Yesterday's LR was frustrating in that I could not finish my planned last 10 miles at GMP -- I came up a hill roughly 2.5 miles from home and was just pooped. No amount of wanting to go faster would get me back on pace and I felt overheated.
So what's the best way to get in GMP miles when it's much hotter than conditions should be for the target race? More on MLRs or even just normal training days?
My coach recommends that all workouts be adjusted for weather and provides a chart on how to do so.
I would do the GMP adjusted for weather. You cannot expect to hit MP in 90F vs. 60F; the effort is not the same and you end up working at a harder effort than MP. That, IMO, is a better choice than just doing the easy miles instead.
Damaris
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You can't run GMP in the heat unless you can somehow change the laws of physics. You adjust and do what you can.
Short term goal: 17:59 5K
Mid term goal: 2:54:59 marathon
Long term goal: To say I've been a runner half my life. (I started running at age 45).
My coach recommends that all workouts be adjusted for weather and provides a chart on how to do so. I would do the GMP adjusted for weather. You cannot expect to hit MP in 90F vs. 60F; the effort is not the same and you end up working at a harder effort than MP. That, IMO, is a better choice than just doing the easy miles instead.
i wonder where he got the chart from.
”Failing to prepare is preparing to fail.”
“Whether you think you can, or you think you can't--you're right.”
Tomas
He created his own but it follows similar ones that I've found on the internet.
Having said that, most of these charts and adjustment tables take into consideration heat index. Dewpoint is not fully part of that equation and I've found that the higher the dewpoint, the higher the adjustment (higher than the table suggests).
Chasing Muses
Someone else asked this question last week, and I thought alot about it. You can adjust so that your pace feels like MP (or any other pace that requires given effort) feels like MP though it's slower because of the effects of the heat, but do you get the adaptations one would expect from a true MP run? I would agree that you should adjust, and get as much value out of te workout as you can, but I would expect that the answer is no, an MP run at a pace adjusted for the weather is not an MP run.
I disagree. I think it is. Running MP pace in 90F is not really running MP pace (it's actually faster) so why wouldn't running at similar effort than MP be as close to MP as you can. It's all about effort and how hard your body is working, not the number.
Healed Hammy
Slow down so that others might have a chance to win some races in your area. Geeze Jay, please don't get any faster, its not fair to the rest of the community there.
Here is my guess although I don't have any data to support my speculation. Muscularly, the benefit will be somewhat reduced. Running 20-30 seconds slower per mile may feel like the same level of effort but you are not working your muscles as hard. Of course, your heart rate will likely be a bit higher even if you do reduce your pace. I notice that even on easy runs in hot weather, my heart rate is around 150 rather than the 140 it is in cooler weather. Similarly, I'll finish marathon pace runs around 160 and that's typically more like tempo effort. Thus, I think that you get more aerobic benefit but reduced muscular benefit and it's probably a wash between the two.
Smaller By The Day
GMP isn't supposed to be anaerobic is it? I mean, you could head for the dreadmill, but studies out of Oregon suggest that training in heat may be as beneficial as altitude training. If GMP is aerobic, and heat improves fitness, and you need to ease up to complete your training run...I say do it.
Improvements
Weight 100 pounds lost
5K 31:02 Sept. 2012 / 23:36 Sept. 2013 (Same Course)
10K 48:59 April 2013
HM 2:03:56 Nov. 2012 / 1:46:50 March 2013
MARATHON 3:57:33 Nov. 2013
Go figure
One of the interesting things about your question is that it presumes that running GMP miles is essential to meeting your marathon goals. That idea is very much in line with the way Pfitz and Hanson do their training, but I don't see it as much in the Hudson program I follow.
In fact, in the whole Marathon Level 3 plan that I use as a guide, there may be all of 4 MP runs in the 20 week schedule (3 of which come in the sharpening phase between weeks 18 & 20). Now, that characterization isn't entirely fair since there are a lot of "moderate" miles, which are essentialy done near MP. Still, those miles are effort based, so it's not about hitting a goal pace specifically. Instead of the MP miles, there's a lot of work done at paces from 10k-HMP, and then hill sprints and lots of slower running too.
What I've generally found is that I'm pretty okay handling these faster efforts in the heat, because the work bouts aren't as long as those that are at MP. I know I would struggle to handle 8+ MP miles in this weather as well, but fortunately, I'm not being asked to do it.
All of that isn't to say that I haven't struggled with the weather as well, and I have had to accept missing my paces occasionally. I've just taken the "as much as I can, as fast as I can" approach, and been willing to call that a win. If I were attempting more MP miles, I'm sure my strategy would be the same.
Trying to find some more hay to restock the barn
In fact, in the whole Marathon Level 3 plan that I use as a guide, there may be all of 4 MP runs in the 20 week schedule (3 of which come in the sharpening phase between weeks 18 & 20).
I suppose the actual importance of running at MP depends on which plan you are following. There are a total of three marathon paced runs in Daniels' marathon plan A, the majority of the rest of the plan consists of intervals done at tempo pace, which is obviously faster than marathon pace presenting an even bigger quandary.
Take this bullet in the head of a workout for example, which would be run on or about the second week of August, if your event is in the third week of October:
2 miles easy
12 minutes at tempo pace
2 minute rest
10 miles easy
20 minutes at tempo pace
Aye!
As to the OP, I guess I would attempt to get as close to GMP as possible, in order to complete as much of that days intended workout as I could without blowing up. Or, instead of running 10 miles at GMP in the middle of an 14 mile run (with 2 easy on either side) reduce the number of GMP miles and increase the easy miles, so maybe 8 at GMP with 3 on either side.
Are we there, yet?
If you were racing in that weather on that course, what would your GMP be? As has been pointed out many times, the body doesn't know distance and by implication pace, it knows time and intensity or effort. You'd adjust your pace if you raced under those conditions, so why wouldn't you adjust it during training.
2024 Races:
03/09 - Livingston Oval Ultra 6-Hour, 22.88 miles
05/11 - D3 50K 05/25 - What the Duck 12-Hour
06/17 - 6 Days in the Dome 12-Hour.
For the sake of discussion let me throw this hypothetical out there based on your answer: a runner is unable to train for a significant time at GMP during training due to heat but the event is expected to be run under ideal conditions (45 degrees for example), should the original time goal be thrown out the window, or will the adaptations to running in heat translate to that of possible GMP on race day?
KillJoyFuckStick
Unless you're traveling to a vastly different climate there will be an adaption period you're body goes through. It isn't likely the temps will go from 105° one week to 45° the next week.
You people have issues