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Beginner’s Knee Pain Woes (Read 48 times)

DireWolf75


    Hello everyone! New to the group. This is my first post. I’m a 45-yr-old male, 6’1”, 280lbs. Never been a very active person and recently decided to change that. Had meniscus repair surgery in my right knee about six years ago.

    Bought some New Balance 840v4 and decided to start walking through my neighborhood for 30-45min a few times a week. Did that for about two weeks with no issues. Then I decided to start a Couch to 5K plan and fell in love with it after week 1. Week 2 comes in and I’ve developed some knee pain in the same knee I had surgery on six years back. Feels like it’s in the front of my knee and occasionally just below the knee cap. I know knee pain is common and I also know that I’m an overweight beginner in my 40s but should I be overly concerned? I’ve rested for the past five days and started doing some basic strength exercises for my knees at home. All I could get from someone at a running store was that I could benefit from shoes with a lot more shock absorption and that I should continue trying to strengthen my knees. The fact that I had a meniscus repair six years ago is what concerns me. It sucks to fall in love with something and right at the beginning you suddenly feel to scared to continue.

    Thoughts?? Any help/advice would be greatly appreciated!!
    (cross-posted in one other group)

    CanadianMeg


    Kicking Asphalt for 2021

      Did you do any PT after your knee surgery? You could try touching base with your PT.

       

      Start walking again and if you can walk without knee pain, try week one again. Make sure you are taking it easy; think running at a pace that is still easy to talk. Run on grass or dirt if possible. It will be easier on your knee; grass/dirt are better than pavement, pavement is better than concrete sidewalks. Sidewalks are awful.

      Half Fanatic #9292. 

      DireWolf75


        I didn’t do PT. They basically gave me diagrams of exercises on a sheet of paper. I did those for several weeks afterwards but that’s it.

        I’ve been doing loads of exercises from YouTube that are meant to strengthen the muscles around the knees. I haven’t done any real exercise since well before that surgery so it’s not surprising that I’m having a bit of pain. I’m also really considering getting different shoes, too. The ones that were recommended felt AMAZING but I didn’t end up buying them. I think I may get them.

        Walking for a bit and waiting to try week one again is a really good idea. I may try to do that before week’s end.

        Thank you so much for the advice!!


        an amazing likeness

          My 2 cents are...

           

          First of all, don't ignore the message in the pain; running does not mean knee pain is just part of the game and affects all or most runners. The pain is telling you something isn't ready for the workload you're requesting from your body's current condition.

           

          Second, the 'cushioned' shoe designs have really changed a lot recently and they do help lessen impact loads. Since you like your NB 840 shoes, try out something like the NB 1040, or another brand.

           

          Third, shoes aren't likely to the only solution, or even the major part of helping. You may need additional support from knee bracing to stabilize. I'm reading into your message that your meniscus surgery was probably to treat a tear -- and that type of repair can alter the alignment of the knee.

           

          From your description, I'm guessing (**warning klaxon**), that you're having pain in the tendon in the front of your knee caused by how hard it is getting loaded and you could easily end up with some really painful tendonitis if you don't use some caution. (which you've already done by taking some time off)

           

          I think you've moved too quickly from walking to running. Two weeks walking isn't much of a buildup time. I'd advise adding a new brace (example of one I use) and use some more time walking (briskly) to build some base before restarting the C25K.

           

          And...if things don't improve quickly, seek professional diagnosis and treatment over advise from internet strangers.

          Acceptable at a dance, invaluable in a shipwreck.

            Gait may be a contributing factor.

            I tore my medial meniscus last Summer and couldn't run for a while, and after starts and stops I got back to the point where I could do 10+ mile runs without much issue, but STILL have a clicking/popping like knuckles cracking really loud for the first mile or two. If it's really crunchy right from the start, there IS a bit of pain, but I found that if I alter my gait a little there's a lot less snap crackle pop.

             

            I shorten my stride, which makes me land more toward the front of my foot, on the ball or "forefoot strike". I also partially "sit", lowering my hips just a fraction so that my knees are always at least a little bent. I found that hyperextending my knee backwards even a tiny bit, or landing on a "locked" knee, causes acute pain and makes continuing pain on that run much more likely. This is not a natural or comfortable gait for me, but after 10-15 minutes I guess I'm warmed up enough that my knee isn't perturbed and I can stop concentrating on my gait and just run.

             

            I know it's in the back of your mind, but I'll go ahead and say it; weight is also a contributing factor. Once you shed a few pounds things will be easier and hurt less. I'm always saying I need to lose some pounds so I get injured less and I can run faster, but I never make a concerted effort. M58, 5'10, 177lbs. My "race weight" in college was 163, I'm a bit of a mesomorph with a barrel chest.

             

            As for shoes, I also prefer a really cushy shoe. Sadly, recent studies show that overall impact to the body and joints actually INCREASES with heavily cushioned shoes, because there's no initial jarring causing your body to correct itself.

            https://therunexperience.com/your-super-cushioned-shoes-are-killing-you/

             

            Try walk/jogging a mile or two in some "minimalist" shoes, even the $10 water shoes at Walmart are more than adequate, all they need to do is protect your feet from glass and sharp stones...

