Forums >Racing>2022 Advanced Racing Thread
Fishy I didn't mean it to come off that way. To be more clear, I think all of this applies much more to people who started young, since eventually they can't set lifetime PR's anymore. But as Dave pointed out, some people start later, and so you can keep getting PR's. But what I'm getting at is JMac started young.
I'll mention this maybe again in the new thread intro, but my peak year as of now was 2014, when I was 19. Then I fell from grace for a few years. Then thought fuck, I should get back into competitive running and get back to setting PR's while I still can. And so now here I am, hoping to get back to 2014 speed, and I probably can since I'm 28. Had I waited until say, 40-50, much less likely, I think?
Part of TLC
Maybe that'll stop the lurkers who provide absolutely zero value on a day to day basis but absolutely must comment on the petty squabbles going on.
You called me? If so, the answer is "No, it won't". Because I'm competitive (in my AG on a regional level when training isn't hampered by injury), I'm a jerk (you "knew" that already, right ?), I might be running my first marathon since 1993 in 2023 or 2024, and think I can still learn a thing or two about training for longer races by lurking here.
OTOH, my lurking experience is hampered immensely by posters violating the written or unwritten rules of netiquette. Like Dorothea I've got a European background and I'm all for directness, too. If I want to learn something in a forum like this, I don't need sugarcoating, I need honest opinions. But if you want me to stop delurking from time to time, stop insulting each other (which most of the posters here don't do anyway - all in all you're a nice bunch of knowledgeable people).
Don't hurry - next AG will start 2026
Intl. correspondent
Zebano - I'm feeling like a proud father right now 😂 An açaí bowl is indeed fantastic. And it's funny to think that the açaí fruit originated in the north of Brazil, where they eat it with salty food, like with black beans.
Some people from Rio visited a long time ago and had the idea of making it in the ice cream format that it's so well know today.
Fun fact: the North of Brazil is to us southerner Brazilians as alien and foreign as Vietnam is to a person from Minnesota.
Jmac - I wouldn't take the GPS measurement on a well measured course either. GPS watches are becoming very accurate these days though. My marathon was 26.31 miles. My 3000m PR race which I ran on a track was 3020m.
DK - I remember a couple of German female athletes at the Rio olympics were being interviewed and they had just recently discovered açaí.In their own words "it's better than a boyfriend".
me - Unable to find a feasible/convenient 5K for February, I've settled on a 10K happening in Feb 5th in Coimbra.
It's a certified course measured by AIMS and the Portuguese Athletics Federation. I have not found the course certification booklet though, I'm sure Jmac will be disappointed to hear that 🫤
By the way, and completely unrelated to running, but if you ever visit Portugal, make sure you visit the library at the Coimbra University. It's IMHO the most beautiful thing in the whole of Portugal.
PRs: 1500 4:54.1 2019 - 5K 17:53 2023 - 10K 37:55 2023 - HM 1:21:59 2021
Up next: some 800m race (or time trials) / Also place in the top 20% in a trail race
Tool to generate Strava weekly
Fishy I didn't mean it to come off that way. To be more clear, I think all of this applies much more to people who started young, since eventually they can't set lifetime PR's anymore. But as Dave pointed out, some people start later, and so you can keep getting PR's. But what I'm getting at is JMac started young. I'll mention this maybe again in the new thread intro, but my peak year as of now was 2014, when I was 19. Then I fell from grace for a few years. Then thought fuck, I should get back into competitive running and get back to setting PR's while I still can. And so now here I am, hoping to get back to 2014 speed, and I probably can since I'm 28. Had I waited until say, 40-50, much less likely, I think?
No Worries MMerk I knew what you were saying that was just my lame attempt at trolling a bit. I peaked when I was 19 too....just not running!! I envy the folk who got started early "youth is wasted on the young". You are absolutely set up to do some really great things this year and beyond. 28 is very young in marathon runner years if this was tennis I'd be probably planning your retirement party
Wolf- De-lurk a bit more. Directness is welcome but it helps to have context. For me, some of the most helpful posters over the years have been the most direct, honest and occasionally insulting (sometimes intentional sometimes not) people on these boards. We're still waiting CAL.... It's what makes these places great. Just start of with a few posts about dead zone running or how low miles and fast paces will absolutely lead to marathon success and off we go
5K 18:36 (2023), 10K 39:40 (2022), 1/2 1:24:37 (2023), full 2:58:36 (2015)
Thanks. Low miles - that's absolutely me right now. But you'll never see me advocating something like RLRF because I like to practice what I preach and I'm a believer in long long runs. Probably because that's what I'm good at and everybody over here will tell me I need to get out of my comfort zone, but let me return to some kind of decent training first. Besides - proposing a RLRF approach in this forum would probably be considered to be trolling and thus be completely ignored anyway, right?
