2021 Sub 3:00 Marathon Thread (Read 208 times)

     

    The Jay Moutain has been added to my list, thank you!!

     

    The 50k road ultra sounds downright awful. I'm not a fan of loops or roads.

     

    I completely agree with your comments on the ultra running community however I've found so much more joy in short trail races. They have the same energy, the same after-race food & beer & party, and I get to run faster (relatively speaking) while also enjoying some of those crazy features like stream crossings, absurdly steep hills, mud, the occasional literal climb and I'm not wiped out the next week. As a bonus I occasionally get to pass road racers who are faster than me in the late miles because they have little to no experience pacing extreme mud/hills/terrain! It's like XC on crack (at least the best courses are).

     

    Good perspective zebano. I'm thinking to start out with some shorter trail races this summer and maybe go for the 25k in the Macedonia Trail race in the fall (they have a 50k but that might be a bit much). It looks tough; some rock climbing parts requiring a rope and some pretty rough looking trails. I'm excited to go there for a run once all the snow melts; it's only about 10 miles from my house.

    2:52:16 (2018)

    CommanderKeen


    Aspiring Hobby Jogger

        

      The 50k road ultra sounds downright awful. I'm not a fan of loops or roads.

       

       

      Maybe try coming to flyover country for a road ultra. Around here they're typically on rural dirt and/or gravel roads, quite different from pavement.

      5k: 18:25 10/19 (solo track TT) │ 10k: 38:56 4/18 │ HM: 1:24:16 11/19 │ M: 3:04:13 11/18

       

      Upcoming Races:

       

      4/17 - Happy Camper 5k

      10/2 - Wurst Race Half

      12/5 - California International Marathon

      zebano


         

        Good perspective zebano. I'm thinking to start out with some shorter trail races this summer and maybe go for the 25k in the Macedonia Trail race in the fall (they have a 50k but that might be a bit much). It looks tough; some rock climbing parts requiring a rope and some pretty rough looking trails. I'm excited to go there for a run once all the snow melts; it's only about 10 miles from my house.

         

         JTReeves That one looks fun!! Sadly I don't live out east but I'm always looking for destination races so I have ideas when we take  family vacations   ; If you can recommend anything in Tennessee I'd be much obliged (covid-dependent) though I'm trying to see if I can get things to line up with the Barkley classic (which may already be sold out).

         

        Keen -- Thanks, I think you've offered that before but a road 50k really has no appeal to me. Even if it's gravel (we have a few of those here in Iowa thank you very much), I'm going to just race a marathon (and I don't currently have the motivation for that). My cousin and I are going to do a self supported ultra across Isle Royale this August which should be pretty epic! and I'm strongly contemplating driving 10 hours to run Devil on the Divide.  I haven't decided  yet if I'm up for a 50k or just the half. I'm sure there are some hidden trail gems in Oklahoma, I just haven't looked for them.

         

        Sorry for derailing your marathon thread with all this ultra talk. =)

        1600 - 5:23 (2018), 5k - 19:33 (2018), 10k - 45:24 (2017), half - 1:38:57 (2018), Mary - 3:37:17 (2018)

           

           JTReeves That one looks fun!! Sadly I don't live out east but I'm always looking for destination races so I have ideas when we take  family vacations   ; If you can recommend anything in Tennessee I'd be much obliged (covid-dependent) though I'm trying to see if I can get things to line up with the Barkley classic (which may already be sold out).

           

          Keen -- Thanks, I think you've offered that before but a road 50k really has no appeal to me. Even if it's gravel (we have a few of those here in Iowa thank you very much), I'm going to just race a marathon (and I don't currently have the motivation for that). My cousin and I are going to do a self supported ultra across Isle Royale this August which should be pretty epic! and I'm strongly contemplating driving 10 hours to run Devil on the Divide.  I haven't decided  yet if I'm up for a 50k or just the half. I'm sure there are some hidden trail gems in Oklahoma, I just haven't looked for them.

           

          Sorry for derailing your marathon thread with all this ultra talk. =)

           

          No derailing at all, it's all running in the end! I'm not sure about races in Tennessee; I live in CT and the race I mentioned is in Kent, CT at Macedonia Brook State Park. Too bad TN Weather is not posting here anymore; he is a TN resident and could definitely give you some good advice on races there. Devil on the Divide looks incredible!

          2:52:16 (2018)

          OMR


            OMR- how did it feel returning to running after the elliptical?

