2021 Sub 3:00 Marathon Thread (Read 389 times)

JMac11


Milkman

    JHud yes I was referencing the tempo. Certainly sounds like you're in much better shape than your recent 5K. Sub 18:45 should be easy with potential sub 18:30.

    5K: 16:37 (11/20)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:15:28 (3/20)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19) 

     

    Next Race: Suffolk County Half (10/24)

    jhudak55


      JHud yes I was referencing the tempo. Certainly sounds like you're in much better shape than your recent 5K. Sub 18:45 should be easy with potential sub 18:30.

      We’ll find out this weekend. Weather looks really good for Saturday, sub 19 would be really big for me. 

      Good luck in the 5 miler!

      JTReeves


        We’ll find out this weekend. Weather looks really good for Saturday, sub 19 would be really big for me. 

        Good luck in the 5 miler!

         

        I noticed that too; weather is looking great for Saturday morning! Dew point of 49!! We haven't had it that low in months. Good morning for a race. Good luck jhudak!  JMac, Sunday morning looks pretty good as well, good luck to you.

        2:52:16 (2018)

        JMac11


        Milkman

          Saturday is the unicorn day of summer days. That's almost an October morning! I couldn't believe the forecast when I saw it. Obviously wish I was racing Saturday, but I can't complain about Sunday. Plus, this is a tune-up race (and my goal is to win free beer, not run a great time) so the weather impacts everyone equally . I'm getting a little nervous with how my recent times do not line up with where I was last time I ran CIM, but maybe this weekend will give me a good shot to really race.

           

          Sub 29:00 for a 5M/8K race seems about right at this point still in quasi-summer conditions.

           

          Also just finished Out of Thin Air today. Short read and highly recommend others read it (thanks JT!) 

          5K: 16:37 (11/20)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:15:28 (3/20)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19) 

           

          Next Race: Suffolk County Half (10/24)

          OMR


            jhudak:  Hope your race went well!  Jmac, good luck tomorrow!  JT, yikes on that last hill!  Looking forward to a report!

             

            Interesting discussion on the 1:30 thread about sweating and leg length ratio.  I don't have time to post in both, so I lurk in the 1:30 even though it's probably more related to my current HM training.  Anyhow, like Jmac, I sweat a ton when it's humid, and can easily lose 5 pounds in about 90-100 minutes.  As for leg length, my ratio is about 0.62 (45" to iliac crest, 72.5" total height).  My week...

             

            S:  3.3M @ 9:25 Trail Recovery Run

            M:  7.6M @ 7:54 w/10 x 1min @ 5K+ effort

            T:  5.9M @ 8:27

            W:  Rest

            T:  14.1M @ 7:40 w/2 x 3M @ HM effort (6:58 & 6:53)

            F:  6.75M @ 8:53 Trail Run

            S:  11.45M @ 7:51 w/10min Progression

             

            Total:  49.15M

            flavio1980


            Intl. correspondent

              JHud - awesome job at the 5k 💪

               

              OMR - coach got me a cut back week Smile

              So you just knocked me of the top spot as king of the legs 😂

               

              me - nice cut back week.  I finally got a few good nights of sleep without waking up with weird pains or restless legs in the middle of the night.

              Weekly for period: From: 07/26/2021 To 08/01/2021

              Date Name mi km Duration Avg/mi Avg/km Elevation Gain
              in ft
              07/27 Morning Run 8.00 12.88 01:06:40 08:20 05:11 384
              07/28 7mi + 4 strides 7.15 11.51 00:58:32 08:11 05:05 141
              07/29 IMIMI - alternating miles at 10k pace with miles at MP 9.00 14.49 01:05:11 07:15 04:30 95
              07/30 Morning Run 8.01 12.88 01:05:34 08:11 05:05 164
              07/31 7mi + 5 downhill strides 7.25 11.66 01:01:08 08:26 05:15 197
              08/01 Foggy long run 17.01 27.37 02:13:53 07:52 04:53 131

              Total distance: 56.43mi

              PRs: 1500 4:51 2019 - 5K 17:56 2021 HM 1:21:59 2021

              Up next: Rest and recover

              Tool to generate Strava weekly

              JTReeves


                OMR: Nice week. I liked the 2x3 mi workout you did; I'd like to do that one and have planned to do it before but usually wimp out and do 3x2 mi instead.

