Thinking of getting a coach (Read 271 times)

 

Life is about balance. I wish I were more productive but in reality I'm probably ahead of the curve.

 

Screw it. I'm gonna grab another beer. I've earned it. Right?

That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

... they wanted $135 a week!

I wish I could find someone to pay me $135 a week so I can tell them to simply "Run Lots. Mostly Easy. Sometimes Hard."

One of my primary concerns with this guy in particular is, it sounds like he'll want me to back off my weekly mileage in favor of more "quality" workouts - the rough outline he related to me indicated 4-5 days of running per week: one speed session, one tempo run, one long run, and one or two easy runs.  One or two days off entirely.  And, a couple of strength training sessions - on the day(s) of the easy runs.

Indeed, I think it is of critical importance to find a coach who also listens to YOU and listens to your own personal experience about what you feel has worked well for you through your own trial and error (Point being = and not just jump in and change everything completely that you have been doing that has got you here)!  I hired a coach for one marathon training cycle and was very happy with the progress I made.  I failed the race due to probably one major lapse in judgment on my part where I threw in a huge long run that I had never done in training before.  My coach initially tried to talk me out of this (and he would have been right), but I can be stubborn.  Anyway, it wasn't his fault that I went from an upward cycle of improvement to a downward cycle where I was behind my recovery and never caught up in time for the race.  Nevertheless, I would certainly hire him again, but I need to win some more race money again since that's the best way to get the expense approved by the CEO.

All this is to say, working with a good coach is a two-way street, and anyway, "Advice is a dangerous gift, even from the wise to the wise, and all courses may run ill."

Thanks, everyone.

 

One of my primary concerns with this guy in particular is, it sounds like he'll want me to back off my weekly mileage in favor of more "quality" workouts - the rough outline he related to me indicated 4-5 days of running per week: one speed session, one tempo run, one long run, and one or two easy runs.  One or two days off entirely.  And, a couple of strength training sessions - on the day(s) of the easy runs.  Like I say, I've been using Hansons (adding a few miles to the easy runs and later on to the tempo/long runs), and that's not terribly far off from what they do, but I've become a believer in getting in as many easy miles as I can (but definitely with a day of rest).  It would feel like heresy to go two whole days in one week without doing anything, though I would welcome more strength training, as much as I hate doing it.  I've felt like the lack of regular strength sessions may have impacted me in the form of fatigue in the last few miles of my last few races.

 

Anyway, we're meeting him for dinner tomorrow.  I also need to ask him how many marathoners he's trained, and how many he's completed himself.

If you have been handling 6 days of week of running just fine, I would be suspicious of coaching that things you will do BETTER at the marathon by reducing this to 5.  The only situation I can think of where I would propose such a thing is to an athlete who has been on high mileage for a prolonged time, then decides to jump into a marathon much sooner than they had planned on doing.  In such a case, cutting the cycle short and cramming in extra quality at the expense of volume for a few weeks would be a reasonable strategy.  But it is not a long-term strategy for sustained improvement.

As for assessing his credentials, it's totally fair to ask how many marathoners he's trained, their results, and his own marathoning experience, but keep in mind that a lot of good coaches were not necessary the most proficient at the event they coach.  My best coaching experience for the marathon was from someone who had been elite at much shorter track events and run half the mileage he was recommending to me (though he did consult with an elite marathoner buddy a few times).

 

I wish I could find someone to pay me $135 a week so I can tell them to simply "Run Lots. Mostly Easy. Sometimes Hard."

To clarify this is for a personal trainer at a gym.

 

Oh, but Mab, I should have read your initial post.  If you go this route you will be breaking my personal number one rule for runners:  Never EVER take running advice from a triathlete.  I am only slightly kidding (10%) and mostly deadly serious (90%).  Just sayin'.....  All you tri-dudes can start throwing rocks now.  :-P

I'm sure I may get a few rocks chucked my way as well, but, now that I was reminded about the tidbit of the guy being a multisport athlete, I'll speculate that this may give some insight into the recommendations.  But not in a way that convinces me it's the right way to go.

- Cutting out easy days.  Yeah, tri guys run less and often skip out on the easy days.  They get a lot of that conditioning with time on the bike.  A dedicated marathoner does not.

- Focus on quality runs.  See above comment.

- Strength training sessions.  Not to minimize strength training for runners, but typically a bigger emphasis for multi-sport.

