Advanced Half Marathon Training Thread - 2022 edition (Read 300 times)

zebano


    Not 100% sure my week is over but it'll probably be crosstraining latter so posting now:

     

    Date Name mi km Duration Avg/mi Avg/km Elevation Gain
    in ft
    01/11 Swim 0.45 0.73 00:20:00 44:27 27:24 0
    01/11 Wonderfully Warm Weather 2.61 4.20 00:21:00 08:03 05:00 0
    01/12 TShirt & Shorts in January 4.72 7.60 00:40:05 08:30 05:16 0
    01/12 Afternoon Swim 0.43 0.69 00:15:14 35:26 22:05 0
    01/13 Morning Swim 0.43 0.69 00:15:32 36:07 22:31 0
    01/13 A little bit further now 5.43 8.73 00:47:48 08:48 05:29 0
    01/14 Invigorating 5.81 9.35 00:47:56 08:15 05:08 0
    01/14 Lifting 0.00 0.00 00:08:31 00:00 00:00 0
    01/14 drills (800yd) 0.37 0.59 00:16:07 43:34 27:19 0
    01/15 Time on feet 10.24 16.48 01:43:54 10:09 06:18 410
    01/16 Recovery Run?? 5.39 8.67 00:47:06 08:44 05:26 197

     

    Run: 34.2 mi

    Swim: 1.8 mi

    Weights: 8:31

     

    Runs early in the week were quite a struggle due to the walking pnumonia as was the long run which was in fresh snow/slush/ice . One big takeaway is that I need to incorporate regular hills into my routes but I'm super happy to finish the week feeling healthy. I'll try to get back over 40 miles next week. On a side notes, all four swims were exactly 800 yards, the variety of reported distances makes me much happier with the margin of error in GPS versus deriving number of laps via an accelerometer. On the weather front, even though I dodged running in it, having multiple days around 0F has made 17F a very comfortable temperature to run in.

     

    p.s. my watch has issues. I only have elevation on the runs where I asked strava to correct it. My watch isn't recording any and the battery is dying literally every day.

    1600 - 5:23 (2018), 5k - 19:33 (2018), 10k - 41:20 (2021), half - 1:38:57 (2018), Marathon - 3:37:17 (2018)

    darkwave


    Mother of Cats

      Piwi - nice big week.  Why is it "mileage" when you measure in KM?

       

      Watson - that 1/10 workout looks like a tough one - work at HM pace as part of a longer run?

       

      Steve - that sounds like a stabilizer muscle that cramped.  Could it be related to the hills?

       

      James - I am sorry you had a set back.  One thought (since you said that it doesn't hurt now) how long did you keep running once the hamstring started to hurt?  (what I'm trying to get at is whether it is something that would have progressively worsened, or something that might have flared and then cleared).  And did it stop hurting as soon as you stopped running?

       

      (something that flared and then vanished, and then flared and then vanished might be nerve rather than muscle).

       

      Marky_Mark - congrats on the win and a well run race, and also on getting a race done!

       

      Flavio - glad things are improving.

       

      Fred - congrats on renewing your mileage in the miles<degrees club.

       

      CCOakley - sounds like the timing is right for a snow/rest day.  I keep thinking that if we get snow then ice then rain, this will all be gone fairly quickly.

       

      Zebano - that's really surprising that your watch has so much issue measuring laps.  Mine is almost always spot on.  Perhaps you execute your turns very smoothly and quickly, so it can't tell the difference between your stroke and a turn?

      Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

       

      And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

      darkwave


      Mother of Cats

        My week:

        60 miles running, 3 hours pool-running, and 1000 yards swimming.

        M: 90 minutes pool-running and upper body weights/core
        T: 11 miles on the treadmill, including a workout of 8 repeats of 2 minutes strong at a 3.0 incline, 90 second jog, 30 second stride, and 60 second jog. Followed with leg strengthwork. Dry needling of legs in afternoon.
        W: 8 miles very easy on treadmill (9:51), streaming yoga, and 4 miles very easy outside (9:48) plus drills/strides.
        Th: 90 minutes pool-running and upper body weights/core. ART appointment in afternoon.
        F: 11 miles, including a track workout of 4800m in 21:07 (7:09/7:01/6:57), 1 lap jog, and then 2x400, 4x200 with equal distance recovery in 95, 96, 48, 47, 47, 47. Followed with leg strengthwork and 500 yards recovery swimming.
        Sa: 9 miles easy on treadmill (9:39), streaming yoga, and then 3 miles very easy outside (9:25) plus drills/strides.
        Su: 14 miles on the treadmill, including a tempo workout of 4x7:30 at tempo effort (paces of 7:04, 7:04, 7:01, and 7:01) with 90 second jog in between. Full recovery and then four short (40 second) intervals at between 9.1 and 9.8 mph with 80 second jog to work on turnover.

