2019 Sub 3 hour marathon thread (Read 577 times)

Nimmals


    JT- I had an evening race so I have to catch up tonight.

     

    Cinnamon - I like Beck's Burn Bracket for all my tapers its fast easy fast. Most of my 2018 PRs were following that taper workout 2-3 days out.

     

    63.29 mi week
    Run Sun, 6/30/2019 Race + WU & CD 1:01:02  7.6 mi 205 ft

    Run Sun, 6/30/2019 Race Day Shakeout 1:04:33 6.38 mi 205 ft

    Run Sat, 6/29/2019 Shakeout Run 44:44 4.33 mi 169 ft

    Workout Fri, 6/28/2019 Beck’s Burn Bracketed Run w/ Michele 1:01:22 7.46 mi 299 ft

    Run Thu, 6/27/2019 Easy in the Evening Sun 58:20 6.31 mi 336 ft

    Workout Thu, 6/27/2019 Peacocks - Monghetti 1:04:48 8.17 mi 76 ft

    Run Wed, 6/26/2019 8 mi run w/ Franklin Pat & Ant . Runner's Edge Renegades 1:18:40 8.01 mi 367 ft

    Workout Tue, 6/25/2019 - 4x1k w/ 2x 400m (Bike Path) Oyster Bay - Morning Run 56:14 7.58 mi 50 ft

    Run Mon, 6/24/2019 Morning Run 1:06:16 7.45 mi 434 ft

    darkwave


    Mother of Cats

      Belated catching up:

      ZZCaptain Obvious - I do not like running in thunderstorms at all - tough luck for you.
      JTreeves - nice solid week - I like the 3x2 miles especially
      M_M_C - hope the glute clears up quickly - good that you know how to handle it.
      Swim - so I take it Chicago was more oppressive than home?
      Nimmals - how did the race go. I like that burn bracket workout.

       

      Pre classic - I was really happy to see Paul Chelimo run so well and close so hard.

       

       

      My week ending 6/30:

      28 miles, 28 "miles" of pool-running, and 2000 yards of swimming
      M: 8 "miles" pool-running
      T: yoga, 2 "miles" pool-running, and 1500 yards swimming.
      W: yoga and 9 "miles" pool-running
      Th: Upper body weights, core, and 9 "miles" pool-running
      F: 8 miles very easy (9:05) and some drills
      Sa: 10 miles, including 8 short hill repeats (60-70 seconds up; ~2:30 back down). Also injury prevention work and 500 yards recovery swimming
      Su: 10 miles easy (8:59) plus drills, strides, and upper body strength/core.

      Did 5 days of no running - just social pool-running and a bit of swimming. Then re-introed running - mostly easy except for some short hill stuff. I'm going to stay off the track for another two weeks or so.

      Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

       

      And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

      JMac11


      Benevolent Leader

        Nimmals - Firecracker was good this year, 14:37 to win is pretty impressive! Definitely has to be one of the more competitive 5Ks on Long Island in the summer.

         

        JT - throw my crap 17:50 up on the first page!

         

        DW - now that you reflected more on the race, are you sticking with the plan to race less and lower intensity? I always like lowering my VDOT after a "bad" race because we have to keep following the mantra that it is better to run your quality days too slowly than too quickly

         

        Me - As stated, ran a crap 17:50 5K this past weekend. Pretty much as expected given the complete lack of quality days and the fact that I took 10 days off at the end of May. I'll be racing again in just 3 weeks. Hopefully I get some better weather, as 70 degree dew points are not something I really enjoy racing in. It's too bad the weather didn't break earlier, as it's been beautiful the past 2 days! Also, similar to MMC, dealing with some glute issues. I had some SI ligament issues last year and this feels exactly the same. It completely flared up Sunday night, but for now, I think I can run through it. Going to be one of those see how it progresses: if it stays like this, I will keep running through it. It's a bit hard to do any ball work on it though as it's so close to the bone, so will just do work around it.

