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| Running Two Marathons Back to Back, Update should I do it? (Read 676 times) |
| view log Bugs |
posted: 9/4/2008 at 6:02 PM
modified: 10/8/2008 at 1:22 PM |
| The crazy runner in me is thinking this would be fun. What is the ideal number of weeks in between if you just want to recover, and run the next one in about the same shape you were for the first one, but just for fun? |
B U G S (Like the bunny, not the bug)
g . b u g s @ h o t m a i l . c o m |
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Hello Portland! |
posted: 9/4/2008 at 6:19 PM
modified: 9/4/2008 at 6:21 PM |
I like three to four weeks.
In March ('07) I did one, then took a week easy to recover. Bumped up the mileage for week two, then took it easier for week three, then raced on week four. I thought that worked pretty well.
Three weeks is nice especially if you don't need too much recovery that first week off.
If that second race is just for fun, do it consecutive weekends. This will also permit you to join the Marathon Maniacs and allow you to shamelessly boast about your accomplishment.
(shameless boasting: As i did with my friend Katie last March!) |
| Ah, there's nothing more exciting than science. You get all the fun of sitting still, being quiet, writing down numbers, paying attention...Science has it all. -Skinner |
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posted: 9/4/2008 at 6:42 PM |
| Hopefully 3 weeks. On Monday I'm starting my 3 week taper then running my first Marathon. 3 weeks after that I'm running my second. So I'm just planning to repeat the 3 week taper for the second. |
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posted: 9/4/2008 at 7:02 PM |
Depends on how hard you run the first one.
My (ultra runner) brother once said he didn't see much point in doing more marathons, because "I do a 30 mile run every weekend." Of course, he didn't do those hard... just nice training runs.
If you do 2 marathons in a 16-day time frame (essentially 2 in 2 weeks) that will qualify you for "Bronze" level (one star) membership in Marathon Maniacs. Check out the "Criteria" at marathonmaniacs.com
Gino (MM #970)
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| view log Don't call me a monkey. |
posted: 9/4/2008 at 8:04 PM |
For Marathon Maniacs, back to back means on back to back weekends, within 9 days.
The criteria on the MM web site is a little wordy and harder to figure out than it has to be.
This is my abbreviated version:
Element - stars
Qualification
Bronze - 1
2 in 16 days
3 in 90 days
Silver 2
3 in 16 days
6 in 6 mos
8 in 1 yr
Gold - 3
4 in 37 days
12 in 1 yr
4 in 4* in 51 days
Iridium - 4
2 in 2 days
4 in 23 days
19 in 1 yr
9 in 9* in 1 yr
Ruthenium - 5
4 in 9 days
26 in 1 yr
3 in 3* in 9 days
13 in 13* in 1 yr
Osmium - 6
6 in 16 days
31 in 1 yr
16 in 16* in 1 yr
Palladium - 7
13 in 79 days
38 in 1 yr
20 in 20* in 1 yr
Platinum - 8
28 in 183 days
45 in 1 yr
23 in 23* in 1 yr
Titanium - 10
52 in 1 yr
30 in 30* in 1 yr
20 in 20 Countries in 1 yr
*US States, Canadian Provinces, or Countries
http://www.marathonmaniacs.com
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He who has the best time wins.
Jerry
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Guy running in pink |
posted: 9/4/2008 at 8:18 PM
modified: 9/4/2008 at 8:19 PM |
| Quote from Bugs34 on 9/4/2008 at 6:02 PM: The crazy runner in me is thinking this would be fun. What is the ideal number of weeks in between if you just want to recover, and run the next one in about the same shape you were for the first one, but just for fun?
More information needed...
1. What is your average mpw? If you go into race #1 on 40 mpw, my experience is that it's gonna take you longer to recover and be ready for race #2 than if you typically run 70 mpw. This isn't a hard and fast rule, ymmv. But that's how it worked for me. When I can consistently run 75 mpw, I can run a lot more marathons closer together and finish with times that are close to each other AND I finish without feeling wiped out for days (or even hours). When I used to try to do it on 30-50 mpw, it was much harder.
