Forums >Health and Nutrition>Overtrained?
Hi there. Looking for some opinions of more experienced marathoners out there. I'm three weeks away from my second marathon. Built up gradually to higher volume this time around and have felt great for the most part. Hit my highest volume week including my second 20, and then bonked the following week, both physically and mentally. Spent the week feeling chronically fatigued and just not "in the game" mentally. I believe I possibly over-trained, in terms of not allowing myself as much recovery as I needed in these last few weeks of my buildup. Anyway-- I'm officially in taper now, and wondering if I should stick to my original taper plan, or be even more aggressive with the rest. In short, should my 3 weeks of taper be enough to give life back to these legs? Obviously no way to say for sure, but looking for anyone out there who may have had similar over-training experiences...
I'm not that experienced, but I am in the same place as you (3 weeks of taper) and felt the same way at the beginning of last week. I proclaimed that I wanted to quit. Then proceeded to run my best half marathon to date on Sunday. I'm no expert, but it seems we may be exactly where we need to be.
Please provide the experienced folks with a little more background on your running history. What is your normal volume, what have you run in the last 6 months, your goals, how did that last long run go compared with the previous ones etc, to get additional help beyond what Joann provided.
If you've run in the recent hot weather, its very possible that you pushed yourself into a bit of over trained state, but then maybe that's how you are supposed to feel before tapering. Hopefully it will cool down a bit over the next three weeks and you'll have a great race.
Thanks Joann and Happyfeet. For my first marathon back in late April, my volume maxed out in the low 40s. Ran a 3:34, which was my goal. This time around, built up to 50 very gradually, using the 10% rule and having several scale-back weeks. In general, my runs and long runs have felt very good, including my last 20 which was 9 days ago. My goal for my next race on 10/9 has been to crack 3:30, with a back-up goal of snagging another BQ. My legs have just felt dead, and I have felt far more fatigued this time around. Perhaps I'm just experiencing true training fatigue for the first time. Normally I would be doing 4-5 day weeks; the last 4 weeks of my buildup have been 6x week, and it's the first time I hit 50 mpw. Anyway, hoping 3 taper weeks will help.
Listen to your body. Rest will never hurt you.
runktrun
It's common to feel "blah" during a taper, as the cumulative fatigue finally sets in and your body starts really repairing itself so that you are stronger come race day. Don't over think it and roughly stick to your taper plan. That said...be mindful of aches and pains that feel BAD and fatigue that feels like sickness and cut back if you feel like you are digging yourself into a hole. I always like to run a few marathon pace miles every week of my taper plus striders. You should be able to hit your paces and feel pretty snappy, despite feeling like you have dead legs during the day. 50mpw isn't outlandish, but if you've also increased your run frequency AND added more quality, then it's reasonable to think you're just feeling training fatigue.
Not running for my health, but in spite of it.
Feeling the growl again
Limited information. Hard to say. However….
If you made it through your peak weeks, and did not obviously bonk and utterly fail workouts during the final hard weeks, it is highly unlikely you are truly over-trained. Having painfully been there myself on several occasions, I fully recognize the symptoms and depth of this real phenomenon. Ever workout would make you slower. Rest would not help. It would not just be a feeling, but a result that would show in workout times.
Over-training is not a mental thing whatsoever. It is a real physiological process. It sounds like what you are describing is normal, and not related to over-training.
And, a three week taper should be totally sufficient for anything.
"If you want to be a bad a$s, then do what a bad a$s does. There's your pep talk for today. Go Run." -- Slo_Hand
I am spaniel - Crusher of Treadmills
Listen to your body. Active Rest will never hurt you.
FIFY
Tapering is also hard because you lose that thrill of knocking out awesome weeks. What should be easy runs become unrewarding chores.
Listen to your body. Sometimes, Active Rest will never hurt you and sometimes is a sign of training obsession, which in the end will leave you overtrained, with lowered immunity, and injured. If you can't take 1-7 unplanned days off from running or exercise to get your body right, your mind might not be right. FIFY
Listen to your body. Sometimes, Active Rest will never hurt you and sometimes is a sign of training obsession, which in the end will leave you overtrained, with lowered immunity, and injured. If you can't take 1-7 unplanned days off from running or exercise to get your body right, your mind might not be right.
not bad for mile 25
Trust your training plan.
I think we may have to agree to disagree here. Sitting on your butt is just about the worst thing you can do to your body, and will not help you heal. Get out, walk around, do some light stretching. Keep that blood moving.
I agree that sitting on your butt all the time is not very good, but if you've been training your ass off and your body is exhausted and you're showing signs of OT, then a few unplanned days (or a week) off from exercise altogether will not hurt your body. Body heals and recovers from exhaustion, injury, and OT by being allowed to rest. The mind as well. We can't exclude the mind from the business of training. Forget sitting on the butt, instead lie down on the couch, watch TV, and sleep a lot until you feel better. Reduce as much stress as possible. I've taken unplanned recovery days and even a week during marathon training, and it only helped me to get to the starting line healthy and ready. When I ignored these signals and "pushed through" or "kept going", I paid for it. "Active recovery" is just another way to say "don't ever stop moving", "keep going no matter what", and "never have a day without exercise." The mind needs a break from that sometimes, let alone the body. The mind and body being connected is always something to consider.
I'll agree to disagree, which usually means end of discussion, even though I felt this was very civil and perhaps helpful to the OP as he or she gets to see a few sides--I didn't even get mad that you FIFYied my post. I know I FIFYied your post in return, which might seem like a retaliation, but it was really just me reFIFYing my original post. A good day to you, Mr. Bhearn.
Consistently Slow
Limited information. Hard to say. However…. If you made it through your peak weeks, and did not obviously bonk and utterly fail workouts during the final hard weeks, it is highly unlikely you are truly over-trained. Having painfully been there myself on several occasions, I fully recognize the symptoms and depth of this real phenomenon. Ever workout would make you slower. Rest would not help. It would not just be a feeling, but a result that would show in workout times. Over-training is not a mental thing whatsoever. It is a real physiological process. It sounds like what you are describing is normal, and not related to over-training. And, a three week taper should be totally sufficient for anything.
+1
I over- trained and had to taper to 6-10 miles a week from a high of 50 miles over 16 weeks. The taper lasted 6 weeks. My BQ was -7 minutes.Thanks to Nobby for noticing.
Run until the trail runs out.
SCHEDULE 2016--
The pain that hurts the worse is the imagined pain. One of the most difficult arts of racing is learning to ignore the imagined pain and just live with the present pain (which is always bearable.) - Jeff
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Thank you all for taking time to respond to my inquiry. Appreciate all of the feedback. Happy running to all!