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Skewed race results -- What would you do? (Read 264 times)

jerseyrunner


Half Fanatic 12680

    I am curious about how people would respond to a situation that I encountered at a race last weekend. It was a combination 5k race/walk for a good cause -- research to eliminate ovarian cancer -- and there were more people walking than running. It was also a USATF sanctioned event and part of the state-wide USATF Grand Prix series which means that runners earn points towards a yearly total based on their gender standings.

     

    I had just come off a complete break from running due to an injury and had only done one short run the day before since being injured 3 weeks before. I did not expect to be back to where I was before the injury, but was pleased with my time of 28:05 and even thought I might be in the top three in my age group, 60-69. I was a bit disappointed to find out that I was fourth and very surprised to see that the first place winner in my age group finished in 21:32 at a 6:56 pace! As it turned out, the "top" two finishers in my age group were walkers who turned back after a half a mile and then walked over the finish line, recording very fast times.

     

    During the awards, one of the women who was incorrectly scored reported the error that she and her friend had made to the the organizer who was announcing awards. She was told that there was nothing they could do about it. I didn't say anything, but I wonder if I should of. I'm not too disappointed not to take home a medal (I was actually second in my age group), but this also affected my scoring for the USATF Grand Prix series and it affected any woman competing in the Grand Prix who recorded a time over 21:32. In addition, the 21:32 time was the 2nd place time overall for women, so two other women were deprived of their appropriate award for 2nd and 3rd place overall. These false times were posted online and there has been no correction.

     

    It seems to me that the organizers have an obligation to clear up errors in scoring when they are made aware of them. Even though this was not a very competitive event, it was a USATF sanctioned event and I expected that the course measurement and scoring would be accurate. Would you have said anything or just let it go like I did?

     

     

       

      It seems to me that the organizers have an obligation to clear up errors in scoring when they are made aware of them.

      Yes. You should make your case to the RD, of course they can fix it. If they choose not to, nothing else you can do but move on with your life. Yes this was to raise money for a good cause. But the RD should know runners get serious about their AG placings, and this kind of thing may turn off some runners from doing this event again (or others by the same organizer). And reduced turnout means less for the charity.

      Dave

      Buzzie


      Bacon Party!

        Make the case in writing to the RD and/or timing company.

        Back it with any evidence you can - on-course photos, finish line photos - that show the questionable runners did not run the full course.

         

        I have seen results changed. For one race, it took more than a week to clear everything up - but, they started working on it immediately (finding and eliminating some anomalies) and kept at it.

        AFAIK, they did not try to square up AG prizes (trinkets) that were handed out immediately following the race, but they may have - I just didn't care and so didn't ask.

        But, they did hold off on sending prize money until after they'd cleaned up the results. I got my check.

        Liz

        pace sera, sera

        LedLincoln


        not bad for mile 25

          Yes. You should make your case to the RD, of course they can fix it. If they choose not to, nothing else you can do but move on with your life. Yes this was to raise money for a good cause. But the RD should know runners get serious about their AG placings, and this kind of thing may turn off some runners from doing this event again (or others by the same organizer). And reduced turnout means less for the charity.

           

          Furthermore, if it's a USATF/Grand Prix event, the RD has an obligation to maintain accuracy of the results.  I wouldn't fault the USATF if they threw the entire results set out.

          kcam


            You should absolutely get this straightened out.  Not so much for a medal but because it affects everyone in the USATF Grand Prix.  I wouldn't hesitate to get that taken care of.  Do it.

            Julia1971


              I'm not too disappointed not to take home a medal (I was actually second in my age group), but this also affected my scoring for the USATF Grand Prix series and it affected any woman competing in the Grand Prix who recorded a time over 21:32. In addition, the 21:32 time was the 2nd place time overall for women, so two other women were deprived of their appropriate award for 2nd and 3rd place overall. These false times were posted online and there has been no correction.

               

              Would you have said anything or just let it go like I did?

               

              In this situation I would.  (But, I imagine the women who actually won 2nd and 3rd overall will also be complaining).  I've had races where my AG standing have been messed up but in those cases, it it's usually a matter of a medal or $25 gift certificate,  That doesn't matter than much to me.  But, if there's a discrepancy in the overall and there's grand prix series that people are competing in, then things like this need to be corrected.

                I agree--you should contact the race director or timing company and have them straighten it out. There are very often a few glitches like this in timing/scoring. The timers and race organizers would probably appreciate you contacting them--they care about the integrity of the results.

                Runners run

                AmoresPerros


                Options,Account, Forums

                  I can't actually understand how they could be "unable to fix it".

                  It's a 5k. It hurt like hell...then I tried to pick it up. The end.


                  Member Since 2008

                    I was disqualified at the finishing line of my last marathon and did not know it until I checked the online results.  I went back to the timing table and was told I was disqualified for running into another runner.  Luckily I had my brother video the finish and it showed the other runner cross three lanes into mine and my finish was accepted.  All that being said, if I had not went to the judges to correct the issue all of the training and hard work would have been for nothing.