             

            Thanks for asking, Dwave.  The first run back felt OK...HR was about normal for the easy stuff.  I did some short fartleks, and the legs really didn't want to move all that fast, but I also didn't want to push too hard.  A few days later, I repeated that, and the pace was a little faster.  I'm feeling a lot of fatigue now, which isn't all that surprising, but that could be due to a number of things.  We'll see how things feel in a couple of weeks.  I'm more concerned about getting long runs in at this point.

             

            RP:  Well, maybe the Fall 50 could be an easy run in prep for CIM?  ;-)

             

            Regarding trail running and ultras, I wish I lived in an area more conducive to preparing for them, because I really do enjoy that experience and mindset, and being better prepared would make them a little less painful.  Maybe when I retire...

            darkwave


            Mother of Cats

               

              Thanks for asking, Dwave.  The first run back felt OK...HR was about normal for the easy stuff.  I did some short fartleks, and the legs really didn't want to move all that fast, but I also didn't want to push too hard.  A few days later, I repeated that, and the pace was a little faster. 

               

              Interesting:  I am fascinated by your experiment with the elliptical, since it's cool to see how various forms of cross-training, when done exclusively, translate to running.  And you're honestly the only person I know who has used the elliptical as their exclusive cross-training.  Most people I know opt for pool-running, with biking falling second and swimming third.

               

              I'm assuming your cadence is slower on the elliptical than it would be when running - could that have contributed to the legs not wanting to move?  You were just unaccustomed to a faster cadence?

              Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

               

              And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.


              Elite Jogger

                I am happy to report to Cinnamon that I ran 40 miles this week!

                 

                Tue - 8.3@8:26

                Wed - 12@7:27

                Thur - 5@8:48

                Sat - 14.9@7:32

                 

                The Wed and Sat I did some faster stuff in my new Saucony Endorphin Speed shoes and they were amazing!  I’ve ordered a pair of the Saucony Shift which could possibly become my new easy run shoe.

                 

                I’ve got a long long way to go to get back into PR shape again...but it’ll happen in September!

                 

                JT - I thought ultra talk was banned after last year.    Btw can you change the Big Half to 22nd August on the list as it was postponed...hopefully the Richmond marathon is still on!

                5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)


                Elite Jogger

                  Think positive!

                   

                  5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

                  OMR


                     

                    Interesting:  I am fascinated by your experiment with the elliptical, since it's cool to see how various forms of cross-training, when done exclusively, translate to running.  And you're honestly the only person I know who has used the elliptical as their exclusive cross-training.  Most people I know opt for pool-running, with biking falling second and swimming third.

                     

                    I'm assuming your cadence is slower on the elliptical than it would be when running - could that have contributed to the legs not wanting to move?  You were just unaccustomed to a faster cadence?

                     

                    Cadence was definitely slower than running.  Ours has resistance levels up to 24, and in order to get my heart rate up, I was using resistance rather than focusing on a really fast cadence most of the time.  So, on a lot of the longer workouts, I would spend some time at each resistance level; for example, spend 3 minutes at 24, then drop it down to 10 for 3 minutes, etc.  I think it was good for strengthening, but in addition to the slower cadence, I think my stride length is also a little shorter right now because you can’t get the same extension.  Things are continuing to improve, though.

                     

                    Heard on the local news Friday that Fargo is planning on having races for their St. Patrick’s Day celebration on March 20; options include 7K/14K/21K.  So, putting my long runs on Tuesday for the next few weeks in the event I want to jump into one of those.

                     

                    My week:

                     

                    S:  6.5M elliptical

                    M:  8.1M elliptical

                    T:  11.2M @ 8:03 w/8 x 1min @ 5K effort

                    W:  8.4M @ 8:23

                    T:  5.8M @ 8:43

                    F:  5.8M @ 8:42

                    S:  7.5M @ 8:15 w/3 x 800m, 2 x 200m

                     

                    Total:  14.6M elliptical, 38.7M running

                    Ian5


                      Weekly for period: From: 03/01/2021 To 03/07/2021

                      Date Name Distance
                      in mi
                      Duration Avg Pace
                      per mi
                      Elevation Gain
                      in ft
                      03/02/2021 Lunch Run 10.55 01:27:21 08:17 495
                      03/03/2021 Afternoon Run 8.83 01:11:22 08:05 384
                      03/05/2021 Afternoon Run 8.83 01:10:46 08:01 384
                      03/06/2021 Afternoon Run 7.09 00:57:42 08:08 266
                      03/07/2021 50 mile weeks are back. 14.98 02:00:35 08:03 610

                      Total distance:50.28

                      Keen-I have a 55km road ultra around Dartmoor in June,it is quite hilly for a road ultra but it is an amazing race.

