2019 Sub 3 hour marathon thread (Read 674 times)

Elite Jogger

    Slammin - I forgot that you were running London next year....there’s a few bends on the course, but you’re good at running tangents and you’ll be fast enough to follow the blue line without cutting anyone up!  I’ll get the old lady to hire a top interior designer to give the place a makeover and I’ll see if I can get Meghan and Harry to greet you at the airport. 👍

    5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)


      I’ll see if I can get Meghan and Harry to greet you at the airport. 👍


      Sorry Mikkey, Harry is pacing me for my 100 miles race that day...

      paces PRs - 5K - 5:55  /  10K - 6:05  /  HM - 6:14  /  FM - 6:26 per mile

      Elite Jogger


        Sorry Mikkey, Harry is pacing me for my 100 miles race that day...


        Well he’s meant to be an eco warrior now.....but I think he’ll give in to temptation and end up using the Royal helicopter for a large chunk of the race. 😉

        5k - 17:53 (4/19)   10k - 37:53 (11/18)   Half - 1:23:18 (4/19)   Full - 2:50:43 (4/19)


          Nimmals / DW - great races! Congrats!


          weatherboy / JMac - your training weeks look scary - especially the one from JMac - oh my that would kill me after few weeks...


          VF / Next - never tried those shoes - no point to do that yet as I see it - maybe when I have to go to Boston 2021 and CIM before that just to check how they work for me. But until then...


          My last non-training-plan week was good. Played with variety of distances (in the range of 11.30 to 11.31 miles) and paces (8:20 to 9:13 mpm). Next week - first week of the plan, Pfitz 60-84, starts with an off day Smile


          Mon - off

          Tue - 11:30 @ 8:38

          Wed - 11:30 @ 9:13

          Thu - 11:31 @ 9:13

          Fri - 11:31 @ 8:32

          Sat - 11:30 @ 8:50

          Sun - 11:31 @ 8:20


          Total: 67.8 mi

          paces PRs - 5K - 5:55  /  10K - 6:05  /  HM - 6:14  /  FM - 6:26 per mile


          Mother of Cats

            Gonna do another post and vanish - sorry.  The last 8 days have been tied up with 4 separate vet visits, 2 of which were emergencies (cat with a bacterial infection last weekend; and then another cat that ate my headphones cord on the evening of Friday the 13th....)  And yes, everyone is fine right now, though my wallet is a bit lighter.....   This week I'm heading up to JMac/Rovatti land for work (almost certainly won't have time to meet up for a run unfortunately - things are very tightly scheduled).


            My week:


            63 miles, 24 "miles" of pool-running, and 3000 yards of swimming
            M: Yoga and 7 "miles" of pool-running
            T: 12 miles, including a track workout of 4x1200 (splits of 4:30, 4:26, 4:23, 4:20; recoveries of 2:3x-2:4x). Also leg strengthwork and 1250 yards recovery swimming.
            W: 8 miles very easy (8:58), yoga, and then 4 miles very easy (8:43).
            Th: 11 "miles" of pool-running and upperbody weights and core.
            F: 10.5 miles, including a 4 mile tempo in 25:12 (6:25/6:18/6:17/6:12). Followed with leg strengthwork and 1250 yards recovery swimming.
            Sa: 7.5 miles very easy (8:37), upper body strength/core, and 4 miles very easy (8:22) plus drills and uphill strides
            Su: 16 miles, mostly easy, but with 5 miles at marathon effort (averaging 6:58) in the middle. Followed with leg strengthwork, 6 "miles" of pool-running, and 500 yards recovery swimming.


            Cross-posting my narrative from Letsrun…:


            Feel very good and fit overall. I had some concerning stiffness and irritation in my right ankle (Posterior Tib)  during Saturday's run - almost certainly the result of overdoing some rehab exercises (that ankle is my bad one - I have stability problems in it and also a tendency for talocrural impingement) and wearing shoes with too small a toe box.


            Ankle felt fine on Sunday morning when I woke up, but I was still a bit nervous about it - this is the wrong time in a marathon cycle to get injured. So I modified the 16 progressive out-and-back to 12 out-and-back easy ("let's see how this goes"). About 7 miles into that, the ankle felt decent, so I went ahead and did 5 miles at marathon effort. After that, the ankle still felt good, so I went ahead and did another 4 miles easy to get the scheduled mileage in. So that's why the Sunday run is a different format from my norm.


            (I added the hour of pool-running because my coach had dialed back the original 20-22 miles progressive to 16, due to weather - I knew he wouldn't mind if I added some pool-running after to supplement the long run.)

            Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.


            And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.

              Cal: Not much variety in the distance or pace but that's excellent base work prior to your official training.


              DW: Nice week; glad the cats are doing ok. My wife and I joke that we are essentially keeping our vet in business... seems like almost every other week one or more animals needs to go for something routine or something unexpected.


              My week: A bit lower mileage because I was too tired to get up Friday morning to run so only 5 days instead of the usual 6. Very draining week at work, and my body was demanding the rest by the end of the week.


              Weekly Summary
              Monday, Sep 09, 2019 thru Sunday, Sep 15, 2019

              <tfoot> </tfoot>
              Day Miles Pace Description Egain Link
              Tue 10.1 8:27 Morning Run 503 strava
              Wed 10.1 8:47 Morning Run 505 strava
              Thu 11.0 7:49 TM: 10 x 3 min on, 2 min off 0 strava
              Sat 12.2 8:03 Morning Run 657 strava
              Sun 20.5 8:22 Long run 1342 strava
                63.9 8:18   3007  

              2:52:16 (2018)


              Taper Czar

                DW - sad that we can't meet up for a run. Enjoy the running this week though, park is pretty  I was going to try to get down to 5th Ave last week to watch you and nimmals run but something came up and I wasn't able to make it. At some point if you do another NYRR race I promise to come by for support.