        5K: 16:51 (8/19)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:16:21 (3/19)  |  FM: 2:44:43 (4/19) 

         

        Next Race: Suffolk County Half Marathon (10/27/19)

        darkwave


        Mother of Cats

           

           

          DW - now that you reflected more on the race, are you sticking with the plan to race less and lower intensity? I always like lowering my VDOT after a "bad" race because we have to keep following the mantra that it is better to run your quality days too slowly than too quickly

           

          Yes, in that for the next half-marathon/10 mile focus, I'll return to my normal schedule of racing (the period between Broad Street and Grandma's was a bit of an aberration in how much I raced and how little strengthwork I did and how low my mileage was.  I like to race, but that was a bit more than I normally do with a half-marathon on the calendar.

           

          I will be racing a lot this summer, since I'll be focusing almost exclusively on miles, with no goal half looming in the future.  Once marathon training starts in September, there won't be much racing - just the 5th Avenue Mile right at the very start of the cycle, and the Columbus Half 3 weeks out from the marathon.

           

          Does that make sense?  My balance of training/racing does shift, depending on what distance I'm focusing on.  The shorter the distance, the more frequently I race.

           

          Unqualified yes to pulling back on the intensity, and I'll also be shifting back to starting my workouts more conservatively, and saving the hard running for the last few reps.    VDOT doesn't really apply, since pulling back is just a slightly different feel for me.

           

          Agreed that racing in a DP of 70 or above is really tough.  Hopefully better weather for the next one.

          Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

           

          And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

            MMC: Hope that glute injury is getting better; looks like you are running again so that's a good sign.

             

            Swim: The Chicago visit must have been bittersweet running-wise: nice to have more oxygen but not so nice to have the humidity. Good looking week.

             

            Nimmals: Sifan and Koko ran great in the 3000m at Pre; you must be happy about that. Muir ran a tough race as well.

             

            DW: I agree about Chelimo's great finish; if the race was 10 meters longer he would have won.  Nice recovery week.

             

            JMac: Updated the table with your result and DW's half result. As I said on strava I'm impressed you even ran that morning. I ran easy on trails with my son and it was disgustingly humid and hot. Was totally drenched after just a mile or two. You'll cut big chunks off your time this summer. Hope your glute issue resolves.

             

            General question: has anyone raced a marathon in Adizero Adios 4s (or earlier models)?

            5K: 17:55 (2017)    HM: 1:23:57 (2016)    FM: 2:52:16 (2018)

            Up next: Hartford Marathon (Oct. 12)

            kramrunner


              Summer #06
              M     00 58 01      6.71 w/ 8x hill sprints
              T      01 11 00      9.1 tm w/ 2.5wu + 6x1k, 4x300 + cd, 0.5% -- 1k@11mph, 300m@11.5/.6/.6/.7; rec < 120s, <90s
              W     01 01 59     7.98  
              Th    01 11 40     9.17  
              F     00 37 32      4.69 
              S     01 13 08      8.6 tm w/ 3wu + 10x400 + 2cd, 0.5%, 11.7/.8/.9/7x12mph, rec: ~120s walk
              S     01 27 51     11.31 
                                        ====
                                        57.56

              Summer #07
              M     01 11 13     8.16 w/ 8x hill sprints
              T     01 17 00     10.0 tm w/ 3wu + 6x1k + 6x200 + cd, 0.5%, k@11mph, 200s@11.5/.6/.7/.8/.9/12mph rec: <120s walk, <60s jog
              W    00 53 25     6.5  
              Th    01 16 51    9.35  
              F      00 56 39     7.11 
              S     00 17 48      5k    whitmore lake 1st OA by >3min tdp ~ 140-150
                      00 20 00     2.5   wu/cd (1.4, 1.1)
              S     01 46 33     13.61 
                                         ====
                                         60.33

               

              Had a solid past 2 weeks, finally getting back into the grove of consistent running. I had to take yesterday and today off as I think running in the >140 tdp nonsense on sat/sun caught up with me and I really felt beat-up energy wise. Got to be more careful re-hydrating afterwards. I'm pretty ok with this as I had this week planned as a down week with some weekend travel and partying ahead. I got started on getting my long run inching back up too and should be back hitting 2hr+ in the next few weeks. Indy 2019 cycle starts next in the next week or so.

