Forums >Off the Beaten Path>A practical application of socialist ideas
MTA: and I challenge anybody in the USA to do a "wiki" search for the definition of "middle class in USA" this morning. Apparently SOPA has changed our ability to search wiki.
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special%3ASearch&search=middle+class+in+USA&button=
What do I win?
Dave
I maybe shouldn't be surprised, but I was somewhat surprised that the definition of middle class (upper middle class) dealt with "INCOME" rather than "NET WORTH". Haven't found much relating to the worth of a household and its relationship to class. When I was reading the link, my original thought was that "NET WORTH" would be a better basis for defining societal classes. Highly leverage people who earn more than $xxk seem like they may live like they're middle class, but in reality, they're not. However, in retrospect, I guess that INCOME is a better gauge for considering and classifying middle class. Seems like "NET WORTH / WEALTH" may be a good gauge for classes above middle class.
I maybe shouldn't be surprised, but I was somewhat surprised that the definition of middle class (upper middle class) dealt with "INCOME" rather than "NET WORTH". Haven't found much relating to the worth of a household and its relationship to class.
When I was reading the link, my original thought was that "NET WORTH" would be a better basis for defining societal classes. Highly leverage people who earn more than $xxk seem like they may live like they're middle class, but in reality, they're not.
However, in retrospect, I guess that INCOME is a better gauge for considering and classifying middle class. Seems like "NET WORTH / WEALTH" may be a good gauge for classes above middle class.
Statistics on net worth are really fascinating and probably a WHOLE lot lower than you might think.
The mean tends to skew the averages because of the significant wealth disparity in the US.
Peak median networth is in the age group 55-64 and is right around $250K.
Averaging all families, it comes to $120K per family average net worth. Presumably middle class should be some standard deviation around the median.
Bear in mind this includes the value of all retirement accounts, housing equity, etc.
I ran a mile and I liked it, liked it, liked it. dgb2n@yahoo.com
No Talent Drips
Frothy...
Dei Gratia
I do not understand how 55-64 Y/Os are only @ $250k - Although is this per person - So a married couple = $500K?
Statistics on net worth are really fascinating and probably a WHOLE lot lower than you might think. The mean tends to skew the averages because of the significant wealth disparity in the US. Peak median networth is in the age group 55-64 and is right around $250K. Averaging all families, it comes to $120K per family average net worth. Presumably middle class should be some standard deviation around the median. Bear in mind this includes the value of all retirement accounts, housing equity, etc.
I am fuller bodied than Dopplebock
Median - Half the people have more than that and the other half less than that, sounds about right.
I'm not surprised (as it's MEDIAN). In fact, I'm kind of surprised that 1/2 of the households have as much as $250k in worth. Wouldn't have been overly surprised if it were lower.
Life Goals:
#1: Do what I can do
#2: Enjoy life
rectumdamnnearkilledem
We should petition Eric to add that smilie...
Getting the wind knocked out of you is the only way to
remind your lungs how much they like the taste of air.
~ Sarah Kay
That is a "per family" figure. It reinforces that savings rates are really low relative to income in this country. People spend what they earn. And usually then some.
http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/2012/tables/12s0721.pdf
Also consider that at that point, the family has had 30-40 working years to accumulate net worth. Just looking at that as a straight line number, it means only $8000 per year roughly in accumulated net worth including all appreciation on assets, paying down a mortgage over that time, etc.
not bad for mile 25
:-poooo
Socialism is not at all what was being described in the story.
Redistribution of wealth is not a hallmark of Socialism. It's not even technically a hallmark of Communism.
In a Socialist environment, the means of production and distribution of goods and services are, by and large, owned by the government. What little private industry exists is strictly controlled, generally through legislation to set prices and output levels.
In theory, the government is a duly elected one, and always represents the will of the people. Of course, in a Republic (which is what the US is), it is theoretically the same idea.
The teacher is not elected, he is closer to a monarch or despot. His decision to distribute grades according to an average is not really directly dictating the production of right answers. All he's done is show that people like to be rewarded for their efforts in some fashion. However, that reward does NOT have to be monetary (or in this example, a good grade). It can be done through other means. Even in a Socialist setting, it would be possible to instill a level of competition amongst people, if done correctly (promotions, days off, titles, increases in pay, bonuses, etc.).
Besides, in Socialism, goods are still distributed based on a person's efforts. In Communism, goods are distributed based on needs. So now the question is... How much does a student "need" an A? Would a B do? Why not a C?
too many people think they can only scrape by on 80 grand a year. adjust your expectations or risk becomming another Willy Loman. the middle class in America... we've made it. it's what people have said they've been struggling for for thousands of years. it just seems to be human nature to think 3 cars > 2 cars and so on and so on...
Yup!
+1
Good Bad & The Monkey
I think Ternt may have been referring to this bit of Rick Santorum's genious.
I'm running somewhere tomorrow. It's going to be beautiful. I can't wait.
Poor baby
Correct
Gotcha. Haven't been following the details of that political stuff yet.
Prince of Fatness
I thought America did not have a class system.
I've been told that I have no class.
Not at it at all.