                    The Pocatello Kid.

                      This is so ridiculous on so many levels. I would have been bull if I were you.

                       

                      I was disqualified at the finishing line of my last marathon and did not know it until I checked the online results.  I went back to the timing table and was told I was disqualified for running into another runner.  Luckily I had my brother video the finish and it showed the other runner cross three lanes into mine and my finish was accepted.  All that being said, if I had not went to the judges to correct the issue all of the training and hard work would have been for nothing.


                      Feeling the growl again

                        She was told that there was nothing they could do about it. 

                         

                        Translation:  "I am very lazy so I am going to make a weak excuse, and you will probably go away."

                         

                        That's pretty much it.

                         

                        I've seen and experienced a lot at races.....certified courses that are off, courses advertised as certified that never were, elites cutting courses, lead runners sent off course by course marshals, results doctored at prestigious major races, even assault resulting in injury.

                         

                        The common thread is that in the end it's usually just a race, and there is little you can do to force an RD to take appropriate action unless they want to.  You can elevate the level of a PIA you are to them and hope they cave to get you off their back.  That's about it.

                         

                        In this case I certainly would have pressed the issue.  Even the people mistakenly given the awards admitted they didn't earn them.

                        "If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does.  There's your pep talk for today.  Go Run." -- Slo_Hand

                         

                        I am spaniel - Crusher of Treadmills

                         

                        LedLincoln


                        not bad for mile 25

                          It was a combination 5k race/walk

                           

                          This is part of the problem.  How do they know what other walkers turned around as well?

                           

                          If it's purporting to to be a certified race that counts in regional standings, it should be a race, not a fund raising party (not that there's anything wrong with them, in the proper place).

                          spinach


                            Race directors are usually pretty easy to deal with.  This summer I ran an 8k race, something happened to me this summer and i got real slow.  My friends tell me that I got old.  Anyway I ran the 8k in 34:40 something, a new PW for me.  However when the race results were presented they had my time three minutes slower, 37:40 something.  I thought that was neat that I got an even worse PW but I wasn't going to do anything about it.  However a 12 year old girl finished just a head of me, winning the women's division and when they announced her time she was in tears.  She ran under 35 minutes and she didn't want her time to be up near 38.  Her father came over to me and asked me about the time I had.  i told him 34 something.

                             

                            So I contacted the race director afterwards, and sent him a copy of my garmin results and the map showing the course and date, so I did have some evidence that my time was around 34:40 and told him the girl finished just in front of me and her time should be that also.  The race director changed my time and her time.  I think everyone's time was three minutes off but the didn't change any other times.  However i know we didn't finish over five minutes faster and everyone else behind us.  The were nice about correcting the time especially since I had some evidence for them.  I would contact them and I expect they will correct the results.

                              About 8 yr ago, I was given an incorrect time. We had an early start, and they had our names and chip numbers so they could adjust things later. Except the adjustment never happened. I told someone before the awards, I corrected them at the awards, and emailed later. I just looked, and the incorrect time still stands, although they have removed it from the AG record. They must have had  a number of errors since they restarted the clock on course records for the older AGs. Ive never done that race again, even though it's really popular (and very expensive).

                               

                              I did another race on Saturday, where my whole AG was missing from the results at awards banquet (6pm-8pm, race finished at 6pm, started at 8am = 10 hr time limit). (In the past, they used to have a 7-hr cutoff for making the print booklet for the banquet, but this year, they apparently included times out to 9+ hrs because of a better system.) This is a well-established marathon with excellent course measurements and marking and usually good timing, but they used a new timing system which had some quirks - or maybe it was just challenged by the weather where bibs disintegrated or were hidden by rain gear or cb straps. (rainy, somewhat cold, and slightly windy, not to mention muddy underfoot)  If our name was not on the list posted at 10:42 pm Sat night, to email them with details - mind you, that's only 3 hrs after the end of banquet. They were going to review the video of the finish line - that would be about 8 hrs of video - to try to find the missing runners. My name made it to the updated list, so I didn't have to report anything. But I suspect there's still some issues since they had someone 1 sec after me, and I don't think I was near anyone.

                               

                              The 2nd case is what I consider a quality race organization.

                               

                              Apparently some of the bibs with the chip attached aren't very durable. Another race I did last week had us use chips that looked like ankle monitors since they said the prior bibs/chips couldn't handle 10 hr of trail running.

                               

                              ETA: By 8pm tonight, they posted 10 pictures of unknown runners at the finish line - no bibs visible. That's a heck of a lot of video to  have gone through already.

                              "So many people get stuck in the routine of life that their dreams waste away. This is about living the dream." - Cave Dog
                              AmoresPerros


                              Options,Account, Forums

                                Looking from the other side:

                                 

                                I manually correct results when I know the name got misspelled. I can't remember any runner ever emailing me to get a name spelling corrected -- I kind of wish they would, as sometimes the names are tough to read, and we just take guesses when we are digitizing them.

                                It's a 5k. It hurt like hell...then I tried to pick it up. The end.

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