Trailer Trash

123

I need advice (Read 388 times)

Jruckman


    Ok here it is. I have run 6 marathons, with a PR of 3:30, all have been relevantly flat terrain. I am wanting; no strike that, in July I am GOING to run the Leadville 50miler. Like I said I have never ran in any type of elevation and I have never run a distance beyond a marathon.  I have the drive, I have the motivation, and all I am asking for is some advice from a seasoned runner. Any one of you nice folks care to share with me some of your wisdom and training tips in regards to running this how to train for this distance and at altitude, also, I live in Omaha Nebraska so I don't have the opportunity to train at altitude.  I appreciate it much.

    crunch19


      I am an unexperienced ultrarunner but I do have experience running at altitude and on trails.

       

      Days 1 and 2  after you get to altitude aren't that bad. It's days 3 and after you feel like utter crap. You also tend to dehydrate a little more at altitude and the effects can be difficult to gauge since you won't be sweating like you would in Omaha due to the very dry air and increased evaporation rate. The effects of altitude tend to be very individual as well. I can definitely feel its effects after a few days but my DH barely notices. There is no way to tell how it will effect you until you get there. I am sure more seasoned ultra runners can give you their experiences.

       

      My best advice as far as trails are concerned is to try to at least do your long runs on trails, at similar terrain if possible (in Omaha this might be do-able, but road trips are always fun right?).

       

      Check out the ultrnr list serve , (<cite>www.ultrunr.com) </cite>tons of good info there. There is also an ultramarathon user group here full of some very experienced and helpful people. 


      Occasional Runner

        Well, I'm not very "seasoned", but I've run a few ultras and have run the Leadville 50 twice. I may be able to offer some useful insight.

         

        Altitude is a big factor in this race but unfortunately, we all react differently to it so it's impossible to give meaningful advice here. When I go to Leadville, I try to get there a week in advance and I start climbing 14'ers right away. Lingering at the highest possible altitude has always seemed to help me acclimate quickly. 

         

        This race starts with a huge hill climb right away. Walk this section. Running it is tempting but it's a huge mistake if you're not fully acclimated and conditioned for this sort of thing. There's a lot of climbing in this race and steep descents. Go into it with the understanding that it will be a slow race. Also be prepared for huge variables in the weather. in 2011, I got a sunburned and also got snowed on at 12,000'. 

         

        For training, I would suggest doing a couple of trail 50k's between now and July and maybe a 50 miler if you can. You need to get accustomed to technical trails and hilly terrain. The nutritional aspect will be totally new to you and will take practice. And like the other poster suggested, hydration is tricky at altitude. You'll need to drink way more than you probably expect. 

         

        Good luck.

        7/27- Virtigo Night Run 41M

        8/2- Jupiter Peak

        8/9- El Vaquero Loco 50k

        8/16- Leadville 100

        9/5- Wasatch 100

        ALTRjeff


          One of the things that helps to prevent effects of altitude is to drink lots of water frequently, before & after you get to altitude. A couple of the symptoms of Altitude Sickness & dehydration are the same & are often misdiagnosed.

           

          For the most of the runners I know(myself included), & it pains me to say this.....avoid alcohol for the 1st 24-36 hrs @ altitude, partly again associated to the dehydration aspects of alcohol.

           

          Good Luck!

            If you can work high (climb 14ers) and sleep low (Denver) for a week before the race, that will give you the best chance.  The problem with sleeping high is that you will never get enough rest until you are fully acclimated, which would take 6 weeks.  In the meantime, run up and down the steepest trails you can find.  Having the strongest possible climbing ability will help to offset the lack of acclimation.  The worst thing to happen during the race is stopping to catch your breath when going uphill. 

            2013 H1:  7 hours/week base.  Q3: Train for goal race.  Q4:  Goal Race.


            Ultra Cowboy

              Leadville has a running camp

               

              .  I'd say that is something that would be an integral part of your plan...

