2017 Sub 3 Marathons...and beyond! (Read 403 times)

I'd love to see a good sub-3 contingent at Philly next year. It's a pretty decent and fast course, and the new RD is making improvements to make it even faster. The two recent changes were (1) moving the HM to Sat which made the course less crowded and eliminated the guessing of which people were going to duck out at at 13 miles and cut to the finish line for the HM, and (2) reducing the number of turnarounds. I believe this went from 3 T/A's down to 2 T/A's in the current course. MLK Drive (West River Dr) and Kelly Drive seemed freshly paved when I ran them over the summer. I know a few women looking for OTQ's and would be seeking a sub-2:45 time at Philly in 2018.

The changes have made it a bit faster, although from a spectator standpoint, the old route (Falls Bridge) was a nice place to see somebody twice within a few minutes.  There is only one 180 on the course now I believe, in Manayunk, as they also eliminated the cone on West River (the turn coming down black hill is not too tight).

The start last year was really different than previously.  Aside from being emptier, there wasn't even a starting clock at the beginning, and it was extremely informal.  The security for entering corrals was gone.  My wacky wind based strategy last year was to start exactly 4 minutes behind the 3:15 pace group and run them down by the beginning of kelly drive to help with the wind (didn't catch them until manayunk so that failed), but I was able to literally step aside 30 feet from the starting point on the grass and wait there 4 minutes which would not have worked in previous years.  In keeping with the disorganization of the race, I tried to talk to people at the Expo about my strategy (If I would be forced to start with my corral) and the answer of the woman supposedly in charge of race organization showed she had no idea how the start was going to look.

I’m sure everyone is thrilled to see Strugglr here, but it just feels weird that Dingo hasn’t joined him. They’re like fish+chips...you can’t have one without the other.

 

Strugglr - I think IAM kicked your ass because he runs a lot more miles than you. 

Dingo is scared of me. He always talks trash but after I beat him in three straight 10 milers in a 4 month period this spring I think I got the KO on him. Maybe he will prove me wrong and show up for Cherry Blossom for another beating.

IAM just out worked me. Period. I know high mileage doesn't work for everyone but it works for him. He's a solid 1200+ miles ahead of me this year and it showed. I have not found a way to consistently put in 90+ mpw with other life priorities. Unless I figure out how to get 1 more hour in each day I'll give it a few more goes at 70 mpw to try to get under 2:40.

kram - Good luck tomorrow in the Philly Half! Not sure if you shared a goal, but I'm guessing based on your 2:49 finish at Illinois, you'll be in that 1:18-1:22ish range. Weather looks good!

Half starts at 7:30, my 8K isn't until 10:45... I'll see if I can get out the door and get down there earlier, but you'll be finished by the time I find parking.

Yes I was working out for 12-15 hours per week for my Tri this summer. But only running about 45 mpw, 6 hours. I was able to get so much workout time because 5-6 hours was biking which I could do at home while I "watch" the kids. Tri training and 45 mpw made me a slower runner for sure. It was an uphill battle back into straight running but the Tri was worth it.

I never said there was a talent gap Dannyboy. I said I am stronger at short races; fast twitch. You ran a lot of fast intervals during your cycle; 5k to 10k pace. I have a 5k in two weeks and I'm interested to see what I can do since I haven't run faster than 5:50 pace in 7 months. Expectations are low.

Strugglr - I was impressed you were putting in those hours for tri training. I'd like to put in more, but it seems after 10-12, my body starts to break down, that coincides with 75-80 hours per week. I think I need to add some strength or cross-training if I want to get beyond where I am today.

IAM - good luck in the 5K, hopefully you'll be able to make a race with those winds.

I missed my 8K start today. I left my house at 9:00 for a 10:45 start, should have been a 40 minute trip. But traffic on the damn Schuylkill Expressway (I-76) sucks. I got detoured and decided to park a few miles away and run to the start. I took a wrong turn and got a mile away and the saw that the gun was about to go off in 3 min. DNS, oh well. Always another day.

 

and your 5k PR is about a 2:41 FM equivalent, without you ever quite hitting "reasonable" mileage to get deep into your potential. It would be fun to find out what a 85-90mpw cycle would do for you.

Wait a sec - Isn't his 5k PR 16:45? Not that we aren't all speriments of 1, but I don't think 16:45 = 2:41. I think his Prs (as listed in the sig anyway) are pretty in-line with expectations.

I'm sure there's all kinds of background history and context I'm missing, just chiming in as someone with reasonably close PRs to his.

16:45 on pretty much any calculator gives you 2:40 to 2:41 mid.  The issue is those calculators are only good at like 100 plus mpws.  So ideally Strugglr would be there on higher mileage

That seems to be a pretty significant issue, as most of humanity has to, you know, work and stuff. Or maybe I just gave up on marathons too early (or not - they suck). Anyway, carry on.

16:45 on pretty much any calculator gives you 2:40 to 2:41 mid.  The issue is those calculators are only good at like 100 plus mpws.  So ideally Strugglr would be there on higher mileage

Yep. I think Strugglr and IAM are similar in talent from what I’ve seen posted over the years. But the marathon gap is widening. I don’t think he needs to go 100 plus, but a couple of 85/90mpw cycles would see a big improvement and with his strength training I’m sure he could handle it. If he was able to bike 5/6 hours at home for tri training then he could always buy a treadmill and ‘watch’ the kids!

Good luck Slingrunner and anyone else racing!