                      As seen above the PF is still improving,I have changed my shoes to NB 1080's as the reviews were very good for PF due to the max cushioning,got to say I love them,thinking about getting a pair of Nike Invincibles as it is their max cushion shoe.

                      5k 17:35,10k 36:43,10m 61:55,HM 1:24:03,Full 3:07:39

                        Mikkey:  Great to see you are back at it!  Plenty of time to get into shape. Glad to hear the Endorphins are working out for you. I have the Endorphin Pro; not sure exactly what is the difference between that and the Speed, but I really like the shoe. Awesome picture by the way!

                         

                        OMR: Nice week; I think adding those shorter bits of speedwork in should get the turnover back in no time.

                         

                        Ian: Congrats on the 50 mile week! I'm glad you are winning the PF battle.

                         

                        I just put in easy miles this week, as I didn't want to jump into a workout too soon and bugger up the hamstring again. For the long run today I wanted to do 22 miles but wasn't sure if it would be all steady or if I could add some MP miles; I ended up feeling good and the hammy never got angry at me and was able to do the last 8 at MP. I should be able to get back to a threshold type workout this week. I feel like I lost some fitness with this injury but not a huge amount, and hopefully I have enough time to get it back (5 weeks till race day).

                         

                        Weekly for period: From: 03/01/2021 To 03/07/2021

                        Date Name Distance
                        in mi
                        Duration Avg Pace
                        per mi
                        Elevation Gain
                        in ft
                        Tue Morning Run on treadmill 10.02 1:24:25 8:25 0
                        Wed Morning Run 14.02 1:50:09 7:51 735
                        Thu Morning Run 10.02 1:24:19 8:25 545
                        Fri Morning Run w/ hill loop 11.06 1:32:13 8:20 935
                        Sat Morning Run 6.53 56:14 8:37 558
                        Sun Long run w/ 8 @ 6:30-6:35 22.03 2:35:49 7:04 948

                        Total distance: 73.67 mi

                        2:52:16 (2018)

                        jhudak55


                          JT: Solid mileage on six days of running. 

                          OMR: Looking good coming off of only elliptical work. 

                          DW: I was thinking about running the Bishop’s 5k next week on the C&O. I ran the course today and I’m not sure how I feel about an unpaved course. The are stretches that are almost perfect and others which have quite a few rocks sticking up.  

                          Ian: I really like the shoes New Balance is putting out. I have a couple pairs of the fuel cell rebel and beacon v2. 

                          Mickey: Nice week. Fingers crossed on Richmond. 

                          My week

                          50.1 miles

                          M: 3.1 miles easy (9:20)

                          T: 9 miles with 2x2 tempo (6:48, 6:38, recovery mile, 6:34, 6:24)

                          W: 5.1 miles easy (8:57)

                          T: 6.4 miles with 4x800 then 1 mile (2:59, 3:02, 3:04, 3:04, 6:09)

                          F: 5.1 miles aerobic (7:53)

                          S: 7.3 miles with 5x200 (37, 40, 40, 39, 39)

                          S: 14 mile long run (7:48)

                           

                          Good week for me. Was supposed to do 6x800 on Thursday, but had to abandon the last two reps because a field hockey game was starting. Opted to do one mile in an unfamiliar neighborhood next to the high school. Was trying to avoid hills which added three 180 degree turns. 

                          Regarding ultras, I have no desire to run anything further than a marathon. However, I’ve watched many of the YouTube documentaries and those guys are amazing. They do have all of the scenery going for them too.

                          darkwave


                          Mother of Cats

                            Mikkey - great picture!  FWIW, I know some people who really like the Speeds.

                             

                            OMR - the stride length thing makes total sense to me.  I've read (and experienced) similar from doing exclusively hill workouts - you're developing power and aerobic fitness, but the stride gets shortened and needs to be lengthened out again.  Good news on the races.

                             

                            Ian - congrats on the 50M week and good news about the PF.

                             

                            JTReeves - I was so happy to see you laying down solid miles again.  Really nice long run.  I keep thinking this down time may have worked out perfectly for you, and kept you from overcooking the cycle.

                             

                            JHudak - I personally don't run on the towpath any more - those rocks and my sh!tty ankle are a bad combination.  From what I remember, the part of the towpath just west of Fletchers can be pretty beaten up.  I'm not sure the 5K you're talking about gets that far - I think it starts at the Aqueduct in Georgetown.

