unsportsmanlike conduct in cross country (Read 509 times)

Lotuse


    I just want to get your opinion on this situation

    this week, we had two Cross Country races, One League meet (thursday) and one Invitational (Saturday) that our coaches had to use their own money to get us in because we really don't have a school budget for that. ... 
    This invitational (4th time we are going) happens to be a very fast course and mostly everyone sets new Personal Records because of it... But first we had to race the league race. Our Varsity team decided that they have to be well rested because they want to break 15's on the Invitational so they agreed on a pace that was "enough to win" (as we phrased it) the race. To be straight-forward, our league isn't that good because many new schools were made and thus they cut up the league into smaller ones. So we ran this race as a team and all top 7 got 17:19 and we finished in a wall formation (in a horizontal line) sort of at the same time.. and the next guy from the other team finished at around 19:06 (3 of their runners didnt show up to the meet) 
    Then the next day come and the school administration wanted to talk with the Varsity team. They yelled at us for not being ethical while running and having no victory with honor and being unsportsmanship-like because we finished together as a team in a wall-ish formation.  and Now we have to write an essay about it and they are considering of not letting us run this week. 

    So in your opinion, do you think this is fair?

      Fair?  Hell no!

       

      This is kind of a hot button for me as one of my last races (albeit a 2-miler on a track) in High School (way-way back n 1975) suffered from a similar theme.  During the last lap, where my team-mate and I were an easy half-lap ahead of the runner for the other school, he and I decided to "tie" instead of racing each other to the end.  The coach of the other team invoked a new rule for that year and had us disqualified for tying in a manner which would have impeded the progress of his runner.

       

      After we were DQed our team ended up losing the track meet by only a couple of points.

        Are you saying your guys did or didn't impede anyone at the finish?  If no obstruction, then I have no problem at all with it.

         

        Is it that they didn't run all-out?  Cross-country is a season, not a single race.  NFL teams pull their stars in the final few games to rest them for the payoffs.  MLB pitchers get days off between starts.  Even in Olympic athletics, a 1500m runner does what's necessary to advance through the heats (as opposed to giving 100% in every race).

        “Everything you need is already inside.” -- Bill Bowerman

          Are you saying your guys did or didn't impede anyone at the finish?  If no obstruction, then I have no problem at all with it.

           

          Is it that they didn't run all-out?  Cross-country is a season, not a single race.  NFL teams pull their stars in the final few games to rest them for the payoffs.  MLB pitchers get days off between starts.  Even in Olympic athletics, a 1500m runner does what's necessary to advance through the heats (as opposed to giving 100% in every race).

           

          I totally agree and I like the comparison with the Olympic heats. You can't run all-out every time, and you can't run all-out on a Thursday and expect to perform your best 2 days later at an important invitational. The guys decided to save themselves for the big invitational. And if finishing like that didn't impede anyone else (which it didn't, if the next finisher was almost 2 minutes behind), then I don't really get it.

           

          I can see where the other team might have found that kind of mass finish by your guys somewhat obnoxious, as it could be interpreted as "we're too good for this and don't take it seriously", but come on - they would have all finished as the top 7 even if they'd run separately, and still all run way below their potential.

           

          Would this be an issue in any other sport? I mean, sometimes you have a really good soccer team vs. a not so good soccer team, and in that case it's considered unsportsmanlike for the better team to play its best and end up with a score of 25-0. And yet, since winning is generally everything, I'm not sure anyone would make that big a deal of it (likely only if the winning team were too self-congratulatory or "sore winners" about it.)


          Fat butt on couch

            I hope your parents are involved and push back.

             

            High school teams tend to be over-raced and rarely sharp towards the end of the season.  Your team did what they needed to do in order to win the league meet; nothing wrong with that for reasons already posted.  I see nothing unsportsmanlike in finishing as a group, as long as there was absolutely no possibility that this would impede another runner.

             

            What, exactly, was ruled unsportsmanlike?

             

            Running answers to the clock.  Would the other team have felt better if your team ran harder and blew them away even more?  I just don't get it.  As someone who ran everywhere from the very back to the very front of races in high school, getting beaten should just be motivation to try harder.  If I was angry that I got beaten by a lot I just went out and trained more.  I never thought to blame the other team for being faster.

            "If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does.  There's your pep talk for today.  Go Run." -- Slo_Hand

             

              and Now we have to write an essay about it and they are considering of not letting us run this week. 

              So in your opinion, do you think this is fair?

               

              This essay writes itself. I'd go with something like:

               

              "Dear Mr. Vernon,

               

              We accept the fact that we had to sacrifice a whole Saturday in detention for whatever it was we did wrong..."