                 

                Flavio: Glad to hear the cutback week worked like it's supposed to! I read today that Hassan will go for the triple... should be interesting. I think she'll have the toughest time in the 1500. Tomorrow will be the toughest day: 1500 heats in the morning, 5000 final in the evening.

                 

                My week: I decided to run an 8 mile race yesterday in my hometown. It also has a 5k, which I did a couple of times several years ago, but I've never run the 8 mile till now. I knew it was a very hilly course, with the infamous Canterbury hill towards the end (it goes through the campus of the Canterbury school, a private boarding school with the claim to fame that JFK went there). I normally avoid hilly race courses at all costs but wanted to do this a) to get in a good hard workout and b) for the social aspect, to catch up with some local runners. Check on both of those; it was definitely a good hard run and I was able to talk with several runners I haven't seen since pre-covid. I ran the race Darkwave-style, not looking at my watch. The splits ended up being all over the place, due to the hills. The 5k and 8 mile started together, and the first mile is largely downhill and though it felt controlled it was just under 6 min. The 5k runners turned off at about 1.5 miles, and around that point the 8 mile runners began the first big set of uphills, which lasted till just past 3 miles. Just before 3 miles I could have turned off the course and gone home (it was tempting ) as the course goes right past my neighborhood. The 4th and 5th miles were largely downhill. Looking back, I was a bit lazy in that 4th mile (6:40), maybe still recovering from the big uphill in the 3rd mile. Mile 5 was quicker at 6:02. Mile 6 was a mix of up and downhill, and at 6.5 miles, we turned on to Canterbury road and began a ~0.5 mile steady climb. That was brutal. The hill peaked at about the 7 mile mark, right in the middle of the school campus, and then it was all downhill to the finish. Mile 7 was a 7:48, and the last 0.83 was at 5:39 pace (what a difference gravity makes!). The course is not a full 8 miles but they apparently just round up in the name. Ended up in 20th place, 2nd in the 40-49 AG. My son ran the 5k (3rd place overall) and my wife ran/walked the 5k. My son and I were able to just run home for a nice cooldown after the race.

                Weekly for period: From: 07/26/2021 To 08/01/2021

                Date Name mi km Duration Avg/mi Avg/km Elevation Gain
                in ft
                07/27 Morning Run 12.28 19.76 1:39:27 8:06 5:02 771
                07/28 Morning Run w/ 10x2 min on/2 min off 13.17 21.19 1:42:08 7:45 4:49 850
                07/29 Morning Run 8.12 13.06 1:09:39 8:35 5:20 446
                07/30 Morning Run 10.03 16.15 1:26:11 8:36 5:20 554
                07/31 Warmup 1.15 1.85 9:24 8:10 5:05 59
                07/31 New Milford Road Race 7.84 12.61 51:10 6:32 4:03 682
                07/31 Cooldown back home with Matthew 3.33 5.36 29:47 8:57 5:33 312
                08/01 Long Run 16.12 25.94 2:12:38 8:14 5:07 912

                Total distance: 72.04 mi

                2:52:16 (2018)

                jhudak55


                  OMR: I also sweat a lot in the hot/humid conditions. I recently started making a homemade hydration mix that seems to be helping this summer. Its a mix of Gatorade powder with Himalayan pink salt and magnesium and potassium powders. 

                  JT: Nice week. That hill at the end of a race is rough. I’ll admit that I do my best to avoid hilly races and specifically seek out flat ones. 

                  Flavio: Thanks! I’m looking forward to a cutback week myself, but I have one more week building mileage. 

                  My week:

                  66.4 miles

                  M: 7.9 miles with 6 x 3 minute hills

                  T: 11 miles aerobic (8:19)

                  W: 14 mile MLR (8:23)

                  T: 6 miles easy (9:13)

                  F: 3 miles recovery (9:33)

                  S: 3.3 miles of warmup/cool down and parkrun 5k in 18:51

                  S: 18 mile long run (7:55)

                   

                  Front loaded my week so I could have a mini taper for a 5k on Saturday. Monday I did a 6 by three minute hills workout and made the exact same mistake that I had made two weeks earlier by running the first two in 2:40 and 2:50. This time I was able to have a consistent last four reps by monitoring my pace closely. Wednesday was a 14 mile medium long run.

