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Questions about Training Cycles and Recovery Time (Read 30 times)

FreeSoul87


Runs4Sanity

    Just out of curiosity (and already planning my next training cycle),

    1. how long or how many days do you take to recover after a marathon and
    2. how do you slowly build back up, and
    3. when do you begin your next training cycle?

    To be honest, I have two trail marathons in mind by spring next year and one will definitely involve some hiking practice. Land Between the Lakes Marathon in March and then in April there is either the Scenic City Trail Marathon in Tennessee or the Backside Trail Marathon in Louisville KY.

    I really want to do the March one because they have a 60k and 50 miler (for future reference) on this loop, and I want to get an idea of the trail. I have no intentions to race it or run hard, I plan on hiking the hills and just enjoy the trails  and begin my experience and journey into ultras.

    But march can be a very volatile month, lots of ice or lots of rain. We will just have to see after the IMM.

    I have already made my training plan with the LBL marathon in mind  and it includes the recovery period. I definitely plan on taking the few days after the race completely off from running unless by 2nd day I am feeling well enough for an easy 30 minute run and then pretty much easy runs and an easy LR of no more than 10-12 miles throughout the rest of November.  My next training plan is going to involve lots of hiking up the hilliest trails, probably 3-5 miles of hiking after my LR which will either be on trails or roads depending on weather conditions, and a Thursday run on those same hilly trails, a MLR on flatter trails during my Wednesday runs and two easy trail runs Tuesday and Friday and an easy road run on Saturday.

    My focus or desired focus after this road marathon in November will be to move towards trail marathons and eventually ultras, as of now I have decided not to worry about speed when I begin this new journey.

     

    Here is the link to my training plan, which can and will most likely change a lot. http://www.runningahead.com/logs/6d1d5cb5e27e4230a9d79029229a9ba6/plans/H68

    *Do It For Yourself, Do It Because They Said It Was Impossible, Do It Because They Said You Were Incapable*

    PRs

    5k - 24:15 (7:49 min/mile pace) 

    10k - 51:47 (8:16 min/mile pace)

    15k -1:18:09 (8:24 min/mile pace)

    13.1 - 1:53:12 (8:39 min/mile pace)

     26:2 - 4:14:55 (9:44 min/mile)

    DigDug2


      Others have much more experience, and your plan is much more detailed/specific than anything I've ever used, but FWIW, your plan looks like it should get you to the starting line in March well prepared for a trail marathon.  I like the combination of long trail run and hiking on your long days.  I might ditch the 3 mile Fridays and instead do something longer or more intense on Thursdays - I don't think 3 easy miles does much for me training-wise.

       

      Basically, if your plan includes good mileage, a bunch of 18+mi long runs, enough running on trails that are similar to your race, and some regular intensity (speed/hills), I think the rest is just details.

      FreeSoul87


      Runs4Sanity

        Yeah, I definitely want the plan to be flexible. I came up with it in like 10-15 minutes, I like having a plan so that I can get a better picture of what I need to do and what it will look like in the long run.

        I think you mean the Saturday 3 milers, because the Friday runs go all the way to 7 miles. I could get rid of the 3 milers, maybe make it an easy hour or two hike, again it's definitely a flexible plan that can change 

        The Thursday runs will either be 5 or 6 miles, the trails I plan on running are basically a 3-4 mile loop that has anywhere between 900-950 feet in elevation gain. Currently I've only ran one loop, it's frustrating because the park doesn't open until 7 AM but I have to be back home by 6:30 AM, and if I do it in the afternoon evenings it's going to be getting dark around 6:30-7 and I won't be able to get out there until 5:30 PM. But it's the best place to train for hilly courses if I don't want to drive over an hour.

        *Do It For Yourself, Do It Because They Said It Was Impossible, Do It Because They Said You Were Incapable*

        PRs

        5k - 24:15 (7:49 min/mile pace) 

        10k - 51:47 (8:16 min/mile pace)

        15k -1:18:09 (8:24 min/mile pace)

        13.1 - 1:53:12 (8:39 min/mile pace)

         26:2 - 4:14:55 (9:44 min/mile)

        jbyram2


        Eat to run, Run to eat

          Looks like a plan..

           

          Be sure to get enough rest. Since I'm an old fart, I have two planned rest days a week.

           

          leading up to the race, I usually do 5,rest,2,rest,2,race . The last 2 keeps me loose for race day, and encourages the storage of glycogen (or so Pfitz says)

          Ill put maybe an 8-10 mile long run the week before the race, and 15 before that and a peak week with 20 Mi LR three weeks out. Your 20 miler is four weeks out, and there isn't much of a taper.

          For a three week taper, total mileage would be peak, then ~75% of peak, then ~40% of peak, then race week like I said above.

           

          Also you seem to be using a steady build up.  Every three or four weeks, cut the total back 25-30% to have a "rest "week.  This gives you a mental rest as well, so you can relax, then attack the training the next week renewed.

           

          If you have the time, Consider increasing the mileage a bit on Monday and Friday.  if you start the training cycle doing 5 mile daily runs, you could easily be doing 8-9 during peak training 4 weeks before race day.

           

          My two cents.

          Stone Mill 50m 11/16/13  12:42

          Febapple Frozen 50k 2/22/14  9:20:55

          DIrty German 50m 5/18/14 12:06:16

           

          FreeSoul87


          Runs4Sanity

            True, I might not even do a 20 miler during this plan since I'll be hiking 5 hilly miles or so after the LR which might even include a bit of running in there if I feel it.  And I can change the taper a little more, but I'll just have to see how well I recover after my first marathon November 1st... not to mention when exactly Land Between the Lakes Marathon is, though I am pretty sure it's usually the 2nd weekend of March.

            *Do It For Yourself, Do It Because They Said It Was Impossible, Do It Because They Said You Were Incapable*

            PRs

            5k - 24:15 (7:49 min/mile pace) 

            10k - 51:47 (8:16 min/mile pace)

            15k -1:18:09 (8:24 min/mile pace)

            13.1 - 1:53:12 (8:39 min/mile pace)

             26:2 - 4:14:55 (9:44 min/mile)

            wcrunner2


            Are we there, yet?

              ... not to mention when exactly Land Between the Lakes Marathon is, though I am pretty sure it's usually the 2nd weekend of March.

               

              It's March 14th.  Still no date on when registration opens.

               2024 Races:

                    03/09 - Livingston Oval Ultra 6-Hour, 22.88 miles

                    05/11 - D3 50K
                    05/25 - What the Duck 12-Hour

                    06/17 - 6 Days in the Dome 12-Hour.

               

               

                   

              FreeSoul87


              Runs4Sanity

                 

                It's March 14th.  Still no date on when registration opens.

                 

                Hmmm... that gives me another week lol, this makes it even better 

                *Do It For Yourself, Do It Because They Said It Was Impossible, Do It Because They Said You Were Incapable*

                PRs

                5k - 24:15 (7:49 min/mile pace) 

                10k - 51:47 (8:16 min/mile pace)

                15k -1:18:09 (8:24 min/mile pace)

                13.1 - 1:53:12 (8:39 min/mile pace)

                 26:2 - 4:14:55 (9:44 min/mile)