              Come all you no-hopers, you jokers and rogues
              We're on the road to nowhere, let's find out where it goes

                Every year in HS, we would have 1 dual meet against a team that usually only had 5 runners, and just couldn't run with us.  Coach would sit the top 7 and the 8-14 guys would still sweep the meet running easily.  Does your coach know about this discipline?  Anyone who knows anything about good XC training knows you need to pick your days to race hard.

                 

                Like Spaniel said, this is one time when I think the parents should push back at the school

                In Soviet Russia, Burger eats you!

                 

                  I just want to know what high school has a varsity team on which multiple guys are looking to break 15!

                    The OP never said there was a "ruling" or a "disqualification".

                    The OP never said the other team complained.

                     

                    It might have been a 'showmanship' type of situation internally with the school (coaches) where they perceived the act in a manner that could be perceived as unsportsmanlike.

                     

                    Remember, there's probably more to the story than we're reading.  The vantage point of the author (OP) is within the wall running alongside 6 of his buddies.  When the camera lense was looking at the wall of 7 and how and when it formed,  the perspective might have been different (ie. cocky kids not properly representing the school).

                     

                    With that being said, (realizing I know as little about this as the other posters), I hope that it goes as a lesson learned and everything gets worked out in the next couple of days.

                    Cheers,

                    2014 Goals:

                    #1: Do what I can do. <DOING>

                    #2: 365 Hours training

                     

                      I think some school officials have no idea about the sports teams and yet they play too big of a role in it.  The majority of which are probably not sports followers and maybe never even played in sports in their lives.

                      In my senior year of high school I had to go to some school board meeting so I could FIGHT to get on the school tennis team.  They said I could not play with the team.  Reason : Even though you are young enough to play on the team and have above a B+ GPA, "We think it is inappropriate that you are living on your own and paying your own rent."  My father had died two years before this and I moved out on my own. I was 18 and still eligible to play.  I was the best player that WOULD have been on the team and my coach even got me a tennis scholarship to WVU because she knew I had the skills. Anyways, I have tons of resentment towards these "people who cared about my well being so much".  This of course was backwoods west virginia but I think the theme is that people are mucking around with people's lives when they truly have no business getting involved in them.

                      Your XC meet should have been a victory for you and the team and instead the school turned it in to some kind of lame penalty. I say F them in a really big way.  I am biased of course based on my past story but I think I speak for most of the people on here as well.

                        5k  = 19.48 10/1/13

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                      Operation Jack Marathon 12/26/12  4:39.11

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                      GC100k


                        But you weren't DQed, right?  Maybe just write the silly essay, kiss butt, and live to run this week.  btw, how'd Saturday go?

                         

                        I've heard of XC teams DQed because a girl wore the wrong color bra under her uniform (not kidding, google it if you don't believe me) and other silly things.  In track and football, teams have lost championships because someone pointed to the sky.

                         

                        It's frustrating for coaches and, especially, parents to see their teams humiliated, and blatant unsportsmanlike behavior should be punished, but sometimes you just need to suck it up when your kids lose and the other team is celebrating.  Let the kids have their fun.  These kids were probably laughing and smiling and making it look easy, which made the other parents get their underwear in a bundle and complain to their coach, who in turn talked to Lotuse's coach or admin, who then said they'd talk to the kids and punish them somehow.  That'd be my guess.


                        Muddling through

                          Of course it's not fair and it's unlikely you will win a battle of wills with the administration. The essay content is probably the best way to counter their actions. Write a well reasoned essay on training and peaking, on team solidarity, on not embarrassing the other team with a blowout (maybe compare it to a 50-30 basketball score instead of running up the score to 100-30).

                          2014 Goals: Run first trail ultra, first 100K, and see what I can do in a 24-Hour race

                            As a former coach and current administrator, this is crap on the school's part.

                             

                            I would have the parents go complain. Most administrators will give in as many dont like conflict of any kind. If every kid's parent goes up for a 30- 45 min meeting it will kill a day of the administrator's and he/she will give in.

                             

                            Maybe write the essay about saving your legs, not over training, being part of a team, etc.

                             

                            I wonder what the coach thinks about this. The coach should be ticked off too.

                             

                            Good luck. Let us know how this turns out.

                            ”Failing to prepare is preparing to fail.”

                            “Whether you think you can, or you think you can't--you're right.”

                             

                            Tomas

                              I would take it like a man, write my essay, and move on.

                              Runners run.

                                Also, this:

                                 

                                I just want to know what high school has a varsity team on which multiple guys are looking to break 15!

                                Runners run.