Low HR Training

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Low Mileage, how to build up? (Read 1113 times)


Beginner all over again

    Hi Everyone,

    I'm at a point where I need to build up time/mileage.

    I was doing Galloway Training, which was Run/Walk, 3 times a week about 10 miles per week, sometimes a bit more every other week when I included a Long Run.

     

    Now I'm switching over to LHR training and am looking for a way to increase time on feet.

     

    Any comments? 

    Increase the two short runs?

    Continue a long run? .longer, and longer, or shorten it back up and rebuild it back up again?

    Add a 4th day?

     

    I was reading another post about the concern becoming Training self to be come a Good Walker instead of a Good Runner, especially on just a few hours per week.

     

    My Galloway goal was to be Still Doing this Run/Walk (running, exercising) after one year.

    And I've met that goal. I'm still lacing up and going out.

     

    Now my goal is more to increase my pace at LHR, to build aerobic capacity.

    On  HR<MAF I am doing Run/Walk about 2:1, sometimes 3:1 ratio

    So I still need to do a significant amount of walking to stay under MAF.

     

    But I keep reading that under 15 miles per week "isn't enough" mileage to benefit from LHR training.

    So I am thinking time to increase my mileage.

     

    And I'm looking for comments, maybe someone will suggest an option I hadn't considered yet.

    So, how to increase?  My log should be public.

    Thank you!

     

      I can only tell you what I did myself

       

      increase long run

      then increase middle length runs

      short runs are last to be increased because they are recovery runs.

       

      of course you've heard the 10% rule often as well Smile

       

      and yes if you have time for more workouts and you recover fast enough then add days... I went from 3 days to 6 days in a few months. actually going from 4 to 5 was a bit hard because I didn't cut back on intensity (I just didn't think of doing so, unfortunately). I went to 6 AND cut back in intensity because that's when I started MAF'ing Smile

       

      but pay attention to your body's signals.. do you feel like going out next day? do you get too tired when increasing the length of the long run or do you get little injuries after it? do you need more sleep / a LOT more food?

       

      and maybe most interesting: do you get to feel within a few hours after the workout that you're ready to go out and do it again? or only next day? or 2nd day? when I did the 4 to 5 days transition (with same intensity at MAF+10, bad bad), it happened less often that I felt ready for another workout in the next few hours same day. (of course I think it doesn't necessarily mean you should go for a second workout, it's just a nice feeling.) I did feel ready next day but that wasn't the same thing and I welcomed the rest days a lot more than when I was doing only 4 days a week.

       

      but back to MAF, I think there is a lot less chance to receive such signals from your body (i.e. signals that you are doing too much).. I've had no problem with 6 days @MAF and probably 7 would be just fine too. but just my experience anyway!

      gregw


        My opinion:  add a fourth run, then a fifth, then a sixth, ....

          Looks like you are using Stu Mittleman zones.

           

          When you run/walk, how hard do you walk? Does your HR drop down or do you try to walk fast enough to keep HR in the same zone as your running?

           

           

          Looks like you are currently peaking at 5 hours, and it looked like this:


          1) 1:05 MEP 135-145

          2) 0:30  walk

          3) 1:00  MAP 115-135

          4) off

          5) 1:00  MAP 115-135

          6) off

          7) 1:30  MAP 115-135

           

          Looks like you had an injured foot in December. Was that from run/walking?

           

          It looks like you have been increasing already from month to month. You increase 40% from Feb '10 to March (10% per week). March was a 30% increase over November 09. How's this rate of increase working for you? Have you shown progress in pace at the same HR? Are you using a specific run/walk as a way to measure your aerobic progress (like an MAF test)?

           

          If you continue to increase at this rate, you will have to make some choices about where in your schedule to put the time. One thing to do is to set a time limit on your hard days, and once you reach those limits, start adding time to your easy days.

           

          e.g. (3 hard days per 7 days)

           

          1) off

          2) :30 walk

          3) 1:30  MAP 115-135

          4):30 walk

          5) 1:00 MEP 135-145

          6) off

          7) 2:30  MAP 115-135

           

           Let's say the above are what you chose for limits on hard days. Once you reach them , add to the recovery days on day 2 +4, but don't go past a certain limit.

