2011 Goal of Sub 20 5k (Read 4848 times)

     

    Name them.

     

    Also, I am in for the sub-20 5k.  My focus has always been on endurance, but I need to get my workouts in to become an all-around better runner.  My biggest worry about being able to go sub-20 is just the lack of 5k's in Chicago that I have any interest in doing.  They are all set up to benefit charities, so they cost $30, and the ones near me jam everyone on a very narrow lakefront path.  Nothing about racing in Chicago seems to resemble what everyone else talks about here.  There are no small running clubs, no $6 races/popsicle stick races/races for racers, no masters track nights, and no races outside the same old general distances (mile, 20k?  ha!)  They use the excuse that people want the t-shirt, medals, and all the post race food.  I disagree.  Racers want to race.  I can do a marathon for the cost of two 5k's.  Why should I waste all my money racing around here?  I am doing a 5k on April 3rd.  It is a race that I actually like.  We will see how many other good ones I can find.

     

    Unfortunately it is the city itself that is the problem.  You'll never get streets closed for a small race and you can't run an event on the streets without them.  So you are stuck on the lakefront unless the race is short enough to run around a playground.  Then you need approval from the city, park district, and police.  You need separate permits for food, tents, bathrooms, etc... If you say no food or extra bathrooms your permit will be rejected by one of the many layers of approval.  Basically you can't run a cheap race in the city.  I have done some races out in the sticks for $15, no t-shirt, free food and BEER but then you've got a long drive.

    Son, when you participate in sporting events, it's not whether you win or lose; it's how drunk you get. -- Homer Simpson

       

      Unfortunately it is the city itself that is the problem.  You'll never get streets closed for a small race and you can't run an event on the streets without them.  So you are stuck on the lakefront unless the race is short enough to run around a playground.  Then you need approval from the city, park district, and police.  You need separate permits for food, tents, bathrooms, etc... If you say no food or extra bathrooms your permit will be rejected by one of the many layers of approval.  Basically you can't run a cheap race in the city.  I have done some races out in the sticks for $15, no t-shirt, free food and BEER but then you've got a long drive.

       

      Who needs to close a street? I'm just north of Boston and, off the top of my head, can think of over a half dozen series races that go on over the course of the year with no street closures involved. Costs usually range from free to a couple bucks.

      JimR


        Hey Jim, why so secretive these days?

         

         

        If I told you that, it wouldn't be a secret anymore...

        RootieKazootie


          L Train wrote: My 5K went from 21ish to 19:12 last year from doing marathon training.

           

          Nice 1. Makes me want to stop everything and do marathon training. Not planning a marathon just yet tho.

           

           

          xhristopher wrote: I think we are missing some info here, like what RootieKazootie's current 5K is.

           

          i haven't done one for 3 or 4 months, but it was 20:53. At the time i was doing 6x1miles @ 6:50 off 1 min rests, so i really feel i could go faster now i'm at 8x1miles (i continue to 10 miles by ending with 2 at 8:00mins)

           

           

          MoBramExam, Thanks a lot for the Intervals link.

           

           

          Nobby415 wrote: I am seriuosly genuinly curious; where do people get the idea of doing this kind of workouts and training program?  I thought I've kept my eyes on "what's out there"...

           

          I'm doing what works best for me regarding an injury and some niggles i've had. I've got into a nice routine and haven't had any recurrence (already regretting saying that). i run 2 days on, 1 day off: 12mile Long Run, 6-8mile Tempo, 10x1mile Intervals, 6miles easy (10-15mins rest) then a hilly 5-6K. It kind of makes a 6 day week, but it is working well. I'll give it some more time and, all being well, step up to 5 days a week.

           

          I've mostly been doing 8min pace while gradually getting my weekly miles up to 40+.

            I'm doing what works best for me regarding an injury and some niggles i've had. I've got into a nice routine and haven't had any recurrence (already regretting saying that). i run 2 days on, 1 day off: 12mile Long Run, 6-8mile Tempo, 10x1mile Intervals, 6miles easy (10-15mins rest) then a hilly 5-6K. It kind of makes a 6 day week, but it is working well. I'll give it some more time and, all being well, step up to 5 days a week.

             

            I've mostly been doing 8min pace while gradually getting my weekly miles up to 40+.

