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"Everything you know about marathons is wrong" -- NYTimes (Read 1116 times)

vicentefrijole


    Okay, maybe not EVERYTHING. But still... an interesting summary of some recent findings. http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/03/sports/sportsspecial/03marathon.html?ex=1163394000&en=62462513281924b9&ei=5070
    Wingz


    Professional Noob

      Interesting. I wonder if other studies will bear out the same things...

      Roads were made for journeys...

      vicentefrijole


        I think the bit about raising your legs after a long run (to keep from blacking out) makes a lot of sense. I'm not as convinced that dehydration (and depleted electrolytes) are never involved in cramping, collapsing, etc, but perhaps that's just because I've been so indoctrinated by the old wisdom. I would hope that people wouldn't read this and think "Hey! I don't need to hydrate during long runs!" but I think it's reasonable to think that there are other dangers to think about also. I think science/medicine reporting in major newspapers is not a reliable source of information (and TV is even worse), but they are a place to get some new ideas to discuss. Big grin
        mikeymike


          It's an interesting article--I don't know that it really contradicts all conventional wisdom, but there are some new wrinkles. I can't say much about crampind during marathons or passing out at the finish. I can, though, speak in detail about collapsing an hour AFTER a marathon and then cramping badly--not just in the primary musles that were used to run the marathon either. In my case it was due ENTIRELY to dehydration. I think I actually confused the staff at the med tent at the 2004 Boston Marathon because other than being dehydrated, I was fine. My blood chemistry was so normal that the nurses thought I was diabetic. It took a while to explain to the doctor that I had basically jogged the 2nd half having bagged all pretenses of racing due to the extreme heat, and that I drank no plain water in the 2nd half, only gatorade. After 2 bags of saline in the arm the cramping was gone and I was good as new. It was actually the easiest recovery from a marathon I've ever had since I reallly didn't go to the well in terms of effort and beat my legs up or deplete my glycogen stores. The only soreness I had was from the cramping, and that was mostly in my abdominal muscles. I can attest to the raising the legs helping to regain conciousness too. They had to hold my legs up to ask me my friggin name, I was so loopy. FWIW I ran my PR under sunny to partly cloudy skies. It was 53 degrees, though.

          Runners run

          vicentefrijole


            I also remember reading somewhere that it can be dangerous to take a really hot shower (or get in a hot tub, I suspect) after a long, hot run (when you're already dehydrated). The idea is that the heat makes your capillaries dialate all over your skin, so your blood pools there, and your blood pressure can drop dramatically. I don't know if this really happens, but it sounds possible (and it's a fascinating concept). MM, I too prefer racing/competing with at least a little sunshine... 50 degrees with mostly sunny skies sounds perfect. It just puts me in a better mood, for some reason. I just ran Chicago this year and it was cold and windy... but the worst part was it was sooo cloudy. I guess I'm lucky it didn't rain (as was forecast) but the gloomy weather didn't help my running either! Tongue
            JakeKnight


              Interesting, especially about the hydration. It does seem true that the first response to cramping is to force fluids; I did that myself at the CMM, and I think I threw everything out of whack because of it. I thought a couple pretzels probably would have been better ... but maybe when I was laying there on my back looking like an epileptic crab, I should have been stretching or something? Confused The only thing I know helped was a very tall beer. Then again, it usually does. This part especially rang true: "Warmer weather had a greater effect on slower runners. On a 77-degree day, an elite runner would be about 5 percent slower than on a 41-degree day. But a runner who finished in three hours on a 41-degree day would be slowed by about 12 percent on a 77-degree day, finishing in 3 hours 21 minutes. One reason, Montain said, could be that slower runners spend more time on the course, and the temperature generally rises through the day." Weather may not affect the elites as much, but it sure affects us slowpokes - and being on the road almost 5 hours last time made it much, much worse. I'd rather run in 30 degrees than 70 degrees. (Of course, if I could finish in 3:30, it might not be so hot by the time I got done ...) As for sunshine ... clouds just make me gloomy. It might all be in my head, but it seems easier to run on a sunny day.

              E-mail: eric.fuller.mail@gmail.com
              -----------------------------

                As for sunshine ... clouds just make me gloomy. It might all be in my head, but it seems easier to run on a sunny day.
                I agree. And the fact of the matter is that what's "in my head" counts.
                My Masters (>50) Race PR's: 5K - 20:17 10K - 42:36 HM - 1:31:22 Marathon - 3:20:48
                vicentefrijole


                  I agree. And the fact of the matter is that what's "in my head" counts.
                  Not to be a complete science dork, but I wonder if there is something even more physiological going on. Could it be that sunlight effects energy metabolism (through circadian rhythms, vitamin D metabolism, or something else?)? I've heard some really fascinating lectures about the impact that disrupting natural circadian rhythms can have on a variety of health outcomes (for example, increased rates of certain types of cancers in people who work the 3rd shift). Of course, the impact of purely psychological changes on running performance (a bad mood = a bad run) is pretty clear in my own running... and it seems to have an even greater impact the longer I run.
                  Michael Bennett


                    Hey there, I'm dying to read the NY Times article but I can't download it - does anyone have a pdf or some such? Just picking up on some aspects of the thread - I've had the pleasure of fainting five times in a row after an event (Oxfam 100km trailwalker - forest/mountain, v challenging terrain - Taupo NZ). I was fully hydrated, I peed the whole way - so that wasn't the issue. My mistake was getting in a hot shower for 30 minutes afterwards (the ambulance guy suggested the beers may not have helped either). And the legs-up thing is definitely right - I kept fainting because my beloved thought she should get me into a sitting position after the first one. Good intentions, but it just lead to 4 more keel overs. Just a warning - fainting for 20 seconds is like having people standing an inch from your ear and shouting at you very loud for five minutes. Not very pleasant. And bladder control goes out the window...
                    Trent


                    Good Bad & The Monkey

                      If you have fainted after a marathon, this is very serious. You need to have it thoroughly checked out. Has a physician evaluated you? You likely need a cardiac workup.
                        Like Trent said, fainting after a marathon is fairly serious and you should be evaluated. But please consider... If you lie down after a race (or any run), elevating your legs is a good idea but continuing to walk is better. While you run your legs act as a "passive pump" and help keep blood moving throughout your body, when you stop suddenly, your heart loses that assistance and the subsequent pooling of blood in your legs, combined with the decreased blood volume secondary to dehydration causes decreased blood (oxygen) supply to your brain resulting is syncope (fainting). When one faints, one falls, which helps somewhat to restore blood supply (oxygen) to the brain.