Corporate challenge 5 miler this morning. 31:23 for a PR by over 2 minutes from last year. Felt smooth and comfortable. Tomorrow is my 30k. Lets see how that works out.
Great race!
I will be very impressed if you still have gas left in the tank for 30k .
Is the 30k a long run and not a race?
Run until the trail runs out.
2012**Run 40 miles week
50 miler**100 miler
PR 5K**10K**26.2
http://bkclay.blogspot.com/
Me too Clay
30k this morning and what a surprise, we have a couple of decent hills in Indianapolis. Finished in 2:23:20 or a 7:43 pace. I ran about 10 consecutive miles at sub MP (<7:38) but I did not wear a watch so I could only go by feel.
It was a great run and I had lots left over. I think I am peaking at the correct time. Tomorrow however is a nice and easy recovery day.
Oh and the post race ice bath was wonderful (after the first minute that is)
Norm! Bravo!
--Jimmy
CRUSTED SALT ~comic strip for runners~NEW #40 "Bold Face Q Race Director Blues"
running log profile
blog / running of the bulls / plays
ExerciseVS.TrainingBlogPost
A 5-mile test should be a breeze for you, in terms of load during this final month. If you get one or two in before the race, it'll be some great info for determining fitness for later races. --Jimmy
A 5-mile test should be a breeze for you, in terms of load during this final month. If you get one or two in before the race, it'll be some great info for determining fitness for later races.
Did a test last week and I ran it at 7:58 pace, need to check what that correlates to in terms of pace for a marathon.
Based on mcmillan from my races a few months ago.....
10k - 38:30 = 3:00
1/2 Marathon = 1:26:08 - 3:01
How accurate do you guys think mcmillan is?
Did a test last week and I ran it at 7:58 pace, need to check what that correlates to in terms of pace for a marathon. Based on mcmillan from my races a few months ago..... 10k - 38:30 = 3:00 1/2 Marathon = 1:26:08 - 3:01 How accurate do you guys think mcmillan is?
Bz - I'm not a huge proponent of McMillan accuracy for the "general" runner. I believe that his pace times are based on a fit or solid aerobic system with plenty of base miles. Can't give a number but I bet its 60 per week or more. If this isn't the case for the particular runner, the longer distance estimates will be too agressive or optimistic. At least by my personal experience anf that of some others who's training I know.
If you have the base and the proper training plan, I think they are pretty good estimators.
Alternatively you can try Oregon pace wizzard. I've not compared the two to each other but it would be another resource.
Bz - looking at your log, you've got some solid base miles. Not sure how the layoff will effect your run. Based on what I see, it looks like 3:10 is there but who knows what race day will bring. Some more experienced marathoners recommended to go out on pace, be conservative, see what your body tells you as the miles go forward. If things are feeling good at 15 you can adjust from there.
I hope it brings cleear skies, max temp of 55 and no winds so you can get to Boston. Hopefully I can meet you there next year if my shot in Nov comes off successfully.
based on half:
Team Oregon PW: 3:02:11
10K:
half--1:26:11
full---3:02:10
Just looking at your relationship of your half-marathon to the 10k, it shows good endurance, as you are hitting the number right on.
My experience from 2005 + 2006:
2005
half: 1:36:21 (Pace Wizard gives 3:23:47 for marathon) temp 60º
ran marathon in 3:28:10 split: 1:44:36/1:43:34 temp 55º
(I ran a 3:28 pace plan--couldn't have done any better)
2006
half: 1:34:27 (pace Wizard gives 3:19:46 for marathon) temp 57º
ran Philly marathon in 3:22:18 split 1:40:35/1:41:43 temp 48º
(could have done at least 1-2 minutes better, as I didn't do my
usual push the last 3 miles or so due to an injured foot. I let myself
slow a bit.)
I think Team Oregon Pace Wizard is a touch more conservative in the marathon time it gives you. As Norm said, you have to be well rested, in top aerobic shape, and get excellent weather. In my 2006 marathon, the temp was perfect, in the 40's, and I came pretty close to the number.
The MAF (1st mile) correlation to pace chart was pretty close for the 2006 Philly marathon. My first mile pace was 8:15 in my best test. That correlated with 3:19-3:21 on the chart. That chart was an extension on Dr. Phil's chart. i took all the 5k times and popped them into the Mcmillan Calculator. It was within 2 minutes of my finishing time for Sugarloaf in 2006. It was within 4 minutes of VCM 2008, I was 4 minutes slower as it was very hot and sunny that day.
For me, it's been a good "Ballpark" indicator.
MAF....5k pace....5k time.....Marathon.....Mpace 10:00..7:30..........23:18..........3:47:09...........8:41 9:30....7:15..........22:31..........3:39:31...........8:23 9:00....7:00..........21:45..........3:32:02...........8:06 8:30....6:45..........20:58..........3:24:24...........7:49 8:00....6:30..........20:12..........3:16:55...........7:31 7:30....6:00..........18:38..........3:01:39...........6:56 7:00....5:30..........17:05..........2:46:32...........6:22 6:30....5:15..........16:19..........2:39:04...........6:05 6:00....5:00..........15:32..........2:31:26...........5:47 5:45....4:45..........14:45..........2:23:48...........5:30 5:30....4:30..........13:59..........2:16:19...........5:12 5:15....4:20..........13:28..........2:11:17...........5:01 5:00....4:15..........13:12....... ..2:08:41...........4:55
What was the first mile time in your recent MAF test?