               

               

               

              Register

              Date: June 22-24, 2013

              Fees: $325.00

              Qualifications: Entrants under 18 years must deliver a signed Parental Release & Waiver to attend.

               

              The Leadville training camp is open to all runners! This camp is a great introduction to what the Leadville Trail 100 Run will take if you are considering the run down the road, or if you are using it as part of your training for this year's race. This camp will provide a great education from many seasoned veterans, as you cover the Leadville Trail 100 Run course over a three-day period.

              Whether you're a "Race Across the Sky" first-timer or an old hand, we encourage you to join us in Leadville for an informative look at the country’s most scenic and challenging ultra-run course. Group training runs – both day and night – will familiarize you with key sections of the course. There will also be discussion sessions with race veterans to help you get the most out of your race experience. Come spend some quality time with us and get to know your fellow racers. Our training camp is an experience you will carry with you forever.

              We like to think of it as a long weekend of good food, good running and good friends. Please note that the schedule may have to be adjusted due to the snowpack, but we’ll try to keep you informed as the run date approaches.

              Looking for a reason to run...

              Jruckman


                Let me add this, The leadville training camp, escaping to some remote location outside of Omaha to a higher elevation, or anything expensive or time consuming is out of the question, It is just something I cannot do. What I can and am forced to do is show up the day before the race and give it my 100 percent. I have from now until July 14th to prepare. I will do all the V02 training I possibly can, hell I will even try snorkel training if I can verify that it has helped others in my boat.

                FTYC


                Faster Than Your Couch!

                  My suggestion is to get familiar with steep, technical trails, and long runs (incorporating such trails) beyond 30 miles. You'll need to get the hydration and nutrition down, that is essential.

                   

                  If you don't have access to good trails, try to do them on the weekends, and do strength and flexibility training and core workouts during the week. Run up stairs, perhaps also down, to get used to moving your feet quickly and in a controlled way.

                   

                  Try using foods and drinks in your training runs that will be offered at the race, and find out what works for you, and what amounts you need and can tolerate. Don't get discouraged by a few "bad" runs, just take them as a learning experience.

                   

                  Good luck for the Leadville!

                  Run for fun.


                  Weegee

                    Let me add this, The leadville training camp, escaping to some remote location outside of Omaha to a higher elevation, or anything expensive or time consuming is out of the question, It is just something I cannot do. What I can and am forced to do is show up the day before the race and give it my 100 percent. I have from now until July 14th to prepare. I will do all the V02 training I possibly can, hell I will even try snorkel training if I can verify that it has helped others in my boat.

                     

                    Um…  Training for a 50-miler at altitude isn't expensive, but it is going to be time-consuming.


                    Uh oh... now what?

                      Let me add this, The leadville training camp, escaping to some remote location outside of Omaha to a higher elevation, or anything expensive or time consuming is out of the question, It is just something I cannot do. What I can and am forced to do is show up the day before the race and give it my 100 percent. I have from now until July 14th to prepare. I will do all the V02 training I possibly can, hell I will even try snorkel training if I can verify that it has helped others in my boat.

                      There used to be a lot of trails along the bluffs near Omaha.  Go run up and down them.

                      Get access to the tallest stairs in Omaha.  Run up and down them.

                      Go to the biggest football stadium in Omaha.  Bleacher running is still good for the legs.

                       

                      I lived at about 240(feet) elevation when I trained for Leadville.  I had two good trips, one bad.

                       

                      Our first trip there we left Portland, Oregon at about five in the morning, flew to Denver, rented

                      a car, and were running at about 11,000 feet near Hagerman Pass that afternoon.  If you do

                      not have respiratory/pulmanary issues, you can go there, get out, and run, but you cannot go

                      there to race.

                       

                      Recovery from high effort stuff will be slower.

                       

                      Hydration needs will be critical.  You will need more water.

                       

                      The thing is doable, but will be a challenge.

