Sub-4 Marathon Group

Hanson & Pfitz Discussion (Read 386 times)


Smashy!!!

    Do you mean Goal HM Pace? Or PR HM pace? Either way, if you can handle it, then do it.

     

    Been tinkering with my Hanson plan and was thinking of maybe doing all the tempo miles at HMP up to my HM on 9/15 and then switching to MP after the HM for Philly. What do you guys think?

    PRs: 21:35 (5K); 1:46:46 (HM); 4:30:46 (FM)

      Been tinkering with my Hanson plan and was thinking of maybe doing all the tempo miles at HMP up to my HM on 9/15 and then switching to MP after the HM for Philly. What do you guys think?

       

      We're using different Hanson plans.  My plan doesn't have tempo runs, just pace runs of 5k, 1/2M and M pace, so what you are calling tempo runs in your plan is what they are calling 1/2M pace runs in my plan.  So, they kind of sound interchangeable.

      jedigunnie26.2


      BQ in 2013

        RVD - I was talking about the MP runs specifically. I'll probably do at goal HMP which is more or less what i do "real" tempos at right now.

         

         

        We're using different Hanson plans.  My plan doesn't have tempo runs, just pace runs of 5k, 1/2M and M pace, so what you are calling tempo runs in your plan is what they are calling 1/2M pace runs in my plan.  So, they kind of sound interchangeable.

        PR's - 5K - 20:15 (2013) | 10K - 45:14 (2011)  | 13.1 - 1:34:40 (2013)  | 26.2 - 3:47:47 (2012)

         

        2013 Goals - 3000 miles (940m May'13) | sub20 5k | sub 43 10K  | sub1:35 13.1 | sub 3:15 26.2

         

        2013

        Saginaw 5k - 1/19/13 - 20:15 PR

        Chambersburg Half Marathon - 3/9/13 - 1:36:22 PR

        Frederick Half Marathon - 5/5/13 - 1:34:40 PR

         

        Up Next:

        Shippensburg Fair 5k - 7/27/13

        RnR Philadelphia Half Marathon - 9/15/13

        Philadelphia Marathon - 11/17/13

          How do you decide on training paces if you have not run a marathon. I get the "focus on finishing" but, would still need to plug in paces for the different workouts. Or does a first timer just not use Hanson or /Pfitz? Last cycle, which would have been my first FM, I broke the joint in my big toe the week of my 17 miler on HH int. and DNS. I still harbor some frustration from that.

           

          my goal over the summer is to maintain a 35/40 mow average. The FM woul be Jan of 2014.

          PR's : HM 1:51:15  -  5K 21:27

           

           

          onemile


            I would use the McMillian calculator and plug in your shorter distance race.  That's what I did.  If you are doing Hansons and need to choose a GMP at the beginning of the training cycle, use the MP that your half marathon PR predicts.  Their charts align pretty closely with McMillian.  And for me at least, by the end of the plan I was well prepared to run that pace.

             

            How do you decide on training paces if you have not run a marathon. I get the "focus on finishing" but, would still need to plug in paces for the different workouts. Or does a first timer just not use Hanson or /Pfitz? Last cycle, which would have been my first FM, I broke the joint in my big toe the week of my 17 miler on HH int. and DNS. I still harbor some frustration from that.

             

            my goal over the summer is to maintain a 35/40 mow average. The FM woul be Jan of 2014.


            Ball of Fury

              I would use the McMillian calculator and plug in your shorter distance race.  That's what I did.  If you are doing Hansons and need to choose a GMP at the beginning of the training cycle, use the MP that your half marathon PR predicts.  Their charts align pretty closely with McMillian.  And for me at least, by the end of the plan I was well prepared to run that pace.

               

               

              This, except maybe McMillan plus 10-15 minutes since that is what most people say for a "lower mileage runner" and since it's your first FM.

              PRs:  5K 22:59, 10K 46:54,HM: 1:51:15

                 

                This, except maybe McMillan plus 10-15 minutes since that is what most people say for a "lower mileage runner" and since it's your first FM.

                 

                10-15 minutes.....race time? Or do you mean 10-15 seconds per mile? So, use my 1:51 from the HM and plug it into McMillian.

                 

                What about a plan? I am intirgued by what I am reading about Hansons. Would a marathon rookie be over zealous to take a swing at Hanson or should I stick with ol' Higdon?

                PR's : HM 1:51:15  -  5K 21:27

                 

                 


                Smashy!!!

                  Yes, plug your HM into McMillan. Take the Marathon equivalent he gives you, and then +10 to 15 minutes to it--that's what Ami is telling you. But how much you add is personal. some might only add 8 minutes. The point is that McMillan assumes your are in pretty high marathon shape when he gives you that equivalency.