        (the final 2 miles of the cooldown were with my Lever Runner). Followed with injury prevention work and 500 yards recovery swimming.

         

        I spent a fair amount of time on the treadmill this week due to very cold and dry air outside. Generally, when the dew point is lower than 10F, my asthma gets aggravated - I've learned that if I force hard running in that situation it takes me a few days to recover.

         

        I got my quads/glutes/it band dry needled on Tuesday - wow did they need it. My quads spasmed a LOT during the needling. And felt looser the next day.

         

        I also had a bit of a revelation, prompted by a friend's observation during my Friday track workout that I had no hip extension. Lack of hip extension can be due to lack of hip flexibility (not my issue) but can also be due to core instability. So I decided to try Jay DiCharry's "Chair of Death" exercise (look it up - not that scary), and noted that I was arching my back whenever I fired my glutes. It's not a core weakness thing - I've got a very strong core. It's just a muscle habit thing.

         

        So I aligned my core properly and then applied KT tape to my front torso before all my runs this weekend - the idea is that the KT tape pulls any time I start arching my back, and reminds me to keep stuff pulled in.

         

        And both my weekend runs were considerably improved - my leg felt much more powerful and responsive. My hunch is that when my back arches, things get pinched, and that causes my issues.

         

        Hopefully I'll be able to do a track workout on Tuesday, and test out how the taped core works there.

        Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

         

        And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

        Running Problem


        Problem Child

          Quick drive by posting.

          Kids will be home all week so running is going to be minimal. Covid exposure = daycare closed for a week. Stupid, and complaining doesn't change anything.

           

          All easy running this week. Still doing okay with the "run every street" thing. At least one day this week was a "I don't feel like running at all" type of run and it shows. Surprisingly I still hit 50 miles. Sunday's long run started at 2:30am. Yes 2:30. I had planned on waking up around, but woke up at 2am and knew by 2:15 I wasn't going to fall back asleep. Literally no one else out there until I was in the final mile and only aroudn 3am did I think "hmm...I wonder how many people would be heading home from the bars since they stop selling at 2am where I'm from." I had a headlamp, but used all moonlight and forgot my safety vest. Got home, like last week, before anyone woke up. About 12 hours later I was falling asleep on the couch. The walks help mentally. Plus it's actually nice out so I feel bad with the dog just sitting around doing nothing. Oh and Sunday's long run was NOT designed to be as fast as it was. Something about running in total silence and darkness just made me go faster. I actually noticed I was going fast, thought "hmm how fast is this?" and it was 7:20/mi pace. I only drank about 4 ounces of Skratch lab and I was totally expecting to take on more.

          Weekly for period: From: 01/10/2022 To 01/16/2022

          Date Name mi km Duration Avg/mi Avg/km Elevation Gain
          in ft
          01/10 That time it was the perfect day to not run. 6.52 10.49 00:48:28 07:26 04:37 161
          01/11 That time the third NO TRESPASSING sign was no longer a warning. 10.87 17.49 01:24:13 07:45 04:49 732
          01/11 Afternoon Walk 0.72 1.16 00:15:53 22:04 13:42 13
          01/12 Morning Walk 0.94 1.52 00:19:22 20:36 12:44 13
          01/12 That time I saw a little 🐰 up ahead. 7.80 12.55 00:59:32 07:38 04:45 377
          01/13 Force vs Coercion 1.46 2.34 00:29:42 20:21 12:42 46
          01/13 That time it was one more reason I'm not a trail runner 1.51 2.43 00:11:54 07:53 04:54 59
          01/14 Bluetooth vs hands free 1.28 2.05 00:43:33 34:01 21:15 20
          01/14 That time I’m one checkbox away from a triathlete. 1.40 2.25 00:19:11 13:42 08:32 20
          01/15 Solo vs alone 1.36 2.19 00:25:46 18:57 11:46 33
          01/15 That time I’d find a way if my name was Will. 6.69 10.77 00:52:17 07:49 04:51 161
          01/16 That time I RAN when MOON would SHINE brightest 17.01 27.38 02:11:57 07:45 04:49 236

          Total distance: 57.56mi (51.82 mi running)

          Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

          VDOT 54.9

          5k19:35 | Marathon 2:56:07

            CC 50 miles nice. I would need at least 100m Elevation on a 6 mile run for it to be considered hilly at all.