           

          If you do regular MAF tests, they will let you know when the load gets to be too much.

           

          --Jimmy

           

           

          "may you staaaaaaaaayyyyyyyy... forever young" B.Dylan

          log

          Ran_On_Empty


            I stumbled apon this forum as a result of my own stupidity.  Been a runner for many yrs, but stopped to hatch a few youngins.  Read the book 'Born to Run' and got reinspired to do a marathon.  In my stupidity I was doing a modified Maffeltone program, but with a mid week LT hill workout.  I then stumbled upon a article in RW about increasing the number of runs being helpful.  I started doing that program with great sucess.  It was based on run time.  Work your way up to running/walking six days a week 45 minutes.  Do that for two weeks.  Then you start adding a second workout on two days per week. 20 minutes.   Do that for two week and if you feel good at the end of that two weeks add another workout fot two more weeks until you can do that cofortably.  Keep adding extra workouts until you get to two workouts for five days and a longer run on the weekend.  Rest on the last day.  Then you can start to add in time on the base until you reach 60minutes.  Then add in time at the top to 40 minutes.  I was able to get to 60miles/wk.  This takes time and it fell apart for me when my new son was born 4 months ago.  Newborn don't watch tv while dad is on the treadmill!!

             

            Good luck!

            I have stopped the Lactate Threshold workouts after a painful marathon.  Will build a base for awhile.  Did the low HR for about 13 weeks before I ratched it up. Was running 20 under MAF. Found this forum when I was trying to prove to myself that low HR was the way to go.  Didn't realize that I was too low. Max HR 175ish and I was going at 120-125 for 1hr 45min. This was pushing my into anarobic at a low HR. Did not lose weight, built strengh though.

            Paul


            Beginner all over again

               

              One thing to do is to set a time limit on your hard days, and once you reach those limits, start adding time to your easy days.

               

              e.g. (3 hard days per 7 days)

               

               

              1) off

              2) :30 walk

              3) 1:30  MAP 115-135

              4):30 walk

              5) 1:00 MEP 135-145

              6) off

              7) 2:30  MAP 115-135

               

               Let's say the above are what you chose for limits on hard days. Once you reach them , add to the recovery days on Day 2 & 4, but don't go past a certain limit. 

               

              This is exactly what I was thinking of....

              Increasing my hard days to Maximum Time, then slowly adding to the walk days, eventually leaving two rest days-off.

               

              I changed my graph to reflect MAF, not MAP.  

              I do JogWalk at Garmin alarms 127-133

               

               

               


              Beginner all over again

                I can only tell you what I did myself

                 

                increase long run

                then increase middle length runs

                short runs are last to be increased because they are recovery runs.

                 

                ....yes if you have time for more workouts and you recover fast enough then add days... I went from 3 days to 6

                 

                 

                Thanks for sharing, I appreciate your note

                 


                Beginner all over again

                  My opinion:  add a fourth run, then a fifth, then a sixth, ....

                   

                  Thanks

                  That's what I was thinking of too.

                   

                  Just wasn't sure whether to lower all runs to Very Short runs and build one day at a time,

                  or to increase the Hard days to Maximum Time first and then add a 4th and 5th.

                  I can't imagine adding a sixth day at my age...

                   

                  Maybe I'm still way too out of shape to imagine that...it's not age, but lack of fitness...?...

                  Maybe my 3 days are Too Hard so I can't imagine adding a 4th or 5th?

                  Does that mean I should lower my Hard Days to :30 mins tops and add a 4th day?

                   

                  So many options, and I am enjoying hearing the comments

                  Thanks for posting

                   


                  Beginner all over again

                     

                    Keep adding extra workouts until you get to two workouts for five days and a longer run on the weekend.

                     

                    Hi Paul,

                    Sounds as if you did a great job increasing your mileage and doing double workouts on days.

                    Wow.

                    That's certainly an option -- I wonder whether my schedule (job, kids, Life) would accommodate double workouts just yet...it's something to consider

                    Thanks for sharing.

                    Welcome to the forum here.

                     

                    gregw


                       

                      Thanks

                      That's what I was thinking of too.