               

              Solid weeks all. Sorry, that's all I've got as I got behind some.

               

              DW: Another thing worth thinking about regarding your race is the purely mental aspect of it. Per your report you seemed dialed out and locked into a misleading pace, that based on effort you thought was on point. Imho, you may well have had a faster race in you had you locked into a faster pace right from the off. I know for myself, that it's very hard to speed up once I've locked in.

               

              JT: You're really right back in the swing of things. I hear you on the heat, I'm make sure to specifically have 2 cups of water regardless of how thirster I am after every run. I think we get so used to being somewhat de-hydrated, that it's very easy to get behind on things.

               

              Nimmals: Another solid week. You are proper strong as I'd be in pieces if I tried as much hard running as you!

               

              Jmac11: I feel your pain. I was cooked by 1 mile and brought it in by effort. The local fire department had a truck out and turned on the hose for folks to cool down after... heaven!

               

              Weather: We were cooking here this weekend and that was with a dp only in the 60s. You and Andres have a nice most horrible weekly running conditions competition to enjoy!

              5k: 17:32 (11/18) -- 10k: 38:47 (07/17) -- 10m: 60:23 (08/17)  -- 1/2: 1:22:32 (11/17) -- full: 2:49:26 (04/17)

              2019 Goals: Assault on 2:40!         Next up: Indy Monumental (Nov 9)

              weatherboy80


                Happy 4th to everyone!

                 

                Kram:  Looks like lots of folks are baking in the heat now.  Saw my dew point hit 82 this morning which is just gross!  Nice looking summar mileage as well.

                 

                JMac: Don't beat yourself up too much.  Heat kills even at short race distances. Plus a sub 18 off just easy mileage is still pretty good.  Thinking you will see pretty quick improvements in just a few weeks time.  Sucks about the glute though and hopefully that has resolved itself by now.

                 

                DW:  Same advice to you - don't beat yourself up to much. Nice recovery week though!

                 

                JT: Nice big week and also like that 3 X 2 workout!

                 

                MMC: Sucks about the glute.  Don't rush back to quickly though.

                 

                Swim and Nimmals:  Strong looking weeks!

                 

                Me:  Had a few days in the lower humidity before I was smacked right back into FL late Tuesday.   Had a decent short workout on Wednesday targeting short fast tunover and then surpised myself with nice 19+ mile LR on Saturday running with a friend who is running his first marathon this September.  Felt really good despite the heat and we were able to crank down into the low 6 range for the last few miles.

                 

                Weekly Summary
                Monday, Jun 24, 2019 thru Sunday, Jun 30, 2019

                Day

                Miles

                Pace

                Description

                Link

                Mon

                11.2

                7:24

                Some more hills 

                strava

                Mon

                4.2

                7:39

                Warm and humid here now 😂

                strava

                Tue

                10.1

                7:47

                Erie Canal trail + strides 

                strava

                Wed

                3.1

                8:27

                Warm up + strides

                strava

                Wed

                4.0

                6:49

                Welcome back to the heat Joe: 4 X (200R, 200R, 400R)

                strava

                Wed

                3.1

                8:29

                Cool down

                strava

                Thu

                4.2

                7:55

                AM miles 

                strava

                Thu

                8.1

                7:54

                Got lost on the trail running in a circle

                strava

                Fri

                6.2

                7:40

                EZ + strides 

                strava

                Sat

                19.4

                7:28

                That felt pretty good!

                strava

                Sun

                6.5

                7:38

                Morning Run

                strava

                 

                80.1

                7:40

                   

                5K: 16:44 (11/18)  |  10K: 36:09 (2/18)  |  HM: 1:17:15 (12/18)  |  FM: 2:48:58 (1/18)

                Nimmals


                  Nimmals - Firecracker was good this year, 14:37 to win is pretty impressive! Definitely has to be one of the more competitive 5Ks on Long Island in the summer.