             

            Zeb what watch do you have ? My Garmin 235 loses heart rate data every few months.

             

            DW lots of analysis and work going on for you to find out what's going on. Looks like you have found a solution

            The mileage/kilometerage has been talked about every so often. I think its a hangover word from the past and if you were buying a car etc you would always ask the mileage even though it's in kilometers.

            50+ PBs -  

            5k 18.21 Hagley Parkrun  July 21      82.27 % age grade

            10k TT 37.21 may 2nd 2021 strava run 82.51 % age grade

            Half marathon  1.23.30 may 21 80.11 % age grade

            " If you don't use it you lose it,  but if you use it, it wears out.

            Somewhere in between is about right "      

             

            Marky_Mark_17


              Everyone - thanks for the support... any time you get a win is a very special day, gotta celebrate those!  For me it's a combination of good form and also no-one faster than me showing up (and there are plenty of faster runners around, believe me!).

               

              I looked at the official results and my positive split was not as bad as it felt (17:07 / 17:31).  Considering the tailwind for the first 3km, and the twists and turns over kms 8-9, it was probably a pretty even effort.  Good outcome considering I haven't raced a 10km for well over a year.

               

              Steve - yikes, 66m climb right at the front!  I get a decent 30m or so in the first 500m when I run from home and that's bad enough!

               

              Flavio- congrats on the Strava crown!  Gotta celebrate those too!

               

              Caitlin - really solid week there, well done putting in the work.

               

              Zebano - there's certainly a lot to be said for hills.  I always get a lot of them on my long runs and I'm sure that's been beneficial.  Nothing like hitting a big climb when you've already got 16 miles in the legs to really make you dig deep.  Good to hear you're feeling better.

               

              RP - yeah but complaining does at least hopefully help you feel better!  And man... 2:30am, that's next level.  Everyone thought I was nuts back in 2019 when I was rocking my long runs at 4am on a Sunday morning because it was the only time I could get it done... but 2:30am is something else.  That's like, even the crazy people think you're crazy.  Well done.

               

              Darkwave - sounds like progress... great news.  It's remarkable how the body can just get into bad habits and just channel things into strange places.  I often have to consciously un-hunch my shoulders which have a habit of creeping up.

              3,000m: 9:07.7 (Nov-21) | 5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20)  

              10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) | HM: 1:09:41 (May-21)* | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)

              * Net downhill course

              Last race: Southern Lakes HM, 7 May, 1:12:42 (May-22)

              Up next: Auckland 10km Road Champs, 20 August

              "CONSISTENCY IS KING"

              JamesD


              JamesD

                 

                 James - I am sorry you had a set back.  One thought (since you said that it doesn't hurt now) how long did you keep running once the hamstring started to hurt?  (what I'm trying to get at is whether it is something that would have progressively worsened, or something that might have flared and then cleared).  And did it stop hurting as soon as you stopped running?

                 

                (something that flared and then vanished, and then flared and then vanished might be nerve rather than muscle).

                 

                Both Thursday on the treadmill and Saturday in the park I kept going at a slower pace for about three minutes before stopping, just in case it would get better like issues do sometimes.  It didn't.  (On Saturday I had also felt the hamstring very briefly about 5 minutes into the run, but it's not unusual for me to have minor aches in my first mile that go away quickly.  Having trouble start suddenly after more than an hour is unusual, though.)  It wasn't rapidly worsening during the 3 minutes after the sudden onset, but it felt bad enough that I didn't think it was a good idea to continue.  It felt bad (not a sharp pain, but not good) for a while afterwards too.  I've occasionally felt it at random times today, which I've taken off.