                   

                   

                  10-15 minutes.....race time? Or do you mean 10-15 seconds per mile? So, use my 1:51 from the HM and plug it into McMillian.

                   

                  What about a plan? I am intirgued by what I am reading about Hansons. Would a marathon rookie be over zealous to take a swing at Hanson or should I stick with ol' Higdon?

                  PRs: 21:35 (5K); 1:46:46 (HM); 4:30:46 (FM)


                  Ball of Fury

                    Roll:  What CBus said!  From my understanding, McMillan assumes you are equally as trained for a 5K, 10K, HM, and FM.  I believe his calculations were done assuming 70ish miles per week, which we do not have.  Among the pace advice experts on the Marathoning board, they seem to think you should add 10-15 minutes, sometimes even 20, depending on mileage.  And I think you would be just fine with a Hanson plan.

                    PRs:  5K 22:59, 10K 46:54,HM: 1:51:15


                    Ball of Fury

                      Oh and if you go to marathonpace.com you can download the spreadsheet and put in settings for how aggressive you want to be and it will give you times.

                      PRs:  5K 22:59, 10K 46:54,HM: 1:51:15

                        Thanks Ami and Cbus. I remember reading that McMillian assumes higher miles per week averages and fitness levels of race equivilance. I am planning to hold at least 35/40 mpw (more depending on time and legs) through the summer. The cycle wouldnt start until September but I hate not knowing. Knowing is part of my preperation in life events.

                        PR's : HM 1:51:15  -  5K 21:27

                         

                         

                        jedigunnie26.2


                        BQ in 2013

                          Yes, plug your HM into McMillan. Take the Marathon equivalent he gives you, and then +10 to 15 minutes to it--that's what Ami is telling you. But how much you add is personal. some might only add 8 minutes. The point is that McMillan assumes your are in pretty high marathon shape when he gives you that equivalency.

                           

                           

                          ^this. i find mcMillian pretty accurate up to the HM.

                          PR's - 5K - 20:15 (2013) | 10K - 45:14 (2011)  | 13.1 - 1:34:40 (2013)  | 26.2 - 3:47:47 (2012)

                           

                          2013 Goals - 3000 miles (940m May'13) | sub20 5k | sub 43 10K  | sub1:35 13.1 | sub 3:15 26.2

                           

                          2013

                          Saginaw 5k - 1/19/13 - 20:15 PR

                          Chambersburg Half Marathon - 3/9/13 - 1:36:22 PR

                          Frederick Half Marathon - 5/5/13 - 1:34:40 PR

                           

                          Up Next:

                          Shippensburg Fair 5k - 7/27/13

                          RnR Philadelphia Half Marathon - 9/15/13

                          Philadelphia Marathon - 11/17/13


                          Bad Ass

                            Question about the plan.  I know Hanson has mentioned in their FB page that, although they don't recommend starting the plan somewhere after Week 18 (meaning doing less weeks of the plan), there is a way to do it.  I don't remember reading it in the book.  So, if one has 14-15 weeks to train, can one pick the week that corresponds to it and start there?

                            Damaris, Marathon Maniac, Ultra Runner

                            Next:  San Francisco Marathon

                            Blog

                            "The most powerful weapon on earth is the human soul on fire."


                            Smashy!!!

                              I don't remember them saying anything about that in the book either way, but I can be wrong. I wouldn't expect the same results, but I don't see why you couldn't do it. Especially, the Beginners, which has base building in the first few weeks any ways.

                               

                              Question about the plan.  I know Hanson has mentioned in their FB page that, although they don't recommend starting the plan somewhere after Week 18 (meaning doing less weeks of the plan), there is a way to do it.  I don't remember reading it in the book.  So, if one has 14-15 weeks to train, can one pick the week that corresponds to it and start there?

                              PRs: 21:35 (5K); 1:46:46 (HM); 4:30:46 (FM)


                              Canuck

                                I would agree that you could modify the plan slightly to be a 14-15 week plan.  Even the advanced plan, the first two weeks are mostly easy running.  You could probably just reduce the number of speed workouts slightly - maybe skip the 12 x 400s and the second 3 x 1600 - you'd still get 8 x 600, 6 x 800, 5 x 1000, 4 x 1200, ladder and 3 x 1600. The beginner plan is base building for the first 5 weeks, so if you already have a good base, you could jump in at week 6 and get a solid 13 weeks.

                                PRs: 47:54 (10K); 1:46:36 (HM); 3:50:52 (FM)

                                Recovering from injured knee (PCL/Lateral Meniscus)