                   

                   JMac Sub 18 on little to no specific training is still pretty good in my book. You missed some great drama on the Firecracker course.

                   

                  DW - FireCracker Race was awesome we had a WCTC guy come down and set  the course on fire broke course record by 11 seconds. second place was 1:10 back ~15:47

                  The winner went out fast, I started fighting with some dude 400M in. Hahaha he was witty, had a mouth I was yelling at him lost my breath got dropped. He was 37 saw my gray hair latch on to me bump me once twice three time I'll look past it but 7x in 800m.   You're kidding me. Then some high school kid said running is a contact sport. Happens all the time in XC. yeah paths are narrow and its a hole shoot to grab your position. I lost my cool went ape shit on him. The roand iwas 4 lanes wide why touch me??  then I said youre blocking my tangents and he said tangents "Don't matter" so why rub up against me 7x? I let him have it, then couldn't breathe .  That what happens when you lose your cool. I struggled to break 17. after.  I lost my head in the game, anyway I soon realized I could jog it in, still win same as the winner. With time out the door so I coasted for free sneakers.

                   

                  JTReeves all is can say is Sifan  thinks its ok to shove, On top of it her arms are a Hurricane of fury she was waving them so hard and erratic, literally shove Dibaba aside. lol I almost spit my soda laughing  reminded me of the Rap song Move ,,, Get out the way.....

                  Houlihan closed like a freight train. why is it the Americans can't front run. This sit and kick championship bullcrap is a result of our qualifying system from nationals and NCAAs  Where you can  run  crap all year and win a championship sellection if you have a old sub 2 year standard.

                   

                  Weatherboy thats an amazing 80 in  the heat and humidity. I Do you ever take the day to drive to the clay loop just do hills. Hansons trains there alot and other teams from Colorado. A girl i coach goes there cause its the only hills around for three hours. Not sure how far south you are.

                   

                  Kram Runner nice weeks too. the workouts are easier than they look i train lazy.  only the intervals are hard everything is molasses pace.

                     

                     

                     

                    General question: has anyone raced a marathon in Adizero Adios 4s (or earlier models)?

                    JT HI. I started using adios 2s and 3s in 2015. I never ran a marathon in them but they were really a nice shoe for me. Light enough with 8 to 10mm drop if you like that. Toe box always felt comfy. Never felt beat up on longrun.

                    50+ PBs5k 18:29 Tauranga Parkrun May18   

                    10k 38.55 oct 19 strava run

                    " If you don't use it you lose it but if you use it, it wears out.

                    Somewhere in between is about right "      

                     

                    weatherboy80


                      Nimmals:  I've only been out to Clermont clay loop twice in the last few years.  It is a great training loop, but it is about 1.5 hours away or more with traffic.  I should be include 1 or 2 in my leadup to Boston as the loop is no joke either as there is quite a bit of climbing and lots of rolling hills which makes it an excellent option for those elite groups that want to train in winter.  I'm actually looking at a nighttime 10 mile race on that loop on my birthday in mid August which won't be a fast race by any means, but would be a fun event to do.

                       

                      https://rootsrated.com/stories/the-10-mile-clay-loop-a-slice-of-heaven-for-orlando-runners

                      5K: 16:44 (11/18)  |  10K: 36:09 (2/18)  |  HM: 1:17:15 (12/18)  |  FM: 2:48:58 (1/18)

                        JT HI. I started using adios 2s and 3s in 2015. I never ran a marathon in them but they were really a nice shoe for me. Light enough with 8 to 10mm drop if you like that. Toe box always felt comfy. Never felt beat up on longrun.