                Post-1987 PRs:  Half 1:30:14 (2019); 10K 39:35 (2019); 5K 19:12 (2017); Mile 5:37.3 (2020)

                2022 Goals: Get/stay healthy; run consistently; Half<1:30; PR or 80% age-grade at one distance

                zebano


                  RP solid week, that long run is really impressive.

                   

                  Piwi/DW I've got  a Coros Apex. The altimeter not working and the lap counting doesn't actually bother me enough to do anything about it, the problem is that the battery life is draining fast enough I have to charge it twice a day since the previous firmware update.

                   

                  DW isn't "chair of death" just a squat where you make sure the knees don't go forward? are you supposed to be able to get all the way down so your butt touches your calves or is it just a down to parallel thing? Sounds like progress regardless and that's good news!

                   

                  Mark Grats on the win, even with such a short race report Wink Racing well solo is tough and you did it anyway.

                  1600 - 5:23 (2018), 5k - 19:33 (2018), 10k - 41:20 (2021), half - 1:38:57 (2018), Marathon - 3:37:17 (2018)

                  darkwave


                  Mother of Cats

                     

                    DW isn't "chair of death" just a squat where you make sure the knees don't go forward? are you supposed to be able to get all the way down so your butt touches your calves or is it just a down to parallel thing? Sounds like progress regardless and that's good news!

                     

                    It's that, but you do it while holding a dowel or similar at your back, making sure your butt, back, and head all touch the dowel the entire time doing down and up.  I can do glute focused squats just fine.  But when I hold the dowel, my mid-back pulls away from it when I rise back up from the squat.

                    Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

                     

                    And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

                    zebano


                       

                      It's that, but you do it while holding a dowel or similar at your back, making sure your butt, back, and head all touch the dowel the entire time doing down and up.  I can do glute focused squats just fine.  But when I hold the dowel, my mid-back pulls away from it when I rise back up from the squat.

                       

                      Interesting, my physical therapist liked to make me do that with a dowel while doing 1 leg deadlifts. edit: more interestingly my back only pulled away when my right leg was planted, but not when my left was

                      1600 - 5:23 (2018), 5k - 19:33 (2018), 10k - 41:20 (2021), half - 1:38:57 (2018), Marathon - 3:37:17 (2018)

                      Fredford66


                      Running Musician

                        I was under the impression that web sites & apps (Garmin, Strava, RA) calculate elevation based on a watch's GPS track and that the watches themselves don't store elevation data.  Perhaps I'm mistaken but it would explain why every site tends to come up with a different elevation stat for a run while generally agreeing on the distance.

                         

                        I ran 5 today in blustery weather that included a brief mix of snow/sleet.  The streets were pretty clear after overnight rain washed away the storm's initial 2" of snow.

                        5k 23:48.45 (3/22); 4M 31:26 (2/22); 5M 39:24 (11/21); 10k 50:32 (10/21); Half 1:50:46 (4/22)

                        Upcoming race(s): Hopewell Valley 5k, 5/29; Scotch Plains 5k, 6/14
                        cc4life07


                        Wind is not my friend.

                          Fred - Elevation maps I've always thought as a guideline.  Definitely don't trust anything unless I've seen it.  I'll plead ignorance to knowing how any of it works though.

                           

                          Solid weeks posted by you all and congrats on the race Mark.  Trying to catch up after being out for a couple days so gotta read back.

                           

                          May be forced onto a treadmill tonight at the gym with the ice that we got yesterday and below freezing temps.  All my miles this weekend were under sub 10 temperature but today is nicer (although ice everywhere).  48.5 last week and hoping for a similar training week this week.

                          "Current" PRs

                          5K - 18:00 (4/19)   |   HM - 1:19:28 (4/22)

                          Next Race: A 5K of some sort (Goal: Sub 17:30)

                          zebano


                            Fred, some watches will approximate elevation based on their GPS data. Some watches have a barometric altimeter which supposedly provides more accurate elevation, provided the weather (pressure) stays constant. It is also possible to approximate elevation post-run via maps (i.e. strava's "correct elevation" feature). I don't know enough of the math behind any of these options to say if one is better than another.

                            1600 - 5:23 (2018), 5k - 19:33 (2018), 10k - 41:20 (2021), half - 1:38:57 (2018), Marathon - 3:37:17 (2018)

                            Longboat


                            On the roads again...

