Courtesy of letsrun...

Jeff

posted: 5/23/2007 at 11:56 AM

Thanks, guys. I've looked through the Lannana stuff, and it looks really good. There are definitely some sick workouts in there (6xmile at 5k pace Shocked

). I think that it will be beneficial for me now that I've built a pretty strong base to hit the track hard a couple of times a week. Today's session of 3xmile went the same way as the last stuff I've been doing. I feel great and strong, but when the least bit of lactic starts to accumulate, I fall apart. If I'm reading my body right, that means my anaerobic system is weak. It's like the lactic threshold is a thin, thin line, with strong aerobic running on one side and a deep abyss of pain and suffering on the other. I'd like to generate a little space in the middle, where lactate accumulates slowly and doesn't swamp me. When I was running really fast, that's how my races felt. I think that more work at or around 5k pace will do it.

The Logic of Long Distance

ultrastevep

Wasatch Speedgoat

posted: 5/23/2007 at 12:08 PM

...and maybe you just need a break for a bit. You have been running some really great times on the roads!

Life is short, play hard!

mikeymike

posted: 5/23/2007 at 12:08 PM

Jeff, my .02 (with absolutely no credentials at 5K) is what you are feeling is very normal for the first few workouts. Try doing 5K pace workouts a bit slower than actual 5K pace for now. Maybe like 5-7 secs per mile, 1-2 secs per lap slower than 5K. Also, it helps to break yourself in with shorter reps like 800s, then 1000s then mile. If you do that, over a period of a 5 weeks you'll see 5K pace get much easier. Balance that with another workout of longer, slower (10k to HM pace) reps like 1000s to 3000s. To maintain and keep moving LT.

Runners run.

Jeff

posted: 5/23/2007 at 12:29 PM

Yeah, I think I'm starting to get impatient, and maybe trying to run too hard. I'm having this exciting thought that I can get to where 5:00 pace is kind of comfortable, and maybe I'm giving that thought too much weight. The idea today was to run 5:15's, which I think would have been better than 5:10, 5:10, bomb, but I was running on a mile loop without any marks, so I ran too fast on the first one. And then I have a hard time slowing myself down. I also now think that maybe I should have taken more rest between the miles. And Steve, you're probably right that I need a break. Tired legs sounds like a good explanation. I'm definitely taking a down week this week, probably under 50 miles...but I signed up for a 10k this weekend. Maybe I'll just run it as a progression, starting at 5:40ish, then picking it up if I feel good. My goal race is a 10 miler on June 16th. It's a big local race, and I'd like to finish well and maybe run 5:35's. I feel like it's possible if I could just get a little zip in the legs!

The Logic of Long Distance

abe_mend

posted: 5/23/2007 at 12:44 PM

Jeff, I think you're right by taking more rest in between considering the pace and the distance of the intervals. We used to do a workout of 3/4 x 1600m at 5k pace and we took at least 4 minutes in between. I think that 2.5 minutes of rest would have been more appropriate for cruise intervals. Also, I always liked to get in some good mile stuff (i.e. train with the 1500m guys) if I was training for a 5k. They would hand me my ass, but that way the 5:00 pace felt like a breeze. Good luck with the 10-miler!

There was a point in my life when I ran. Now, I just run.

Back beat, the word was on the street
That the fire in your heart is out
I'm sure you've heard it all before
But you never really had a doubt

The Diary of a Once-ran.

ultrastevep

Wasatch Speedgoat

posted: 5/25/2007 at 10:16 AM

Latest fave thread.... http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=1925056

Life is short, play hard!

Jeff

posted: 5/29/2007 at 9:02 AM

From this thread (started by Gerry Lindgren): http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=1936561&page=1

What's happened with running in the west today is that we "know" so much that no one experiements anymore. Everyone is afraid that if they stray outside the accepted boundaries of intelligent training they'll fall apart. While I'm not saying everyone should run a mile PR in a workout and then hang on for another nine miles, I am saying that it's generally people who don't accept conventional limitations who make the big breakthroughs. So much of what we read about successful preparation for the sport is about physiology that we're losing sight of the emotional and mental aspects which I think really are much more important to an individual's success or failure.

The Logic of Long Distance

ultrastevep

Wasatch Speedgoat

posted: 5/29/2007 at 11:09 AM

I just finished reading Gerry's book....he was insane! Buy the book through his website and he signs it and returns ti to you for 14 bucks! http://www.gerrylindgren.com/

Life is short, play hard!

sfh1182

Sine Metu

posted: 5/29/2007 at 12:48 PM

Jeff, good find on that thread.

A lot of pressure in the middle of those shoulders / And we ain't gettin nothing but older / Ain't nothing change but the day we run from / But nobody knows that better than you,huh

ultrastevep

Wasatch Speedgoat

posted: 5/29/2007 at 3:22 PM

Summer of Malmo http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=1936989&page=0

Life is short, play hard!

Jeff

posted: 6/8/2007 at 7:24 PM
modified: 6/8/2007 at 7:36 PM

Good stuff, here. Including our own ultrastevep: http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=1952673 To continue an old conversation, I found out that 80mpw + intense track sessions is too much for me at this stage of training. Especially trying to keep all my main runs under 7 min pace. Either that, or the 3 or 4 hard sessions I did the last couple of weeks on top of all the volume I've done this year put me in a hole. So, the next phase of experimentation (beginning in Spain) will be to cut back on the pace of my "everyday" runs to 7:30 pace and trying to run some quality intensity every third day or so, alternating very intense short reps (200's, 400's, 600's) with longer hard efforts (repeat miles or 4-5 mile tempos) and a long run (2 hrs). Basically, I'll drop the idea of "moderate" training and go for a blend of hard and easy. Ideally, I'd like to keep my mileage up around 9-10hrs (70-90 miles) per week plus intensity every third day. I was able to handle that volume without much problem, but could not add intensity to the mix.

The Logic of Long Distance

jgoldsborough