                       

                      Just wasn't sure whether to lower all runs to Very Short runs and build one day at a time,

                      or to increase the Hard days to Maximum Time first and then add a 4th and 5th.

                      I can't imagine adding a sixth day at my age...

                       

                      Maybe I'm still way too out of shape to imagine that...it's not age, but lack of fitness...?...

                      Maybe my 3 days are Too Hard so I can't imagine adding a 4th or 5th?

                      Does that mean I should lower my Hard Days to :30 mins tops and add a 4th day?

                       

                      So many options, and I am enjoying hearing the comments

                      Thanks for posting

                       

                      At your age?  You're only 45!  If adding a 4th day seems hard you're doing too much (intensity or duration).  Looking at your log, you've ramped up the duration of your long run pretty quickly and now it's almost half your weekly duration.  I'd cut *at least* a half hour out of that and add a fourth run.

                      I forgot your goal.  Sorry.  Are you working towards gallowalk/running a marathon?  If so, and if it's soon, then maybe the long run stays.  This is just my opinion.

                      Recently, I've weeks near 70 miles on 10-11 runs a week and my longest is 12-14 miles.  This is *way* easier than when I was doing 70 miles on ~8 runs in 6 days with a 20+ miler each week.  I'm also pretty convinced I could run a fair marathon without running more than 15 miles.


                      Beginner all over again

                        This is *way* easier than when I was doing 70 miles on ~8 runs in 6 days with a 20+ miler each week

                        ============================================================================

                        Thanks for the explanation.

                         

                        My Goals:

                        I would like to run a marathon, yes....

                        but I don't want to Do a 6 hr marathon

                        I'm not even sure I want to Do a 5 hr marathon

                         

                        I am thinking I would rather "just train and train and train some more"

                        until my Pace improves and I can run a marathon in 4 hrs-something

                        (BQ is 4hrs right on it for me, as a comparison)

                         

                        So I might just Train and Train and Train some more until 2013 .....and then enter a Marathon then.

                         

                        So I don't need a LongRun progression anymore.

                        I'm entering a HM next week, the LR were for that.

                        But now, LR no important unless it's a part of good LHR training

                         

                        Which is kind of why now I am at the point of, hmm., what should I do next?

                        My HM is going to be over soon, the Short-Short-Long training runs were a prep for that.

                         

                        I don't want to Do a 5-hr marathon, so....I'm in Long-Term training mode I think.

                         

                        I do enter 5K and 10K for the fun of it with my friends, but I don't have to race it, they would just be training runs, maybe a MEP MAP+10 run, or maybe just a MAF run

                        My point is, the weekend road-races would just be venues for Training  Runs.

                         

                        gregw


                          FracesRe,


                          Sounds like you have the right attitude.  First thing, good luck on that HM!


                          Looking at your weekly duration totals, you're averaging ~3 hrs / week over the last couple of months.  I would break that up into 5 runs with each 30-45 minutes (e.g., 2x45 + 3x30).  Get used to that and then add another run.  Maybe start at 20' for that run and add to it until you have another 30-45' run a week.  Personally I think limiting your long run to 20-25% of weekly mileage (duration) is a good idea, but it's hard to do if you don't run more than 5 times!

                            Found this forum when I was trying to prove to myself that low HR was the way to go.  Didn't realize that I was too low. Max HR 175ish and I was going at 120-125 for 1hr 45min. This was pushing my into anarobic at a low HR. Did not lose weight, built strengh though.

                            Paul

                             

                            I don't understand, what was anaerobic for you?

                              I suggest that you do a regular MAF during this build. It is a key indicator to over-training. It will often let you know long before an injury comes upon you that you are treading in dangerous waters. Good luck with your experiment.

                               

                              --Jimmy

                               

                              "may you staaaaaaaaayyyyyyyy... forever young" B.Dylan

                              log

                              gregw


                                I suggest that you do a regular MAF during this build. It is a key indicator to over-training. It will often let you know long before an injury comes upon you that you are treading in dangerous waters. Good luck with your experiment.

                                 

                                --Jimmy

                                 

                                 

                                 What he said.  I was assuming this without even saying it.

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