Low HR Training

1

too late for marathon? (Read 533 times)

elist


    I started using the LHR training principles 3 weeks into a Higdon beginner 2 marathon plan and now realize I should have started LHR training  much earlier. I think I'm too late for any speed work.  I'm in week 14 of an 18 week plan.   My pace is very slow by the end of my long run, basically walking.  Should I just continue what I'm doing for my 1st marathon on May 2? My only goal is to complete it.  Should I run the marathon using my MAF or can I go out 2min faster?  What to do about food?  I usually take a gu every 4 miles on my long runs.

     

    1. how many miles per week have you been running for how long? 

     

    Been running on and off for a few years.  This last round started running ~20mi/wk since Sept09, 35m/wk highest

     

    2. how old are you?

     

    39
    3. what value are you using for MAF heart rate?

    180-39-5=136

     

    4. what were your race times before MAF training and after MAF training?

    In May09 I ran a half in 1:55 my PR.  Have not raced since starting MAF.

     

    5. what were your pace splits and avg HR per split for your runs over the past couple of months? do you have HR/pace data on a site such as motionbased that you can share? are you absolutely strict, never going above MAF on any run? what was the temperature and dewpoint during each run?

     

    I mostly run at daybreak when it is cool.  I just uploaded my garmin 305 to this site. All data since Aug09.  I set my HR alarm to bug me at 137 so I try to stay below.  My last long run I started late and it got hot and I did not finish.

     

    My 1st MAF run on Jan 23 not really intervals  11mi

    Type Distance Time Total Time Pace Avg HR Max HR Notes
    Interval 1 Mi 11:56.32 11:56.32 11:57 129 141  
    Interval 1 Mi 12:30.8 24:27.12 12:31 132 149  
    Interval 1 Mi 11:37.76 36:04.88 11:38 134 143  
    Interval 1 Mi 12:49.52 48:54.40 12:50 127 143  
    Interval 1 Mi 12:18.55 1:01:12.95 12:19 132 145  
    Interval 1 Mi 11:48.09 1:13:01.04 11:49 134 142  
    Interval 1 Mi 11:38.46 1:24:39.50 11:39 138 144  
    Interval 1 Mi 12:31.79 1:37:11.29 12:32 135 143  
    Interval 1 Mi 14:11.73 1:51:23.02 14:12 127 148  
    Interval 1 Mi 12:42.92 2:04:05.94 12:43 137 151  
    Interval 1 Mi 13:19.5 2:17:25.44 13:20 137 146  
    Interval <center>—</center> 0:07.33 2:17:32.77 <center>—</center> 137 138

    my longest yet 18mi on 3/13/10

    Type Distance Time Total Time Pace Avg HR Max HR Notes
    Interval 1 Mi 12:15.04 12:15.04 12:16 127 144  
    Interval 1 Mi 11:08.08 23:23.12 11:09 132 139  
    Interval 1 Mi 11:32.35 34:55.47 11:33 135 142  
    Interval 1 Mi 11:38.22 46:33.69 11:39 137 147  
    Interval 1 Mi 11:59.98 58:33.67 12:00 138 147  
    Interval 1 Mi 12:17.42 1:10:51.09 12:18 137 146  
    Interval 1 Mi 12:33.48 1:23:24.57 12:34 136 144  
    Interval 1 Mi 12:48.69 1:36:13.26 12:49 137 146  
    Interval 1 Mi 13:33.41 1:49:46.67 13:34 133 148  
    Interval 1 Mi 12:34.52 2:02:21.19 12:35 139 148  
    Interval 1 Mi 12:25.27 2:14:46.46 12:26 137 143  
    Interval 1 Mi 11:59.96 2:26:46.42 12:00 140 146  
    Interval 1 Mi 12:14.29 2:39:00.71 12:15 140 146  
    Interval 1 Mi 13:13.03 2:52:13.74 13:14 136 141  
    Interval 1 Mi 13:05.91 3:05:19.65 13:06 134 141  
    Interval 1 Mi 14:46.21 3:20:05.86 14:47 134 151  
    Interval 1 Mi 12:28.3 3:32:34.16 12:29 142 153  
    Interval 1 Mi 12:50.7 3:45:24.86 12:51 144 151  
    Interval 0.02 Mi 0:39.4 3:46:04.26 32:50 140 150

     

     this  morning run 5mi

    Type Distance Time Total Time Pace Avg HR Max HR Notes
    Interval 1 Mi 11:36.15 11:36.15 11:37 131 143  
    Interval 1 Mi 12:30.81 24:06.96 12:31 132 140  
    Interval 1 Mi 13:00.04 37:07.00 13:01 130 143  
    Interval 1 Mi 12:50.45 49:57.45 12:51 133 142  
    Interval 0.95 Mi 11:49.29 1:01:46.74 12:27 135 141

    most of those max HR happened really quickly and I slowed down as soon as I noticed.

     

     

    6. do you incorporate downhills into your runs? what is your heart rate on the downhill segments? what does your heart rate do on uphills? 

     

        no, my runs a fairly flat

    7. do you take in any carbs within a couple of hours before your runs?