Besides - proposing a RLRF approach in this forum would probably be considered to be trolling and thus be completely ignored anyway, right?
Definitely not ignored here LOL. I remember a guy back in the day who constantly argued the galloway run/walk. He was certainly not ignored... Anyone else remember him?
RIP Milkman
In the last 6-12 months, the only time you've posted is getting involved in these schoolyard fights, insulting/admonishing other people, or about vaccines. You're as guilty as the people you think you're correcting given you're not actually posting about running.
Flavio - if it's not a PR attempt, course certification doesn't matter as much. I had a course come up a hair short in the past on GPS and I did go back and check if it all the cones/turns were correct, so it's helpful to have it if it comes up as a PR. Race officials / volunteers botch it all the time. They did it recently in a NYRR race, usually one of the best! The USA is so diverse in terms of how different the regions are, but I think Brazil might take the cake.
Steve - speaking of courses, I'm curious as well on this Melbourne point. The elites are notorious for running tangents terribly. Watch them in almost any race on live TV and you'll be scratching your head at what they're doing. It's bizarre to me that a popular course like that would not be measured correctly.
Fishy - if you want to get an argument started, talk about age grading more! I'm convinced it's the old man's equivalent of a participation trophy. I probably will use it myself when I get older, but we had a debate back in the day where Cal tried to argue that because his age graded time was something like 2:29, that he effectively was a sub 2:30 marathoner. We had a lot of back and forth about that one, given a) elite marathoners do not run past 40 years old, so the world records at older ages are soft and b) just because your AG time says you had the potential of sub 2:30 does not mean you are a sub 2:30 marathoner!
mmerkle - I started picking up my training seriously again when I was about your age. Ran a 3:12 when I was 28, so you have a long runway to go. I do believe there is something to the fact though that most amateur runners peak a set number of years after they start running rather than at a certain age, often because there is such an aerobic gap they need to work through for years.
5K: 16:37 (11/20) | 10K: 34:49 (10/19) | HM: 1:14:57 (5/22) | FM: 2:36:31 (12/19)
In the last 6-12 months, the only time you've posted is getting involved in these schoolyard fights, insulting/admonishing other people, or about vaccines.
Would you - or anyone else, for that matter - would you please be so kind to give an example of my insulting other people? I seem to have forgotten ...
I remember the same thing, but I’m not going to go back and find it, because the whole point here is that we just want to talk about running and not dwell on that shit. If you post here about running, everything will be fine.
Dave
Fishy - if you want to get an argument started, talk about age grading more! I'm convinced it's the old man's equivalent of a participation trophy. I probably will use it myself when I get older, but we had a debate back in the day where Cal tried to argue that because his age graded time was something like 2:29, that he effectively was a sub 2:30 marathoner. We had a lot of back and forth about that one, given a) elite marathoners do not run past 40 years old, so the world records at older ages are soft and b) just because your AG time says you had the potential of sub 2:30 does not mean you are a sub 2:30 marathoner! mmerkle - I started picking up my training seriously again when I was about your age. Ran a 3:12 when I was 28, so you have a long runway to go. I do believe there is something to the fact though that most amateur runners peak a set number of years after they start running rather than at a certain age, often because there is such an aerobic gap they need to work through for years.
Jmac- LOL if we keep trying CAL will eventually resurface right? Age grading is too subjective competing and placement in AGs is another thing entirely. I'm not sure how I feel about the 5 vs 10 year AGs I could be convinced either way. I think there are enough elites still running into their 40s and beyond that age world records are as valid as others. Durability, recovery longevity are core components in these records and an elite runner sub-40 is not guaranteed to be an elite masters runner. How many times have we seen runner flare out or be derailed by a string of injuries. They may not have some of the other necessary tools to maintain into their 40s and 50s.
MMerk - jmac is spot-on for my case. Improvements were easy for years until I took a lengthy break then they weren't. Take advantage now and keep working It was so much fun getting a PR almost every race.
Year in Review
The year started me with just returning from my stress reaction last fall. I had actually gotten back up to around 50 MPW fairly quickly after the 4 weeks off in November. The benefit of stopping after just a couple of runs of pain instead of pushing through it and letting it become a stress fracture.