2. What time are you shooting for in your first one... maybe not specifically x : xx, but more like, are you going all-out trying to BQ, PR, win an award? Are you planning on running an "average day" for you?
3. When you say that you want to run the second one "just for fun", what does that mean? Does it mean you don't care about your time? Would it still be fun if you finish but your race day was very painful and you ache for awhile? To some people, it would be... because "finish two" was their goal. To others it would not be.
As for joining the maniacs, we do get lots of people on the 2 in 2 weeks plan (16 days came up to allow for races on holiday mondays)... but we also get lots on the 3 in 3 months plan. 3 in 3 months is a lot more reasonable depending on how you answer #3 above.
ANYWAY.
In Advanced Marathoning, Pfitzinger gives plans for various gaps between two races... the smallest gap is 2 in 4 weeks.
I would heartily suggest making it 4 weeks or longer... AND you need to be flexible depending on how you recover from the first one. A lot of people get locked in on that second race because they pay $$$ for it in advance. Alas, if you get tweaked up in the first race and recovery goes slowly... hey, it happens... you have to be able to bag that second race. Listen to your body. |
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| view log Bugs |
posted: 9/4/2008 at 8:48 PM
modified: 9/4/2008 at 8:49 PM |
| Quote from srlopez on 9/4/2008 at 8:18 PM: More information needed...
1. What is your average mpw?
I would guess my average for the summer came close to 50. Should have 3 weeks of 60. I have nice miles with the exception of a set back this week. My first goal has been to beat 4:06 (my last time). I have more training miles in. The last time it was my first marathon and I made some newbie mistakes I won't repeat, if it wouldnt have been for that I would have been under four hours. After my last two marathons I was not ready to run a marathon four weeks later. I expect recovery to go better because of more miles. I have four runs over 20 in now, and the 20's are easy with no soreness afterwards.
Quote from srlopez on 9/4/2008 at 8:18 PM:More information needed...
2. What time are you shooting for in your first one... maybe not specifically x : xx, but more like, are you going all-out trying to BQ, PR, win an award? Are you planning on running an "average day" for you?
No awards, but I might be able to PR. I know to keep the pace and am not going to gun it the second half. No faster than 3:56. 3:58 is my PR but I did much better training, minus set back this week.
Quote from srlopez on 9/4/2008 at 8:18 PM:
3. When you say that you want to run the second one "just for fun", what does that mean? Does it mean you don't care about your time? Would it still be fun if you finish but your race day was very painful and you ache for awhile? To some people, it would be... because "finish two" was their goal. To others it would not be.
Would not care as much about time. No pain except for the typical tired legs the last 8 miles.
I wasn't trying for MM, I'm not that much of a gambler with my body. I was thinking 6-8 weeks but I don't have a race picked out. The Monkey Marathon fits the timeline but don't think I'd be hill ready in that time. |
B U G S (Like the bunny, not the bug)
g . b u g s @ h o t m a i l . c o m |
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posted: 9/4/2008 at 8:52 PM |
I'm doing 2 in 5 weeks. I've never run 2 in one season. So this shoudl be interesting. I've also never run a marathon that wasn't of the fire-all-of-your-guns-at-onece variety. The first one I'm going all in and will require significant recovery. The 2nd, not so much. Also I'm having a *ahem* proceedure a few days after marathon #1 that will likely keep me from training. So I expect I'll do little to no running the 2 weeks after marathon 1, then have 3 weeks of mostly easy mileage before marathon 2, which is, of course, The Monkey.
I'm really not all that bright. |
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Scout7 view logCPT Curmudgeon |
posted: 9/4/2008 at 8:56 PM |
| I've done 5 weeks apart, PR'ed on both. |
Amat victoria curam.
Sine labore nihil.
