice. Everybody seems to agree that in order to lose weight simply burn more calories than you take in and don't worry about what is being burned. I will continue to train for my marathon "Big, Wild Life" in Anchorage and keep my calorie intake reasonable, without stuffing my face or eating stupid. Patience, patience, patience........ Yes
                      lostinthenet3


                      MM#1869

                        Well for me running has helped my weight loss. But i think it was more of the over haul of my diet that helped. I generally do more walking than running. I run for about 5 min and walk about 7. I started walking 4 yrs ago and started working out. I have dropped over 200lbs at my lowest and gained back 40. It is not easy to maintain my weight for me. For now I am happy with my overall loss. However as stated before it's Cal's in vs Cals out and I beliveyou need a 3500 cal difference to see a one lb change on the scale. For fat loss I was told by a personal trainer that intervals worked best at burning fat. Not sure if it's true. For me the thing that has worked is smarter,smaller more healthy options and getting up and moving for 45 mins min a day. I did not put it on overnight and as much as I have wanted it gone it will not and has not come off overnight. Doug

                        "If you run, you are a runner. It doesn't matter how fast or how far. It doesn't matter if today is your first day or if you've been running for twenty years. There is no test to pass, no license to earn, no membership card to get. You just run."

                          Doug, In order for you to lose 200lbs you must be extremely disciplined and passionate. Good on you for that. That makes my 15lbs of vanity fat seem rather silly. Keep up the exercise and enjoy life. Maybe you could get a side job as an inspirational speaker. A lot of people will respect what you have done. Kurt