Developing Fuel Strategy While Training With Hansons (Read 177 times)

I've always used the train-low, race-high approach meaning I take in zero carbs (only water or very low carb fluids) during my training runs but then take GUs every 30-minutes or so during marathons.  Body gets used in training to having to dig deeper into fuel reserves since not being replenished.  As to why only two GUs per hour (or other product equivalents) during marathons is that the body can't usefully "process" more than about 250 calories/hour.

I guess this somewhat parralels the Hansons view that you train your 16 mile long-runs already somewhat depleted from previous days' runs, not rested.

In the back of the book, a bit buried in the Elite training portion, they talk about doing a depletion run as one of their workouts, but specifically framed as against their normal advice:

"The Depletion [long run]: We coaches are big proponents of practicing marathon nutrition during long runs, and this run abandons that practice.Some coaches strongly encourage runners to regularly avoid taking in fluids or carbohydrates on long runs because they believe it teaches the body to burn fat better. You aren't, however, going to do that in a race, so nutrition intake needs to be practiced during the majority of long runs, with a couple of exceptions. This is where the Depletion run comes in. [...]"

This is on p. 224, Appendix A, of my copy.

Thanks for the advice so far, everyone.

chubacca - thank you especially for pointing that bit out.  I haven't made it all the way through the book yet, and may have skipped over anything dealing with "elite" training, anyway.

bhearn - your point is a great one, that actually did occur to me as I was typing my post.  This will be my fourth marathon to race (I paced my wife at Tulsa in November and will pace my BIL in Little Rock in March*), and the problem is, I had bad cramping and uncontrollable shaking after my last two.  The medical staff both times told me I was dehydrated and low on electrolytes, so apparently what I was doing - drinking to thirst and eschewing electrolytes - isn't what works for me.  So, I'm kind of still at the drawing board as far as hydration/fueling, frustratingly enough.  I may just go back to what worked in that first marathon (alternating sips of water and Gatorade every mile or two), though I wasn't really pushing for any kind of time goal at that one.

*I know, I know - pacing someone for their first marathon during the training cycle is COMPLETELY antithetical to everything in the Hansons book.  But, I signed up before I got the book and besides - it's fun!  I'll just be sure to take plenty of rest days afterward.

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This will be my first marathon and I've yet to ever even try to eat a gel/gu or anything like it ever.  I think on my half marathons I only did the powerade at one water stop and wasn't very thrilled about it then.  I accidently grabbed a gatorade at a water stop on a 10K and it didn't settle very well at all and I normally have a cast iron stomach.

 

The sweet taste of the powerade is what gets me more than anything, I guess that's about the only way they are going to pack a lot of calories in there though.  I drink powerade zero when I'm done with my long runs, but I think I will actually need the calories during the marathon.  I've already checked the water stops at the marathon I'll be running and they only have one stop with GU and it is at mile 18 so I think I should have a fueling strategy of my own planned.

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Sports drinks don't have to be obnoxiously sweet. I use Succeed's Clip2 or Ultra because of the mellow taste. I think some of the Hammer products (Heed?) may also have less taste to them, but one tastes like chalk (don't remember which I tried, but I wouldn't touch Hammer products for years after that experience).

Many gels are excessively sweet also, IMHO. I could only use about 1/3 of a packet at a time - just too sweet. You can make some drinks into gels. (succeed has directions how to do it) and put it in a gel flask. I've tried a couple commercial gels over the years, and most weren't worth the hassle to deal with. Peanut butter gel may be an exception - the only gel I've tasted that's made it into my race food supplies, although I never actually used it in a race.

I tend to prefer shot bloks and suck on them in longer races.

I have actually been thinking about messing around trying gummy bears, gummy worms, and stuff like that instead of GU.

 

In some ways I think a gummy bear every 10 minutes might be better than a packet of GU every hour.

 

Maybe I could just count out 26 gummy bears and eat one at every mile marker!

I kinda like that idea, but have you calculated the calories in 26 gummy bears?

My problem is I never feel the need for fueling in up to 3 hour runs.  My marathon will be somewhat longer than that, so I don't know whether/how much I'll need.

I generally do long runs up to 16 miles without fuel (I drink water to thirst, though) but I do practice fueling a couple long runs at least.  For me, part of it is figuring out logistics - can I get the packet open while running at race pace, can I get amounts in my mouth that I can swallow at race pace, can I swallow, period, at race pace - that kind of thing.  I also like to check that my stomach hasn't decided that something doesn't agree with me all of a sudden.  I have a pretty tolerant stomach, but I've found that I have a hard time chewing while running race pace, so gels are better for me. Also, fruit flavored stuff doesn't tell me too well once I'm working hard.  This is good stuff to know before a race.  I know for me personally that when I am fueling I need to start fairly early in the run because if I wait too long my stomach flat out rebels at digesting anything and will cramp instead and that's been a trial an error thing.  I used to think I just couldn't tolerate fuel while running, but it turns out I can as long as I don't wait too long to start.

I think as long as you know what your stomach can tolerate, and have worked out the whens, whats and hows, you don't necessarily have to fuel on every long run. My current race day strategy is my usual early morning peanut butter toast, then a gel 15-30 min before the race, gel at 5, 10, 15, and 20 miles, and water alternating with gatorade  as desired at the aid stations in between.

I don't see how the fact you're "doing Hansons" is relevant to the question. You probably don't need fuel on a 20-mile training run anymore than you do on a 16 mile MP run. So if you're taking Gu on a training run, whether it's a 20 miler or a 16 miler, you're doing it just to make sure it agrees with you. It won't  give you much data about how much fuel you'll need during the race or how your body will react to trying to take in fuel while running 26.2 miles at marathon pace.