                   

                  Decided to run a parkrun 5k for the first time on Saturday. There are a few parkruns a bit closer to me but I opted to drive about 40 minutes for a paved, flat, single out and back course. I chatted with a couple others before the race and found a runner who was shooting for 18:30 and decided to go out with him and see if I could hang on. After a few announcements the race started. I was running at the back of a group of three for the first mile. My legs felt really good, but my breathing felt labored near then end of the first mile. When I got the one mile split, I found out why. We had gone out in 5:42, 15-20 seconds faster than I would have liked. As expected, I fell off quite a bit in the second and third miles. The effort felt close to 6 flat, however I had wasted too much energy in the first mile and ran 6:12, 6:18 for miles two and three. I was able to kick a bit at the end and finish the last 0.1 in 37 seconds (5:47). Final time was 18:51 which is good for an 18 second PR over my TT from three weeks ago. I’m really happy with the race, but I feel like I left some time on the table had I ran even splits. Oh well, I have another 5k on the schedule in another three weeks.

                  darkwave


                  Mother of Cats

                    JTReeves  - just looked on Strava - that course looks ridiculous in terms of hills.

                     

                    I'm curious - what did you think about racing by feel - did you think it helped you  or hurt you in this one?

                     

                    OMR - that ratio definitely puts you at the extreme of our RunningAhead crew, I think.  Nice week!

                     

                    Flavio - glad you got some sleep!

                     

                    My week:

                     

                    60 miles running, 3 hours pool-running, and 1500 yards swimming.
                    M: 12 miles, including a track workout of 2x1200, 2x800, 2x400, 2x200m. Splits were 4:57, 4:51, 3:10, 3:08, 92, 90, 43, 43. 3:00 recoveries after the 1200s and 800s; 90 second recoveries after the 400s and 200s.. Followed with leg strengthwork and 500 yards recovery swimming.
                    T: 3 miles easy outside (9:30), supervised workout, then 9 miles very easy on treadmill (9:36) followed by streaming yoga.
                    W: 2 hours pool-running and upper body weights/core.
                    Th: 11 miles including a tempo workout of 2 miles, 1 mile in 14:05 (7:12/6:53) and then 6:51, with 5 minutes jog in between. Followed with 4x30 seconds at mile effort with 60 seconds recovery. Then did leg strengthwork and 500 yards recovery swimming.
                    Fr: 2 miles easy (10:00), drills, supervised workout, then 8 miles easy on treadmill (9:38) followed by streaming yoga.
                    Sa: 14.5 miles progressive, split as first 5 averaging 9:49, next 4.5 miles averaging 8:20, next 5 miles averaging 7:20 (uphill on way out; downhill on way back), and then a cooldown jog to make 15 miles. Followed with leg strengthwork and 500 yards recovery swimming.
                    Su: Streaming yoga and 1 hour pool-running.

                     

                    My coach is on vacation this week, so I subbed in for him on the team Tuesday/Friday track workouts (this means that I 1) make decisions on how to modify the workout for the weather; 2) get everybody started on time; 3) time the workout and announce splits; and 4) pull anyone if they look off.)  So I ended up shifting my own workouts to Monday and Thursday.

                     

                    On Monday, I had an interesting encounter with a woman who was walking in lane 1 clockwise.  I thought she just didn't know track etiquette, so I approached her, nicely, to explain that it would work better for all if she was in one of the outside lanes, or at a minimum walked counterclockwise.

                     

                    She was insistent that walkers were supposed to use the inside lane, going clockwise.  (She finally left after some discussion).

                     

                    What's really crazy is that a friend then told me that she had the same experience at her local track, several hundred miles away.  Walker going clockwise in lane 1, and insisting that such was the correct use of the track.

                     

                    There has to be a website somewhere telling people to do this.

                    Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

                     

                    And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

                    darkwave


                    Mother of Cats

                      JHudak- Congratulations!  And I agree that you have more in the tank and a faster race in you, especially as we get into the fall.

                      Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

                       

                      And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

                      CalBears


                        OMR - nice week! I am planning on 2x3 this Tuesday - you will be my reference point now - comparing one old dude to another Smile

                         

                        flavio - your down week looks like my "up" week Smile Too fast for "down" Smile

                         

                        JTR - wow - you are at 70 mpw already! With races. Great uptrend. Good job on the hilly race. It must be nice to feel that racing feeling again!

                         

                        jhudak - congrats on beating 19 minutes like you wanted! Now get on that sub 18:30 wagon! Yeah, I find it difficult to run 5K wisely too - always some mile is too fast and then you pay the price the rest of the way. But with more 5K racing will come the experience.