My only real choice for a good marathon given my buildup was Grandma's given how long of a time I needed to get back up and running from the injury. Training actually went very well. I did have a hiccup with 11 weeks to go with a knee injury that cost me 6 days, but I was back up to my 75-85 MPW for the remainder of the time.
I was able to snag my one and only PR this year at my half marathon tune-up, and just barely: 3 seconds. This kept my streak alive of PRs at the 4 major distances for 9 straight years!
Grandma's wasn't meant to be. The weather was great, but for some reason, I faced the worst nausea in any race I've had and had to walk for the first time in a race. Still was able to finish in 2:40, but overall was not a great race.
Trained again for the NYCM. I injured my hamstring in my half marathon tuneup in that race. I still don't think I was ever in PR shape. None of my workouts went well during the buildup and I just never felt that fit. I'm not sure why, something I'll have to figure out next year.
The race itself was the biggest clusterfuck possible with the worst weather in that marathon's 35 year history in November. Still great to be running the streets of NY again, as I thought it was the greatest crowd I had seen in the 4 times I've run it.
My other main accomplishment this year: I ran the most miles I ever have. I should get right to 2800 by New Year's Eve. I only ran 1960 and 2212 the past 2 years respectively. I'm hoping this big jump in mileage will help me in my goal for 2023: a goddam Moose Mug.
My B goal for 2023 is to knock down my 10K PR, which shouldn't be too hard given it's a bit soft. I'd also like at least a shot at my 5K PR, although I'm getting a bit too old to knock that one down, but all of my focus will be on 5K/10K training through June so I think there's a good chance at it.
Well, I don't - and I should know. My point here is not that we just want to talk about running, my point is that I was accused of something I can't remember doing. Please forgive my asking.
I'm totally fine with that. Rule applies to everyone? Just asking.
Fishy - the placement within any group is interesting. I know most people take pride in how they do on the day of the race vs. others, but for me, I really only care about the time. There are 5Ks near me where I couldn't crack the top 25, and there are 5Ks near me where I would be first place by 2+ minutes. Why should I feel differently about those races just based upon who participated? I will admit that running my first race where I outright won was actually a lot of fun, but beyond that, I'm only out there racing myself.
if you want to get an argument started, talk about age grading more! I'm convinced it's the old man's equivalent of a participation trophy. I probably will use it myself when I get older, but we had a debate back in the day where Cal tried to argue that because his age graded time was something like 2:29, that he effectively was a sub 2:30 marathoner. We had a lot of back and forth about that one, given a) elite marathoners do not run past 40 years old, so the world records at older ages are soft and b) just because your AG time says you had the potential of sub 2:30 does not mean you are a sub 2:30 marathoner! I do believe there is something to the fact though that most amateur runners peak a set number of years after they start running rather than at a certain age, often because there is such an aerobic gap they need to work through for years.
if you want to get an argument started, talk about age grading more! I'm convinced it's the old man's equivalent of a participation trophy. I probably will use it myself when I get older, but we had a debate back in the day where Cal tried to argue that because his age graded time was something like 2:29, that he effectively was a sub 2:30 marathoner. We had a lot of back and forth about that one, given a) elite marathoners do not run past 40 years old, so the world records at older ages are soft and b) just because your AG time says you had the potential of sub 2:30 does not mean you are a sub 2:30 marathoner!
I do believe there is something to the fact though that most amateur runners peak a set number of years after they start running rather than at a certain age, often because there is such an aerobic gap they need to work through for years.
I don't really look at age grading as anything but a bit of fun and a little confidence boost. My 3:17:48 PR at Chicago doesn't look like much around these parts. But the age grade calculator spits out 2:45:43, which is kind of cool. In any case, my marathon time is whatever the official race result says it is, plain and simple. Age grading and my Strava "estimated best effort" for 26.2 miles on my watch are just for shits & giggles.
I had always heard the same thing as the second paragraph quoted above. I heard it as the "7 year rule." But I guess it's less of a rule than a guideline. My PRs this year came after 10 years of marathoning and another 2-3 years of running before that.
BTW, as long as we are bringing up Controversial Subjects - when speaking about it in casual conversation, and leaving off the seconds, am I permitted to say I ran a 3:17 marathon? It was certainly closer to 3:18, but rounding down looks nicer.
Mmmm Bop
I’m exactly the same and only focused on time and have no interest in how I place in the race or AG category, although I might think differently at Boston.
I remember reading that you can improve for up to 10 or so years after you start running regardless of age. My marathon PR was after 11 years…with a little help from some cheater shoes!
5k - 17:53 (4/19) 10k - 37:53 (11/18) Half - 1:23:18 (4/19) Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)