             

             

            RootieKazootie:

             

            Well, as long as you're happy about and you think it works for you, I have nothing more to say about it.  However, all due respect, I think your training program is what we sometimes term as "no-man 's land" training.  You are training hard.  But you're doing a long run of 5k (or less); and speed training of a marathon runner.  In other words, despite the fact that I'm sure you're training hard, it's most probably not going to get you a good marathon because you're not running far enough; and not going to get you a good 5k because you're not running fast enough.  I did 20:06 for 5 a few years back (granted, I did not break 20) but thte hardest interval I did was either 3 X 1200m or 12 X 400m.  Someone I know did 10 X 1km at his 10k pace (or slightly slower) but it was during his build-up.  Besides, he's a marathon guy with 27:15 10k PR.  In my humble opinion, your interval training is nowhere near what the purpose of intervals are supposed to be.  Again, as long as you're happy about it, that's fine; but if I do a kind of training program that you're doing and if I can't break 18-minutes, I'd be very disappointed.

            RootieKazootie


               

              I presume he's asking why RootieKazootie thinks 10 x 1k or 8 x 1 mile and with short recoveries is optimum 5k training.

               

              Half marathon maybe, but hardly focused on the 5k.

               

              I'm not saying it's optimum 5k, just that the training which those intervals are part of has been injury free, and has helped lower my 5k to HM times. At the moment i'm happy taking these small regular improvements.

               

               

              jeffdonahue said: A few years ago when I first broke the 20 minute barrier (which I have now slipped above again) I had a few workouts that were up to 7x1 mile repeats, but they were being done at 7:10 pace, not 6:50.

               

              That's encouraging, thanks.

               

               

              Nobby415,  I'd be delighted to break 18 mins. Hopefully i've got some years left to get there (age 37) Just started in 2010. My long run is 12 miles not 5k, maybe that was a typo.

               

              Looks like there are quite a few going for sub 20 this year, and some trying to get back into that shape again. My plan is to tuck in and get pulled along with you lot. Good luck all.

               

               

              MrH


                 

                My long run is 12 miles not 5k, maybe that was a typo.

                 

                 

                No, Nobby meant that your long run is appropriate for 5k training, but your interval training is appropriate for longer distances as it lacks the pace that would give the greatest benefit for 5k races.

                The process is the goal.

                Men heap together the mistakes of their lives, and create a monster they call Destiny.

                  Nobby415,  I'd be delighted to break 18 mins. Hopefully i've got some years left to get there (age 37) Just started in 2010. My long run is 12 miles not 5k, maybe that was a typo.

                   

                  RootieKazootie:

                   

                  Actually, what I meant was: I've known many high school kids who are training for 1600m who runs 12 miles on weekend.  Most elite milers would be running 30k (18 miles) and 5000m guys more than that.  I know we're not talking about elite but there's a reason why those guys do those long runs.  Also, they would probably do their intervals somewhere around 5~6k total of fast runs.  You do too much of it and the speed would suffer.  You do short recovery and the same thing.  Some do high volume of intervals but most likely not for speed but for strength.  So you'd have to determine, with your current condition, whether you'll need speed or staying power in order to run a good 5k.  Also, you'll need to understand, depending on what event you're training for, how much of speed and/or staying power you'd need.  Without understanding those, you may train very hard but you're just not getting the optimum benefit.  On the top of that, by doing a long (well, sorta...) run and intervals and tempo run and hills all crammed in a week (I'm assuming); chacnes are, you're probably too tired to race well.  Again, some people get more kick out of knowing that they trained very hard than racing well.  So, the bottom line, whatever turns you on....

                  RootieKazootie


                    Thanks for taking the time to share your thoughts.

                     

                     

                    Training is going well. Can hardly believe i've dragged my body kicking and screaming into as good shape as i've ever been in, through weight training and running. I'm enjoying running a lot more than the weights at the moment, probably because progress has halted since stepping up the running. It's all i can do to maintain what strength i have.

                    I'm sorely tempted to drop the weights to see how it would effect my running. I read somewhere that 1lb lost = 2 seconds off each mile. I know i can shed 20+ lbs if i stop. But it's been hard work to get where i'm at. Can losing 20lbs really take 2mins off a 5K? Seems like a lot. (guess i've always got that in the bank for when my times plateau).

                     

                     

                    Had 2 very encouraging runs on Tue/Wed.....