Thanks for all of that feedback and information, sorry it took me a little while to respond. It does look like the calculators are a few minutes off, not just for you, but from what I have seen from other people as well, but still in the ballpark. First mile was 7:55, ran pretty even on a flat course and cool night
MAF....5k pace....5k time.....Marathon.....Mpace
7:30....6:00..........18:38..........3:01:39...........6:56
For me,
7:58......5:55.........18:18............
I wish there were other races to compare that to, I'm a firm believer that a 5k is the furthest thing from a true marathon indicator. You can have no aerobic base and go out and run a good or fast 5k. I think you have to go minimum 10k or more to get an ideal target time.
Well I'm a little over a week out and I think I'm going to go out at 1:32-1:33 for the first half and see how I feel like CR said. Once I get to miles 18-20 I'll obviously have a better idea as to how its going to turn out. Will keep everyone posted.
After your race, we'll compare your marathon time to the chart I made, see if if the your 7:55 first mile MAF test time was more indicative of your endurance than the 10k time. Over time, as you get a few more marathons under your belt, and have MAF tests from the weeks before it, you'll know where your MAF tests will need to be in order for you to achieve a certain performance. The faster you are at MAF, the more endurance. My guess is 3:08-3:10 based on your MAF. It's very difficult to achieve the McMillan number, and going for it could result in a time worse than you were able to really do.
I think going out 1:33 in the first half is much wiser than 1:30. I suggest starting slower than 1:33 pace the first 3-4 miles, then get up to that pace. Even if you went out in 1:35, if your endurance is really 3:06, then you'll smoke the back 13.1.
If your endurance is really 3:09-3:10. then you'll be right on target.
I wish you the best, no matter what your plan ends up being. May there be no wall, and may your mental strength be great enough to maintain your pace in the home stretch!
Good luck and great temps!
--jimmy
HM pedictiion 1:55:30. Garmin time1:54:35. Great weather. 60 F Overcast for the entire race. Stayed with pl;anned HR of 157-162. Prediction charts called for AHR 168. I dedcide to be more conservative. Leg did not give me any promblems. Need to stop at 9.5 miles for port-a-potty. Lost about :30. Great race mangement. Time clock at every mile marker.Time clock at half way mark .Did not think to check the time. Hopefully the race will show the split time. AHR -9 beats below 10 mile race 3 weeks ago. Pace of 8:45 today. 8:40 pace for ten miler. 13.1 not nearly has stressfully as 10 miler. Weather was about 10 degress cooler today.
Nice job Clay. Your race went better than mine. Report to follow.
Twin Cities Marathon.
Temp: 43 to start, 50 at finish
Time: 4:27:07
Avg HR: 161
9:29 160
9:30 168
9:32 170
9:19 166
9:10 166
9:08 167
9:04 168
9:24 164
9:21 165
9:24 162
9:07 166
9:24 166
9:28 165
9:45 165
9:33 165
9:54 164
9:45 164
10:10 163
9:51 165
10:19 163
11:32 159
12:08 156
12:02 154
12:08 149
12:10 149
12:16 150
4:00 163 (.45 miles on Garmin)
Something wasn't right today. My HR was 120 just standing in the coral. At this point, I decided I would not display my HR during the race. Miles one and two involved a lot of people dodging. I took one of my shirts off just before the 2 mile point and realized about 50 yds later that my headphones were gone. Had to run back to retrieve them. Bottom line...I didn't feel good from the start. I gagged on the course at least a couple dozen times. This stopped after about mile 15. I think I may have eaten too much this morning. I got up at 4:00 AM to eat. I figured 4 hours would be enough time to digest a large meal. I guessed wrong. The GUs and Mountain Berry Blast Powerade did not sit too well with my stomach, but I managed to suck down 4 GUs and about twelve 6 oz cups of the nasty Powerade. After a few miles, I realized this was not going to be my day, so I figured I would back off for the rest of the race...especially the last 6.2. No sense risking an injury by trying to run 4:20 rather than 4:27. I took plenty of walk breaks in the last 6.2 which is mostly uphill. The course is much more hilly than I thought. The elevation chart does not tell the whole story.
Frustrations aside, I'm still happy that I finished my first marathon. There's nothing like the thrill of crossing the finish line. I still feel a sense of accomplishment. I also understand that my limited milage while training for this race isn't exactly the recipe for a fast time.
The elevated HR today is something that concerns me. I can accept a few beats due to adrenaline, but today 's situation was bizarre. two weeks ago, I did 12 miles of the same pace chart I was trying to follow today. Here are the results of that run:
Temp: 63F, DP: 55F
Total time: 1:49:32
Avg Pace: 9:08
Avg HR: 154 (MAF+11)
As you can see, my HR was in some cases, 20-25 beats lower than today...and I comfortably hit all the splits during the run. Additionally, it was 20 degrees warmer that day. The marathon course is more hilly, but it shouldn't account for that big of a difference in HR. Extreme elevated HRs has been an issue in all of the races I've run (all 4 of them). This problem needs to be solved before I run any more races.
© 2012 RunningAHEAD.com. All rights reserved. | Privacy