Dulcius ex asperis. |
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Guy running in pink |
posted: 9/4/2008 at 9:00 PM
modified: 9/4/2008 at 9:08 PM |
Well Monkey is already full and closed, unless maybe you bribe Trent with whatever it is that Trent likes.
Anyway, I think 4-6 weeks would be a good gap. You will still want to get in 1-2 long runs in between. It totally comes down to how long it takes you to recover from the first. I know some 4:00 marathoners that take 3-4 weeks to recover. And I know quite a few who are fine and ready to start running (not hardcore speedwork, but ready to go out and run 6-10 miles) within a couple days. And I know one 3:25-3:35 marathoner who is ok within a few hours, provided he eats. (edited to add: actually, I know a handful of people just like this 'cause we always seem to run near each other in the same races)
Take the time you need to recover.
Now, let's say you try for a six week gap, and then you run the second one and have a lot of fun. Should you have tried for a shorter gap in between? Perhaps. But it doesn't work so well the other way around... if you try 2 in 3 weeks and hurt yourself in the second one, you know the gap wasn't long enough. Hell of a way to learn, though.
Anyway, everyone is different. You have to learn for yourself. |
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Guy running in pink |
posted: 9/4/2008 at 9:03 PM |
| Quote from mikeymike on 9/4/2008 at 8:52 PM: I'm doing 2 in 5 weeks. I've never run 2 in one season. So this shoudl be interesting. I've also never run a marathon that wasn't of the fire-all-of-your-guns-at-onece variety. The first one I'm going all in and will require significant recovery. The 2nd, not so much. Also I'm having a *ahem* proceedure a few days after marathon #1 that will likely keep me from training. So I expect I'll do little to no running the 2 weeks after marathon 1, then have 3 weeks of mostly easy mileage before marathon 2, which is, of course, The Monkey.
I'm really not all that bright.
Mikey, I dunno what the procedure is, but good luck. I had a (probably different) "procedure" last week which has definitely derfed my training. Procedure aside (which you can't really look at it that way, but I'll say it anyway), I bet you'd surprise yourself at race #2.
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Boomer101 |
posted: 9/4/2008 at 10:30 PM |
Okay this year I have ran several marathons. Since October last year I ran the Marine Corps Marathon, then 2 weeks later I ran Suntrust Richmond. Ran 2 half marathons in Decemebr then January hit. I ran the Mississipi Blues and a week later ran First Light in Mobile. I waited a few weeks and ran Pensacola's marathon and a week later ran the Mardi Gras marathon. I have ran one a month since then and ran the Andy Payne Marathon in OKC the week before San Diego's RNR. The cool thing in all of these is that the second marathon has always been faster then the first one. I even PRed at the Mardi Gras marathon. My personal favorite was Richmond with 2 weeks in between them. That seemed to work best. I have had 3-5 weeks between some and that is almost too much time for me to screw things up in this multiple marathon quest.
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posted: 9/5/2008 at 12:25 AM |
Last year I did a local marathon 6 weeks after Boston. It was my first Boston, that and the lousy weather left me feeling like I hadn't given it everything I had. So I took a week off, then did the last 5 weeks of Pfitzinger's "6 weeks between marathons" plan. I ended up having a great race and setting my PR at the time (3:42, I only did 3:53 at Boston).
Anyway, 6 weeks between 'thons worked well for me, but I doubt if I'd want to do any closer together than that, unless I wasn't racing them at all, just doing a long training run (4:30+ time). |
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posted: 9/5/2008 at 12:36 PM |
| Quote from srlopez on 9/4/2008 at 9:00 PM: Well Monkey is already full and closed, unless maybe you bribe Trent with whatever it is that Trent likes.
Not a big deal, I wasn't exactly targeting it as I think it is too hillly for me. Plus I strained my ankle last weekend in a house improvement project (training around that now) and I'm not signing up for anything for awhile.
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B U G S (Like the bunny, not the bug)
g . b u g s @ h o t m a i l . c o m |
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......Simply outstanding........ 