Realistic First Marathon Target time (Read 3780 times)

I think this is the point when I have to admit that I know very little about training beginning marathoners.

I think you'd do fine with beginning marathoners. It's training the low volume marathoner you'd suck at.

Sorry to high jack the topic, but I like the discussion.  To me, we left the training for marathons a while ago, and transformed this into

The nature versus nuture discussion -

As far as ability, there is fairly good evidence that there is optimal body characteristics for certain sports.  Although this includes type of muscle fibers (although simplified to slow and fast twitch, there is actually a continuum), it also includes height, weight, skeletal structure etc.  The best endurance athletes have a preponderance of slow twitch, and sprinters fast twitch.  Although training has been shown to change the relative amount, this is more of a statistical difference than a large difference.  This debate still rages on in the literature, but so far it looks like genetic predisposition holds the upper hand.  

I won't venture into the optimal body shape, but will say it is rare to see a high jumper less than 6 foot. I will also say I am impressed with DB accomplishments, as he is not typical for marathoners.  But as already stated, he is also not an elite at this distance.  I can go on about other differences, such as ability to build muscle or withstand the stress of heavy workouts based on genetic differences.  On top of this, especially in endurance sports, is the years of training that it takes to get to the next levels. 

This is similar to our ability to learn.  Some are gifted in mathematics and or sciences, or literature or language.

Regardless of the starting point, I think we can all agree that the end point is also very dependent on training. 

I'm not sure there is much mystery with the nature v. nurture argument. For the vast majority of us, the more we put in the more we get out of something. Daniels divided runners into four categories in "Running Formula". I think most of us here fall into the "Lots of Desire without world class DNA". That doesnt mean you cant be a good or very good runner. I've been reading "Talent is Overrated" (its easy and fast if anybody is interested). In that book, there is a wide range of people that can do any particular job. But, its those that put in the long hours that are likely to make it to the top. And, there is Malcom Gladwell's book "Outliers" that basically says the same thing. Bill Gates, for example, started programming when he was a kid. While most of us dont have the ability to become the next Microsoft of Marathons, we can become successful startups.

I am interested in the marathon target time. How does anybody pick one out. Isnt every race different? Every training different? Personally, I feel okay having a goal time. But, how does an experienced marathon runner adjust how they are doing mid-race? Esp. if its a course they have never done.

I am interested in the marathon target time. How does anybody pick one out. Isnt every race different? Every training different? Personally, I feel okay having a goal time. But, how does an experienced marathon runner adjust how they are doing mid-race? Esp. if its a course they have never done.

I will try to answer this question--or at least turn it into another set of questions.

I think experienced marathoners know marathon effort. They can feel it in their workouts, and they know it in their races. They extrapolate goal times from their effort. Experienced runners also know more or less within 5 minutes what they are capable of on a given day because, well, they are experienced.

For newer marathoners, it is really difficult to pin down the time you are capable of, especially in your first marathon. The best thing to do, I think, is come up with a reasonable, conservative goal. Err on the side of caution--run your basic easy pace--then crank it in over the last six miles. Chances are you will leave some time on the table with this method, but that's not the worst thing that can happen in your first marathon!

I think you'd do fine with beginning marathoners. It's training the low volume marathoner you'd suck at.

So true. +1

mta: If you are a runner, not a jogger like mikeymike, a realistic first marathon target time should be <4:00.

From where I sit, tmca didn't call out Dopple Bock. He simply--clumsily perhaps--tried to pay him a compliment.

So you're calling out Jeff's ability to discern intent on the Internet?

I'm going way out on a limb there, I know.

Jeff,

I'm not entirely a beginner at the marathon, but I'm also not experienced - at least, not enough to know what marathon effort is. I don't know how to pace to race a marathon -- I'm tempted to just take my PR pace and try to run that pace. Which would running to a number, which is probably the opposite of running to an effort level.