     

     I will have OJ before my weekday runs and toast before my long run.  Must of missed the part about not eating.

    8. do you deal with a lot of stress?

     

     

    no stress

    9. are you on any medications?

     

    no

    10. do you do any other activities, such as swimming, spin class, aerobics, weightlifting, etc? are you below MAF on all?

    just running for now

    11. what was your resting heart rate before your started MAF training? what is it now?

     

     never recorded it.

     

     

    thanks,

     

    Erich

     

     

     

    GMoney


      Relax. If your goal is to complete the marathon, then you will if long as you don't freak out and allow the distance to intimidate you.  Last time I checked, the people who walk across the finish line get the same medal as those who run (and those damn walkers often look better and happier than me).  So don't sweat it.. Stick to your plan and have confidence in it.  The mental strength you'll derive from sticking to your plan will help you in this first race.  Just keep the pace easy and don't risk injury.

       

      In the marathon itself, be cautious for the first 20 miles.  If your goal is really just "to finish" then going out at 2 m/m faster than MAF could be a recipe for disaster, so don't sweat the pace this time.  If you feel really strong at 20 miles (OK 30K if you're impatient) then go for it at the end, but until you have some experience with the distance keep it conservative for most of the race - especially the early miles.

      C-R


        Run the marathon at MAF. You said you only want to complete it and this will help.Run/walk is fully acceptable. Too late in the game to make major changes. The risk is too high. Run/walk and enjoy the journey. After you've completed one, you will know if you want to do another one.


        "He conquers who endures" - Persius
        "Every workout should have a purpose. Every purpose should link back to achieving a training objective." - Spaniel

          my opinion:

           

          run it at MAF if you don't think of this marathon as a race, just a 26-mile training run.

           

          run it above MAF if you think of it as a race. how much above MAF? you would have to know your LT/AT to guess better. but you are the only one who can feel which pace/HR is the one that while above MAF still doesn't burn too many sugars thereby giving you a chance not to run into the wall... the problem is the longer you plan to take to do the marathon the lower this HR will be. at least I read that and it seems completely logical to me

           

           

          PS: to be honest and this is still just a subjective opinion of someone who's yet to run a marathon, I do not see the point of doing speedwork for a marathon if the aerobic fitness is not high. my take on this anyway


          Consistently Slow

            I checked your log.

            1) Get  more days in during the week

            2)No speed work(cmon2)

            3)Set a pace around 12:00 for the first half HR 137/155

             The marathon does not start until around mile 16.With your mileage being low I am thinking  a 4:30 MT. I would suggest you find a 10 miler or half to ran before the marathon to better gauge your fitness.

            Run until the trail runs out.

            2013***1500 miles

            50 miler

            Race Less Train More

             

            Ana Trason  "Living Her Life"

            "The Marble in The Groove"

             

            unsolicited chatter

            http://bkclay.blogspot.com/

            elist


              Thank you all for the feed back.  I have to keep telling myself the goal is too finish but when I start thinking about how many hours it will take my ego wants to do it faster.  Thanks Runnerclay for the specific tips. I did a few days on the eliptical that did not show up on my log. You're right, I should be running an aditional day during the week. I'll see if I can stay with the 12min pace group during the marathon.  Are you suggesting I can go up to 155HR?   What is the rule on eating, do you really not eat anything on a 3-4 hour run?

               

              thanks

               

              Erich

              C-R


                Regarding food - you should get some calories during a marathon. How much and what kind is a personal thing. By that I mean some people can handle gels while others can handle bars or bananas. You need to practice this during your long run. How much is a big debated subject in the regulars RA forums. Some people take a gel every couple of miles. My last raced marathon I had two gels and two bananas on on the course spaced pretty even and onnly after mile 12. Again, its hard for someone on the internet to tell you specifically what you need and when you will need it. Experiment and see. I do say that you will need some calories to perform at your best. Especially after mile 21.


                "He conquers who endures" - Persius
                "Every workout should have a purpose. Every purpose should link back to achieving a training objective." - Spaniel

                elist


                  Thanks C-R.  I just read the sticky on food.  I'm amazed that some people can run 3+ hours without gels!  I have a lot to look forward to.

                   

                  -Erich

                    I dunno why it's so amazing being able to run without food

                    for me 2 hours is no problem without food, I believe 3 would be ok too Smile (haven't tried that yet, careful about my joints as a semi beginner.) and that 2 hours run is without breakfast. breakfast comes after it..

                      I ran my one and only Marathon in 1985 (yes, that a looong time ago!)

                      Back then, eating on the run wasnt really that emphasied (well not in rural Ireland anyway) and I wasn't really that tuned up on what I was doing, so all I had was water, and possibly sports drink (can't remember for sure!)

                      I probably would have had a lot more energy towards the end if I had eaten,

                      but having said that I didn't feel that I really 'bonked'.

                       

                      I dunno why it's so amazing being able to run without food

                      for me 2 hours is no problem without food, I believe 3 would be ok too Smile (haven't tried that yet, careful about my joints as a semi beginner.) and that 2 hours run is without breakfast. breakfast comes after it..