I'd make sure he has a successful history with dedicated marathoners.  Marathon vs run at end of tri, training for marathon vs training for run at end of tri as part of tri training.....very different animals.

Hmm, just got answers to my questions.

He's trained 1 person to a marathon.  "First marathon for her was a 350 and 1st oa female."  (surely he means he trained her from a 3:50 marathon to her next one, where she was first female?  I've run some pretty small races, but can't imagine 3:50 would take first place.)  He says he is a multi-sport coach for 99% of his athletes.

He has run one marathon outside of tris.  He was less than a minute from netative splitting the halves.

He has multiple huge PR's at the half distance this year (unclear to me if he means coaching or running.  He has been coaching for 2 years but mainly helping friends.  His business has been around since just the first of the year.  And, he says I'm free to contact any of his athletes about his philosophy.

Oh...and the $100/month price would be for either or both my wife and I.  That's his minimum price for single-sport training, and he was cutting us a deal.  Pretty nice.

So anyway, yeah, I'm thinking I'm going to say, thanks but no thanks.  I certainly wouldn't mind being a guinea pig and helping a guy build his business and coaching skills, and the bargain hunter in me says "hey, it would be free!"...but if I'm going to do that, I think I'd rather wait until I BQ and start running more "just for fun," without any specific goals.  Until then, I think I'll stay the course with the Hansons and pester you guys for advice.  MTA: I do find myself thinking more and more about attempting a triathlon at some point, in which case I would definitely look back to him.

We do think we're going to let him train my wife, though.  He comes very highly recommended by multiple people at our LBS, and my wife is much, much earlier in her cycling career than I am with my running.  I think, as long as he doesn't try to treat her like an experienced racer (and we'll make it clear tonight that she's not), he'll be able to help her a lot, if for no other reason than accountability.

Thanks, everyone.

 

One of my primary concerns with this guy in particular is, it sounds like he'll want me to back off my weekly mileage in favor of more "quality" workouts - the rough outline he related to me indicated 4-5 days of running per week: one speed session, one tempo run, one long run, and one or two easy runs.  One or two days off entirely.  And, a couple of strength training sessions - on the day(s) of the easy runs.  Like I say, I've been using Hansons (adding a few miles to the easy runs and later on to the tempo/long runs), and that's not terribly far off from what they do, but I've become a believer in getting in as many easy miles as I can (but definitely with a day of rest).  It would feel like heresy to go two whole days in one week without doing anything, though I would welcome more strength training, as much as I hate doing it.  I've felt like the lack of regular strength sessions may have impacted me in the form of fatigue in the last few miles of my last few races.

 

Anyway, we're meeting him for dinner tomorrow.  I also need to ask him how many marathoners he's trained, and how many he's completed himself.

Stay a million miles away from this guy. He's simply not a real running coach.

As for when you NEED a coach: hardly ever. If you're running consistent mileage year round, if you're doing the highest mileage plans out of Daniels, Pfitz, or Hudson, if your body fat is reasonably low, AND if you can't seem to improve anymore, then a high level running coach with a good understanding of exercise physiology should be able to help you come up with a training approach more suited to your needs. Such a coach will not start off by telling you what his or her approach will be. They'll listen to you first and figure out who you are as a runner. To be clear, I'm talking about the very best coaches only. I'd say over half of college coaches don't fall into this category.

When are coaches USEFUL:

- When you need motivation

- When life doesn't allow you to follow an exact schedule out of a book (work, travel, specific race schedule and mix of distances, injuries, etc.)

- When you'd rather be told what to do and trust that it will work than second guess yourself. I might get slammed for saying this, but in my experience this attitude is generally more common among women than men. Of course, men are conversely more likely to think that they know better than their coaches when they don't.

-When you need someone to tell you to back off! This is the most important by far. I made my biggest breakthroughs when I accepted that I would only finish about 75% of my hardest workouts. Usually it's not that I was incapable of finishing them, but that I would've been going about as deep as I could go, which isn't the objective. I got much more comfortable with pulling the plug, scheduling an additional easy day, and trying the workout again later. Of course, a coach might not always be at the track with you, but knowing when to back off isn't just about what happens int he middle of a workout. Sometimes it's about canceling workouts in advance, skipping a race, taking more easy days, etc.

- When your girlfriend will kill you if you talk anymore to her about running