                         

                        DW - nice week substitute coach darkwave Smile

                         

                        My week was ok. Found there is a race, half marathon, on Jul 31st and decided to start the racing season. The price was too steep to my liking ($96) but I ran this course back in 2012, just when we moved to CA and my time was 1:31:04. So, I guess, because of nostalgia and to start a racing season, I signed up. What I totally forgot though is that more than 2/3 of the course is a gravel. That was pretty bad - I didn't expect that and felt a little bit out of control most of the race (except when it was on a pavement). As I just read above, I also used DW's approach and not once during the race looked at my pace (actually, my pace was not displayed on the watch), but what I was constantly checking is HR - my goal was 165 bpm for the first half of the race and 170 bpm - for the second (as I was expecting to get tired). I was running per plan first two miles (while on the pavement) but then the gravel started after mile 2 and my HR started to creep to 170 and I just decided that 170 will be fine for these conditions. Honestly, the running felt more like skating - I am not kidding (though all the runners were in the same boat). In addition, my Stryd sensor (which I used for distance and pace) was screwing up too, reporting miles much earlier than real mile markers. Yeah, I am pretty sure I would run 30-60 seconds faster on a pavement, than on this gravel course. In any case, it was awesome to feel that racing feeling again. Plenty of runners. Finished 13th overall, 1st AG - 1:29:56. A little bit slower than I expected, but I didn't feel exhausted at the end and probably would be able to run few more miles at that pace - all out was never been a goal for this HM. Another plus - Mikkey checked my Strava and gave me a Kudos and even left some unemotional comment Smile

                        Was going to run today but then decided against of it - legs felt a little bit heavy, so I thought one more days of rest should be good.

                         

                        Mo - off

                        Tu - 9.83 @7:17 (3x2 miles 5:54, 6:16, 6:34 - last two laps were ran by HR - 165 bpm, the first one was all out)

                        We - 10.23 @7:35

                        Th - 6.62 @7:50

                        Fr - 6.66 @8:53

                        Sa - HM race 13.2 @6:52 - 1:29:56 total 13th overall 1st AG

                        Su - off

                        ===

                        Total: 47.8 miles

                        paces PRs - 5K - 5:48  /  10K - 6:05  /  HM - 6:14  /  FM - 6:26 per mile


                        Elite Jogger

                          Mikkey checked my Strava and gave me a Kudos and even left some unemotional comment Smile

                           

                          I gave you a golf clap which is actually very respectful. I am a gentleman.

                          5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)

                          JTReeves


                             

                            I'm curious - what did you think about racing by feel - did you think it helped you  or hurt you in this one?

                             

                            Darkwave: I think it was ideal for this particular race; I was more treating this as a hard workout, and didn't have a time goal so making sure I was at X pace at mile X was not important. And it also prevented me from pushing too hard on the uphills to maintain a given pace. I'm honestly not sure I could resist looking at my watch for a target marathon; I haven't reached that level of running self-awareness yet. But I may give it a shot in my tune-up half in September.

                             

                            Very strange about the woman insisting on walking in lane 1. There is a regular, year-round super early morning clockwise walker at the track I use, but she is always out in lane 4 or 5. Fortunately I've never had issues with walkers, in any direction, staying in lane 1. But perhaps this is a new trend; I haven't been to the track in a while...

                             

                            jhudak: Congrats on the new PR! I agree that you can likely cut more time next race with a bit more even pacing. Nice long run today.

                             

                            Cal: Nice job on the half. I remember some gravel parts in the Harrisburg marathon, they were pretty tricky and I almost wiped out once. Can't imagine 2/3 of the race like that! On all pavement you'd definitely be faster. Seems like the new training is working well for you.

                            2:52:16 (2018)

                            CalBears


                               

                              Seems like the new training is working well for you.

                               

                              Ha-ha JTR - I hope you do not think that a slight change of training structure just two weeks ago can make any serious impact Smile

                              paces PRs - 5K - 5:48  /  10K - 6:05  /  HM - 6:14  /  FM - 6:26 per mile

                              JTReeves


                                 

                                Ha-ha JTR - I hope you do not think that a slight change of training structure just two weeks ago can make any serious impact Smile

                                 

                                No, more like I think it's not exhausting you yet! Doing elevated HR training like you are, that would be my biggest concern. Though I guess you had pretty low mileage the last two weeks. Let's see how you feel when the mileage goes up...

                                2:52:16 (2018)