                             

                            Good week for you!  I'm assuming this was one of the Arlington tracks? I've heard that they're now closed to non-school kids from 3:30 to 7:30 or 8 pm each weeknight, which really sucks for afternoon/evening runners.

                             

                            ***

                             

                            My week:

                            60 miles, 1500 yards swimming, and 2 hours of pool-running
                            M: 50 minutes pool-running and upper body weights/core.
                            T: 12 miles including 6x800m in 3:07, 3:08. 3:07, 3:08, 3:02, 3:03; jogging recoveries between 2:21 and 2:34. Followed with leg strengthwork and 500 yards recovery swimming
                            W: 10.5 miles very easy (9:03), drills and 4 steep hill sprints, and streaming yoga. First dose of Moderna vaccine midday.
                            Th: 50 minutes pool-running and streaming yoga.
                            F: 11 miles on the treadmill, including a tempo workout of 2 miles, 1 mile in 13:20 (6:40/6:40) and 6:32, with 4:40 jogging rest in between. Followed with leg strengthwork and 500 yards recovery swimming.
                            Sa: 11 miles very easy (8:55), plus drills, 6 steep hill sprints, and upper body weights/core.
                            Su: 14 miles progressive, split as the first 5 miles averaging 9:07 pace, next 5 miles averaging 7:51 pace, next 4 miles averaging 6:56 pace, and then a 1.5 mile cooldown back to my car. Followed with leg strengthwork, 500 yards recovery swimming and 20 minutes pool-running.

                             

                            Felt a bit off on Friday when I started my tempo workout, so I cut it down to 2 miles, 1 mile from the planned 4 miles straight.  I think it was probably just a very mild fatigue thing from getting my first shot on Wednesday.

                             

                            Tuesday was my team's first track workout in several months - Only about 8 of us, but it was still nice to be back and have 3-4 people around my pace to run with.  It was cold, it was dark, it was stupid windy.  And still great to be there.

                             

                            In other news, I did my long run in the Adidas Adios 5 (which is the latest iteration of the traditional Adios Boost, not the fancy Adios Pro that is Adidas's version of the Vaporfly).  I thought the Adios 5 was clunky when I ran easy pace in it, but it feels much much better at marathon pace.    I've historically done all of my marathon pace training in the Adios 1, 2, or 4 (I hated the 3) with occasional use of the sub-2.  It's nice to know that the Adios 5 works really well for that purpose also.

                            Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

                             

                            And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

                              jhudak: Nice week with lots of quality in there. Looks like you are setting up well for your 5k time trial.

                               

                              DW: Congrats on getting vaccinated! And on your track group meeting up again. That had to be nice. Sounds like overall you had a fairly good (ie, minimal) reaction to dose #1. I'm interested in your experience with the Adios 5; how do you think it compares with the Adios 4? I'm torn between the Adios 4 and the Endorphin Pro for my marathon; though the Adios is not a "supershoe" I feel like I might be a tiny bit faster in it than the Endorphin. If the Adios 5 is better than the 4 it may be the clear winner.

                              2:52:16 (2018)

                              Marby


                                Ian – Great that the plantar pain is lower and the mileage higher.  I slept in a boot when symptoms were at the worst, I reckon it helped the lessen symptoms but did nothing to address the underlying.

                                 

                                OMR – Must be nice to be outdoors again and have the prospect of a local race.  Feels like the weather has turned here… thought about putting on long sleeves the other day ;D

                                 

                                Jhudak – Nice week.

                                 

                                DW – Good to hear jab one is done and your team is back together at the track.

                                 

                                Mikkey – That photo is awesome.

                                 

                                JTR – Fantastic that the hamstring felt good enough to tackle the long run & marathon pace.

                                 

                                I strained a calf on Feb 17 and lost about 9 days running getting that sorted. Wasn't very good at keeping up here or on strava during that. Did still manage to get in decent long runs last and this weekend, so the 50k is still a goer (Mar 21).

                                Weekly for period: From: 03/01/2021 To 03/07/2021

                                Date Name Distance
                                in mi
                                Duration Avg Pace
                                per mi
                                Elevation Gain
                                in ft
                                03/02/2021 Hour 6.94 01:01:13 08:49 243
                                03/04/2021 Easy 6.23 00:51:56 08:20 217
                                03/05/2021 Easy 5.08 00:43:54 08:39 187
                                03/07/2021 BRT Queenscliff-Drysdale 21.68 03:07:24 08:39 600

                                Total distance: 39.92mi

                                10K 41:35 (2016), Half 1:27:01 (2015) Marathon 3:02:48 (2015)