Forums >Running 101>Long distance running technique
Hi all,
Just trying to get my head around what element of the stride you should focus most of your effort. From what I've read it would seem that you should land fairly short and at a fast pace, so is most of the focus/effort on pulling our ankle back towards your butt? Is it whats going on behind you (pulling action of ankle to butt), rather than focussing on extending your foot landing that is where the main effort should be? In contrast, is the effort of lunging forward with your knee like a gazelle, the main area where your running effort should be? Many thanks, any thoughts would be appreciated. Happy running. Cheers, Tim
an amazing likeness
... Pawback is just as it's written, paw (foot) and back (backward swing). And you actually said it right in the middle of your own post; IT OCCURS. It's not something you consciously try to do (well, I guess you CAN but it may make you a bit awckward especially if you didn't have a clear idea of what you're doing and what your body (foot) is really doing). I like what Dr. Yessis has to say and I thoroughly enjoyed his "Explosive Running" except for some exercises in the end. If you watch this footage (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjrEyfQC5NQ&feature=related), you should be able to tell that, while your Center of Gravity is kept still (in the film), your foot DOES naturally swing back to alleviate the landing shock. It has to, otherwise, it'll create too much friction (when landing on fore- or mid-foot). Even when you see this footage (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F0UlMam8-lw&feature=related), you can see foot somewhat swings backward upon landing. Not to an extent because you don't really have to when landing hard on your heel. Some people really stick their foot out in front and may not even see the slightest pawback and that means you'll be getting almost entire landing shock shooting up your leg. If I remember it correctly, what I had suggested to you... Well, before I made a suggestion to you, you were landing mid-foot but, because you weren't really lifting your knee, you were sticking your foot way out in the front though you were dorsi-flexing your foot so you were landing mid-foot. That's actually what I meant by creating too much friction. You really don't want to do that particularly on treadmill because it already creates backward "pull" because the belt is moving backward. By trying to move your leg in a circular motion, you will be naturally bringing your foot backwards and you shouldn't have to think about it--it occurs. I'm curious, though--where did you see Steve Magnas saying that pawback wouldn't help? Help or not help, it HAPPENS. I'm wondering what he meant by pawback--something he thinks you'd have to soncsiously do??? I know the guy and we sort of go way back and I like his attitude about trying to figure out a thing or two about running. But that's the problem about over-thinking a bit too much (yeah, I can see some people here laughing, "Nobby's the one who writes so damn long...!"); but understanding running and analyzing running are two different things. There are causes and occurances. Pawback is NOT a cause of something ("If I swing my foot backwards just before landing, such-and-such could happen... (maybe I can run a mile in 4 minutes???)"). On the contrary, actually, if you're running near 4-minutes, pawback would naturally occur. But regardless of the running speed, if you're landing lightly, it should naturally happen. ...
...
Pawback is just as it's written, paw (foot) and back (backward swing). And you actually said it right in the middle of your own post; IT OCCURS. It's not something you consciously try to do (well, I guess you CAN but it may make you a bit awckward especially if you didn't have a clear idea of what you're doing and what your body (foot) is really doing).
I like what Dr. Yessis has to say and I thoroughly enjoyed his "Explosive Running" except for some exercises in the end. If you watch this footage (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjrEyfQC5NQ&feature=related), you should be able to tell that, while your Center of Gravity is kept still (in the film), your foot DOES naturally swing back to alleviate the landing shock. It has to, otherwise, it'll create too much friction (when landing on fore- or mid-foot). Even when you see this footage (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F0UlMam8-lw&feature=related), you can see foot somewhat swings backward upon landing. Not to an extent because you don't really have to when landing hard on your heel. Some people really stick their foot out in front and may not even see the slightest pawback and that means you'll be getting almost entire landing shock shooting up your leg.
If I remember it correctly, what I had suggested to you... Well, before I made a suggestion to you, you were landing mid-foot but, because you weren't really lifting your knee, you were sticking your foot way out in the front though you were dorsi-flexing your foot so you were landing mid-foot. That's actually what I meant by creating too much friction. You really don't want to do that particularly on treadmill because it already creates backward "pull" because the belt is moving backward. By trying to move your leg in a circular motion, you will be naturally bringing your foot backwards and you shouldn't have to think about it--it occurs.
I'm curious, though--where did you see Steve Magnas saying that pawback wouldn't help? Help or not help, it HAPPENS. I'm wondering what he meant by pawback--something he thinks you'd have to soncsiously do??? I know the guy and we sort of go way back and I like his attitude about trying to figure out a thing or two about running. But that's the problem about over-thinking a bit too much (yeah, I can see some people here laughing, "Nobby's the one who writes so damn long...!"); but understanding running and analyzing running are two different things. There are causes and occurances. Pawback is NOT a cause of something ("If I swing my foot backwards just before landing, such-and-such could happen... (maybe I can run a mile in 4 minutes???)"). On the contrary, actually, if you're running near 4-minutes, pawback would naturally occur. But regardless of the running speed, if you're landing lightly, it should naturally happen.
Acceptable at a dance, invaluable in a shipwreck.
Long distance running and sprinting/mid distance running are different. Trying to force some movement for longer than 5-10 minutes to increase speed will not be effective, and actually be counterproductive.
Shorter strides with faster tempo does seem to be the way to go for people who lope and bound (losing force to upward movement instead of forward momentum) who want to improve efficiency. But that change is subtle, not pronounced. It's like going from 88-89 to 90 strides per minute (176-178 to 180 for people who count both legs as a stride) and lets say 29.5" instead of 30". Many runners with thousands of miles under their belt have already naturally arrived at their efficient form.
60-64 age group - University of Oregon alumni - Irreverent and Annoying
Old , Ugly and slow
Did you just start running?
do you have a lot of pain when you run?
Do you make a lot of noise when you run on pavement?
i wouldn’t change anything if you are not in pain,
there is not just one way to run
first race sept 1977 last race sept 2007
2019 goals 1000 miles , 190 pounds , deadlift 400 touch my toes
Man, i love Nobby's posts. Someday someone should comb through the site and copy his posts into a book....
You may be over thinking this...
double post
Runners run
And maybe if that book ever made any money the royalties could go to Eric as belated compensation for all the work he did for Running Wizard that Nobby never paid him for.
totally right, Nobby has a wealth of knowledge but he didn't do right by Eric with all of that business
old woman w/hobby
Yes, what mikey said.
steph
I'm surprised this topic didn't wake the dragon. But I heard he sleeps for a few years at a time, and then posts his nonsense nonstop for a few months and disappears. I got caught up in the last awakening, not having any knowledge of the dragon, and no warning.
Thanks for all the replies, appreciate it. Cheers, Tim
link spam