                              I was under the impression that web sites & apps (Garmin, Strava, RA) calculate elevation based on a watch's GPS track and that the watches themselves don't store elevation data.  Perhaps I'm mistaken but it would explain why every site tends to come up with a different elevation stat for a run while generally agreeing on the distance.

                               

                              Garmin "Uncorrected" elevation data comes directly from rhe watch's reading. That can be very inaccurate because in the vertical direction, small errors are not self correcting. A normal GPS error of, say, 3 ft too high on one point, may be followed by another that's accurate -- but the altitude change then shows 3ft up, 3 ft down.  In the horizontal plane, such errors are mostly self correcting -- an error of 3 ft in the direction of the run doesn't get to the distance total if a subsequent point is accurate. Some inaccuracy results from errors in the side to side movement, though; the path distance shows a zig-zag.

                              Garmin's Elevation Correction function relies on publicly available elevation data bases, usually the original maps of the areas. Those maps were never very accurate and are not sufficiently granular for measuring elevation at points on a GPS run. Also, human activity also introduced changes from the original surfaces. Examples in the public data bases:
                              - A high bridge over a sea inlet will usually show 0' elevation on the elevation data base -- so those "Florida hill" repeats show up as flat.
                              - A road through a developed area that has been cut and graded will show the original elevation profile after although the hills have been cut away and the dips filled (that's the case with the roads in my neighborhood -- before development, apparently some 20' hills and 40' deep ravines were on the now-flat roads. 
                              - A trail cut into the side of a steep hill will show the higher elevation that was cut away -- but if there's a side-to-side error in the Garmin track, Garmin's algorithm may show the elevation far above or below the present trail

                              Despite all this. Elevation Correction Enabled seems to be an improvement over no correction.

                              Strava started out using the public data bases, but found the errors mentioned above. They then developed their own data base using users' data, smoothing and eventually eliminating a lot of the errors. On Strava, I'd get credit for the Florida hills because many people run over that bridge. And my street would not look like a mini Sierra Mountains. They also correct to known trail elevation if the GPS track is slightly off to one side. Their elevation measurements are likely to be more accurate than those in Garmin Connect. 

                              Mapmyrun says they use US Geological Survey elevation data, but my experience is that their elevations reflect the actual situation better than Garmin Elevation Corrected. They may have started cross-referencing a Strava-like data base.

                              Neil

                              --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                              “Some people will tell you that slow is good – but I'm here to tell you that fast is better. I've always believed this, in spite of the trouble it's caused me. - Hunter S. Thompson

                                The footage of the volcano was amazing.  Its hard to believe we have the ability to witness things like this now.

                                 

                                Piwi Watson nice week nice long run too.

                                James nice week but you continue to have issues with your hamstrings I hate that for you.  I'm interested in your thoughts on the CBD for your foot if/when you start using it, if it really helps I have what seems like constant foot pain looking for a solution/relief besides NSAIDs.

                                Mark week and Nice job on the race congratulations on the win.

                                Flavio nice week see you are still putting a few miles in and taking down Strava crowns!

                                ccoakley nice week as well great mileage

                                 

                                Zebano  nice week hope you get over the walking pneumonia

                                DW and RP nice weeks as well

                                 

                                Another 30 mile week for me got my long run in on Saturday before the snow set in.  Sunday I slopped through several inches of wet snow for a couple of miles.

                                we still have some snow on the ground hopefully it will all be gone tomorrow expecting teens and twenties this weekend again and maybe more snow.

                                Weekly for period: From: 01/10/2022 To 01/16/2022

                                Date Name mi km Duration Avg/mi Avg/km Elevation Gain
                                in ft
                                01/10 Afternoon Run 5.25 8.45 00:46:11 08:48 05:28 72
                                01/12 Afternoon Run 5.30 8.53 00:43:47 08:16 05:08 72
                                01/13 Evening Run 5.25 8.45 00:51:11 09:45 06:03 72
                                01/15 Morning Run 11.56 18.60 01:42:20 08:51 05:30 495
                                               
                                01/16 Deep Snow Run 2.60 4.19 00:25:31 09:49 06:05 85

                                Total distance: 30.00m

                                PR's

                                1m  5:38 (2018)

                                5k    19:59 (2019)

                                HM  1:33:56 (2018)

                                FM  3:23:07 (2018)