                     

                    Tue. (Intervals) 10x1miles off 1min rests. The first 9 at 6.51 average, surprisingly comfortable so i sped up for a 6.40 last mile. Could have went on, but trying to be sensible.

                     

                    Wed. (Easy Run) 10 miles. The first 9 at 8.05 average, last mile 6.28. Had just planned 6-8 easy miles, but i couldn't hear a peep out of my legs after the intervals. Again, wanted to carry on but stopped myself. Could maybe have done 1 more at 6.28.

                     

                    Feel ready for a 5K or 10K soon. The numbers are whispering that i'm gonna smash my PB's. But they have been known to lie!

                      I ran a treadmill 5k in 22:31 today knocking 52 seconds off last week's time.

                      Now I have ran 61 miles for the year and at least a mile every day so far.

                      It took about 2 weeks of running to feel in good shape. I am not fast and have no stamina but I know my limits now and can set the treadmill to a given speed and just go for 20 minutes at a time now instead of fidgeting with the speed control knob every few minutes.

                       

                      Next goal will be sub 22.. I will give myself about 3 weeks before I can try that time.

                      I should probably get outside here soon and see what times I can run but I don't have good training shoes and I want to make

                      sure my base miles are up before I hit any pavement.

                       

                      To Rootie...yeah 9 times 1 mile holy smoke.

                      I would probably try to run those around 7:15 or so if I was doing that (and IF I was in 20 minute 5k shape which I am not today).

                      I don't remember seeing any training program calling for that.

                      I liked to try 4 X 1 km in around 4:05 when I was in sub 20 shape with a minute or two rest.( cannot remember the exact rest). 3 miles is going to seem like a short lap to you.

                      I think you can go a bit below 20 when you run your next 5k.

                      Don't worry so much about the weight. I see 250 pounders running close to 20 minutes when they put in tons of miles.

                      I ran sub 20 at 142 pounds. I couldn't lose much more weight than that. I think I may run faster with more weight (muscle).

                        I already know I am there... or was there... But going to put this off until the fall since I can't put in the kind of running I want to right now.

                        Goals: To keep running regardless of what happens.

                          Signed up for a 5K January 30. Not ready for sub 20 attempt. Just want to race to get a good work out and see where I am at.

                           

                          I have been running 10 miles every Sunday. Here's the workout: one mile warmup, 1K in 4 minutes, four minutes easy (getting me to mile 2), another kilometer in 4 minutes, then the remaining 7.4 or so miles easy. Goal is to teach my body to run at 4 minutes per kilometer pace.

                           

                          Later in the week I run three to four miles at marathon pace heart rate. At the beginning of the month that was about 8:30 pace. Last run was 8:10 pace so I think that is a good sign.

                           

                          All other runs have been easy. A couple months ago the platform on my treadmill broke. Instead of paying the $120 replacement fee I was quoted by the manufacturer, I started to run in place on a rebounder my wife use to use. The workout actually feels about the same as working on a treadmill.

                           

                          Can't wait for the snow/ice/darkness to go away so I can switch from base training to speed/strength training.

                          ´╗┐

                          RootieKazootie


                            I ran a treadmill 5k in 22:31 today knocking 52 seconds off last week's time.

                             

                            3 miles is going to seem like a short lap to you.

                            I think you can go a bit below 20 when you run your next 5k.

                             

                            Great progress there Michigan. Just another 3 like that and you're there! (If only it were that simple). I don't think it's ability that could derail your sub 20 comeback, you absolutely smashed it in 2008. It's not like you just scraped under. I think if you bring the same passion and commitment it will happen. After all, you've got the blueprint on how it's done, and if all else fails, there are those hills at Lake Michigan with your name on them.

                             

                            I really hope your prediction is right - i'll be doing intervals over the moon. i kind of do a similar thing as you, i give myself carrots to chase (wait, that's for the hare, what do tortoises chase, lettuce?). Like no faster stuff until i'm at 40 mpw (done) and i'm waiting to see out the month with no injury/niggles before i think about a 5 or 10K. Holding myself back like this really motivates me to do well on the day. I'm itching to go.

                             

                             

                            Hey mainrun. Missed your post on page 1. Another star from the old threads joins the fray.

                              19:51 today by my watch, still waiting for the official time which might be a few seconds different. Still, beats last years best of 20:06. Not sure if it's my all time PB - certainly I could go faster when I was in my 20s, but maybe I never actually did it in a race.

                                congrats pr100!!