                       

                      rgot

                      Jruckman


                        Its not the mileage that scares me, and I know that I am not going to race this, this is a personal journey and I have no aspiring dreams of a super star time. I will run bleachers and hills until I vomit and then run some more, all this does not bother me, what I am worried about is the altitude. I don't have the luxury of being able to go there for a week prior and get acclimated to the altitude. like I stated, I am in a position where I will most likely get there on a Saturday and do the race on Sunday.


                        Uh oh... now what?

                          Its not the mileage that scares me, and I know that I am not going to race this, this is a personal journey and I have no aspiring dreams of a super star time. I will run bleachers and hills until I vomit and then run some more, all this does not bother me, what I am worried about is the altitude. I don't have the luxury of being able to go there for a week prior and get acclimated to the altitude. like I stated, I am in a position where I will most likely get there on a Saturday and do the race on Sunday.

                           The mileage should scare you, or, at least generate a healthy amount of respect.

                           

                          You don't need to run until you vomit (sounds sort of silly to begin with,

                          old timey football stuff).  That would be stupid training.  You need to get

                          a structured schedule, understand that rest will be just as important as

                          running.

                           

                          Visit:  http:www.ultrunr.com  read, run, read some more, run some more, ask

                          more incredibly well-thought-out questions, run some more... repeat until

                          June 30th (2013).

                           

                          I repeat:  if you do not have respiratory/pulmanary issues, you can go there, get

                          out, and run, but you can not go there to race.  

                           

                          rgot

                          NorthernHarrier


                            Well I live in the flatlands myself and have done a number of mountain "races" and a bunch of good old fashioned runs plus a lot of hiking and backpacking in the high country. Sometimes they have gone well with either no or only some real minor issues and once in awhile the altitude adjustment has been not so ideal. Just can't predict and I've tried different ways.

                             

                            I get the challenge you want to undertake and I think you can do it but just respect what you will be up against. It's a real weird feeling to be up above 10,000 ft and fairly level and you are trying to trot along but the legs just don't want to work. You are breathing but no oxygen is being delivered to your muscles by your blood. And while all the hill training you can do will help it is still a lot harder doing the climbs out there as they just keep going up with no air to breathe. I kind of enjoy it myself but you just need to know in advance and are ready for that type of discomfort.

                             

                            I did a quick map search and while I really don't know your situation it looks like with a 7-8 hour drive you can be in high elevation. I would do a couple weekend road trips and camp to get some experience at that altitude. Take a weekend and go to Colorado Springs and do a couple repeats up the Manitou Incline. That will tell you what you need to know plus it's really cool.

                             

                            Almost all the mountain race directors have stories of flatlanders entering their events with big dreams that crash and burn because they either underestimate what they are up against or just don't respect the difficulty.

                            FTYC


                            Faster Than Your Couch!

                              J, don't underestimate the distance. While it is "just" twice a marathon, managing all the other factors, like food, liquids, salts, weather, and so on, takes much more effort than just twice as much. Also, don't underestimate fatigue after 6+ hours.

                               

                              One more tip: Try running your long runs "fast", this will prepare your muscles for the hard work at high altitude, although it cannot replicate the lack of oxygen.

                               

                              I also agree, doing a few weekend trips to higher altitude, and getting in some workouts there will be beneficial!

                              Run for fun.

                              Watoni


                                As someone considering the 100, can I piggyback?

                                 

                                I am planning to run (and ski) in Tahoe this winter/spring/summer, but that gets us to about 9000 or so feet. If I can I will do the Leadville camp, which strikes me as more realistic than taking a week off prior to the race to acclimate (maybe a day or two).

                                 

                                As for training runs, I am signed up for the Lake Sonoma 50 (10,500 feet of elevation gain/loss) in April, then just lots of hill running and trying to get some altitude training in, i.e. some 50 mile weekends and a few 80-100 (quality) mile weeks.

                                 

                                Reasonable plan?

                                123