                         

                        Piwi: Thanks for sharing; I really like the shoes and have run a few long runs and hard workouts in them. They fit like a glove. I need to decide whether to go with them or the VFs for my next marathon. It's a tough choice! The one downside of them for me is that although they feel great during the run, I seem to get a major flare-up of PF after I run in them. With the VFs that does not happen.

                        5K: 17:55 (2017)    HM: 1:23:57 (2016)    FM: 2:52:16 (2018)

                        Up next: Hartford Marathon (Oct. 12)

                        RunDrinkRepeat


                          I just broke 3 in the marathon for the first time earlier this year. A word of advice... for those of you training by yourself most of the time, tune in to the Peaked too Early Podcast on iTunes. Very down to earth runners who make the sport fun. Most importantly when your on a run by yourself listening to the podcast, its like going for a run with a few of your buddies. They get it.

                           

                          https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/episode-16-gabriel-ghiglione-midnight-runners/id1458291922?i=1000443347275

                           

                          https://soundcloud.com/mgendron727/episode-14-ollie-hoare-2018-ncaa-1500-champ-ncaa-outdoor-recap

                          darkwave


                          Mother of Cats

                             

                            DW: Another thing worth thinking about regarding your race is the purely mental aspect of it. Per your report you seemed dialed out and locked into a misleading pace, that based on effort you thought was on point. Imho, you may well have had a faster race in you had you locked into a faster pace right from the off. I know for myself, that it's very hard to speed up once I've locked in.

                             

                            Yeah - same question was asked in the other thread.  Had I known what paces I was splitting, I don't think I would have picked it up.  The effort was right on that edge, and I was DONE when I crossed the finish.  I have a pretty good sense of when I've kept something in reserve versus left it all out there, and I left it all out there.

                             

                            Nimmals - crazy story.  I despise it when people treat road races like Diamond League track meets.  Plenty of room for us all here, and if you like contact sports, go play rugby or football.

                             

                            Adios question:  I adore the Adios 2, and am working my way through my last boxes of it.  I ran several good marathons in that shoe, and would return to it for that distance if the Vaporfly disappeared.  The Adios 2 had a "torsion plate" that ran up into the forefoot, giving it a very stiff feel that I loved***.  On my foot, it actually didn't feel that different from the VF4% - it's just not as rocker like and had a much lower profile.

                             

                            The Adios 3 adjusted that torsion plate - it's still in the shoe, but doesn't extend all the way to the forefoot, so the shoe is more flexible there.  I understand that a lot of people like it that way, and that the Adios 4 is the same way, but I really preferred the 2.  I would have no injury concerns about racing a marathon in the Adios 3, I just don't like it as much since it's more flexible.

                             

                            ***my private and perhaps crazy theory about why I really like stiff shoes: my extremely basic understanding of biomechanics is that we flex at two places in our lower extremities when loading the foot and then pushing off - one is the ankle(achilles tendon), the other is the metatarsal joint.  As we flex in those two locations, we also load the soft tissue in those areas, which then rebounds and gives us some bounce.

                             

                            Which is great, except that I have extremely flexible ankles and very long achilles tendons (growing up holding an extreme dorsiflexed position for hours will do that to you).  So I can't really load the achilles since it's too long.  So...having a very stiff shoe that doesn't allow me to flex at the metatarsal joint, like the Adios 2 and the VF4%, gives me something else to load.

                            Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

                             

                            And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

                            darkwave


                            Mother of Cats

                              On another note: Temp and DP of 77 for my run this morning.  Do I get a cookie?

                              Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.

                               

                              And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

                              JMac11


                              Benevolent Leader

                                75+ always gets a cookie. 80+ gets a trophy. Only weather and Andres have a trophy so far this year I think

                                5K: 16:51 (8/19)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:16:21 (3/19)  |  FM: 2:44:43 (4/19) 

                                 

                                Next Race: Suffolk County Half Marathon (10/27/19)