            Athletic Works - Athletic Works Men's Water Shoe - Walmart.com - Walmart.com

             

            I still wear "max" cushion shoes for long and recovery runs; Skechers MaxRoad4. But, I also try to get in a few miles every other week in "minimalist" shoes, some older New Balance MR1 Minimus, which are close to running barefoot, but with some protection. I run TOTALLY different in these, cuz I have to to avoid getting hurt, and I'm sure it helps. Other shoes in my current rotation (you really shouldn't wear the same kind of shoes for two runs in a row, and especially don't have just one pair of running shoes for ALL your runs) for junk miles, tempo runs, speedwork, and "racing", whatever that is: Hoka Clifton-7, NB Rebel-1 and Prism, Skechers GoRun-7, Hoka Napali ATR and Stinson ATR for trails, Skechers GoMeb Speed 5 and 6 for time trials, and Nike Victory-3 and Victory XC-3 spikes for the track (I like the XC spikes more, because they have cushioning and support).

            55-59 age group  -  University of Oregon alumni  -  Irreverent and Annoying

              I am 6 foot 215 and run with no pain.

              i run mostly on grass or dirt.

              i am 60 and have been a heel striker my whole life

              Daniel Veitch


                spam

                  I am 6 foot 215 and run with no pain.

                  i run mostly on grass or dirt.

                  i am 60 and have been a heel striker my whole life

                   

                  I've observed that my various injuries (achilles, meniscus, gluteus medius, etc) don't flare up when I run on trails, too. Maybe the imperfections of the surface cause the stabilizing muscles to kick in, holding stuff in place!

                  55-59 age group  -  University of Oregon alumni  -  Irreverent and Annoying

                  zebano


                    Other people have covered a lot but I'll add that I had some knee pain when I started running and doing heavy squats in the gym made it go away. I try to run off-road 2-4 times per week with varying levels of success but that seems to keep my joints happier (mostly my hips, not my knees)

                     

                    That said, given you've had surgery on the knee, at least chatting with a doctor or physical therapist is a good idea.

                    1600 - 5:23 (2018), 5k - 19:33 (2018), 10k - 45:24 (2017), half - 1:38:57 (2018), Mary - 3:37:17 (2018)

                    rmcj001


                      I had meniscectomy and microfracture surgery in 1998. Didn't run for the next 12 years.  Started again in 2010, but running in Five-Finger shoes.  The hypothesis is that it reminds you to land softly on your forefoot, shifting the forces from knees and hips to foot, ankle and calves. I can definitely attest to this. My initial goal was just to run 5K races, but after a year I started doing 10Ks and then 1/2 marathons. In 2013 I ran my first marathon in 18 years and have averaged 2000 mi/year since.  I can honestly say that if I was still heel striking in conventional shoes, I wouldn't be running.  My knees are still bad, but I can tell you it hurts more to walk then to run.  So, from my perspective running with a barefoot technique is much easier on the knees, but it takes time to develop the foot, ankle and calf strength.  Most people suffer from Too much too soon syndrome (including me) and don't take the time to build up slowly enough.  For me, the effort has been worth it YMMV...

                       

                      Microfracture surgery involves breaking the bone, causing it to bleed, to promote cartilage growth.  The way they "break" the bone is essentially by hammering a nail into the bone.


                      Ray

                       

                      DireWolf75


                        I really appreciate all the advice from everyone. Really. Thank you. I was recommended a great pair of shoes, tried them on, and finally pulled the trigger and bought them today. Two hours later I was meeting with my doctor and he told me there was no way someone at my age and weight should be jogging. Period. This was hard to take. I’ve really fallen in love with it and I’ve lost 14 lbs since May. I told him that I am going to jog but for now I’m going to back off for a bit, continue to walk daily, and focus on strengthening my knees before I ease back into it.

                        DireWolf75


                          Correction: I’ve lost 14lbs since MARCH….not May.

                            You've got a good plan!

                             

                            No shame in walking during a run, especially if it's in an interesting place. Or even speed-walking, if that's better on your knees while you melt away the pounds. My brother crept up to about 280lbs in his late 40's, decided he didn't like it, and did mild exercise and mild diet alteration for a while until he was about 215. Then he started running more, and then even more, and did a bunch of local 10k and half marathons in his 50's. Not super fast, but middle of the pack. He's about 65, a couple years ago we ran down to Phantom Ranch in Grand Canyon together and jog/walked back up. Especially walked that last couple miles on Bright Angel.

                             

                            Moral of the story: Easy does it. There's no rush, things will happen at their own pace.

                            55-59 age group  -  University of Oregon alumni  -  Irreverent and Annoying

                            Daniel Veitch


                              spam
                              arunnerd


                              Roads Scholar

                                I really appreciate all the advice from everyone. Really. Thank you. I was recommended a great pair of shoes, tried them on, and finally pulled the trigger and bought them today. Two hours later I was meeting with my doctor and he told me there was no way someone at my age and weight should be jogging. Period. This was hard to take. I’ve really fallen in love with it and I’ve lost 14 lbs since May. I told him that I am going to jog but for now I’m going to back off for a bit, continue to walk daily, and focus on strengthening my knees before I ease back into it.

                                 

                                My experience would mimic Surly Bill's brother.  In my mid-40s, at about 285 I started exercising daily.  Once I got down to about 215 I moved from the stationary bike to run/walking and from there slowly to running.  Then lots more running with great stories to tell, but I digress.

                                 

                                Your age is absolutely not a problem.  The weight maybe, especially given your knee issues.

                                 

                                I wholeheartedly agree with the easy-does-it maxim.  Easy-does-it, very easy at first even.  Just keep going.  You are doing great.

                                I'm not slow for my age, I'm just too young for my pace.

                                 

                                I strive towards laconic wit, my wife says I'm halfway there.

                                 

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