                JT - You're getting closer to taper time! How are you feeling about sub 2:50?


                Cal - are you running the actual Pfitz plan? I feel like last year you just ran 100 MPW with no real quality days.


                Me - not much to report as I was still building up mileage. I am so excited to actually get started on Quality days. I have been bothered lately by some weird lung issues. I've noticed it more in the summer months before, and actually really noticed it when I was running down by the river last night, so it might be something related to humidity (which usually is the opposite, i.e. people usually have more lung issues when it's cold out). Anyway, pretty pumped to get started with real marathon training, I think I have a great schedule planned out, now just need to avoid injury!


                Weekly Summary
                Monday, Sep 09, 2019 thru Sunday, Sep 15, 2019

                <tfoot> </tfoot>
                Day Miles Pace Description Link
                Mon 10.9 8:36 Evening Run strava
                Tue 8.9 8:08 Evening Run strava
                Wed 10.8 8:15 Never Forget strava
                Thu 9.1 8:17 Well I'm runnin down the road tryin to loosen my load strava
                Sat 10.9 7:52 Afternoon Run strava
                Sun 17.0 8:08 First time crossing state lines on a run strava
                  67.6 8:13  

                5K: 16:51 (8/19)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:15:28 (3/20)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19) 


                Next Race: Whatever COVID-19 will allow me to run 


                  Cal - Nice week adding base mileage

                  DW - That's a great looking week. Strong tempo!

                  JT - The body only knows stress (running, work, life, whatever). I think it's smart to recognize when an unscheduled day off is needed. Solid week, keeping the 20mi LR train rolling.

                  JMac - Nice week building up as well. I'm impressed you get those LR runs in at the waning hours of the weekend.


                  My week - Really only one quality day coming off the half last weekend. Had 20 w/ 10 at M effort Saturday, and divided that up to a 4-3-2-1 in slightly warm/humid conditions. Tried Maurten for the first time; though slightly sweet I'm a big fan. Less than 2 weeks out from Berlin. Mileage cutting back about 10% this week. Everything feeling good, no niggles to speak off. Too early for accurate forecasting, but this time of year in Germany sees morning temps in the 50s with dewpoint in the 40s.



                  Weekly Summary
                  Monday, Sep 09, 2019 thru Sunday, Sep 15, 2019

                  <tfoot> </tfoot>
                  Day Miles Pace Description Link
                  Tue 6.1 8:53 Recovery 🚂 strava
                  Wed 8.0 7:38 Lincoln Loop strava
                  Thu 10.0 8:08 Death By A Thousand Beads of Sweat strava
                  Fri 6.1 8:56 Friyay Shake strava
                  Sat 20.1 7:32 SLR w/ stuff strava
                  Sun 12.6 8:28 SLR - Taper time! strava
                    62.9 8:06

                  Stotan Disciple

                    Had an amazing weekend as a coach 2 of my girls went 1:23:17 and 1:23:41 in Rock n roll Half marathon this weekend. Did it the hard way too, heat and humidity, no taper, training through the week including 2k Tuesdays and Becks Burn bracket on Thursday.  Earning themselves a 3 min and 5 minute PR respectively. With better weather I'm sure they could have gone 1:21-1:22.  The younger was injured and just recently came back about in late July so excited how much she's improved. We fight constantly because she runs everything at 6:40. getting her to slow down has been the hardest thing. God bless youth I'd be dead with 70-80 mile weeks at 6:40/mi.



                    Last two weeks.

                    Activity Date Description  Time Distance  Elevation
                    Run  Sun, 9/15/2019  13 mi Easy Run In SUNY OW  1:50:49 13.21 mi  466 ft 
                    Run  Sat, 9/14/2019  Morning SCRUM  2:44:44 21.17 mi  1,563 ft 
                    Run  Fri, 9/13/2019  5m easy in the full moon  28:40:00 3.08 mi  0 ft 
                    Run  Fri, 9/13/2019  Missing miles from Friday night Moonlighting run  17:29 2.00 mi  0 ft 
                    Run  Fri, 9/13/2019  8 miles chasing moons  1:12:33 8.60 mi  125 ft 
                    Workout  Thu, 9/12/2019  Deek Quarters at Stotan Pace  1:09:17 8.09 mi  102 ft 
                    Run  Wed, 9/11/2019  Full Moon 14.5 miles Howling good!  2:14:06 14.48 mi  164 ft 
                    Run  Wed, 9/11/2019  Morning Run  1:10:42 7.08 mi  187 ft 
                    Workout  Tue, 9/10/2019  6x 2K workout,  1:17:04 9.71 mi  374 ft 
                    Run  Tue, 9/10/2019  2 mi Warm up  18:00 2.21 mi  0 ft 
                    Run  Mon, 9/9/2019  Afternoon Run  1:42:04 12.08 mi  328 ft 
                    Run  Mon, 9/9/2019  Morning Run  1:08:35 8.00 mi  266 ft 
                          15H 34 M 109.7 mi 3,573 ft
                    Activity Date Description  Time Distance  Elevation
                    Run  Sun, 9/8/2019  Cools down  45:07:00 4.41 mi  118 ft 
                    Race  Sun, 9/8/2019  2019 New Balance 5th Avenue Mile 4:25  4:29 0.99 mi  0 ft 
                    Run  Sun, 9/8/2019  Morning Run  27:37:00 2.73 mi  141 ft 
                    Run  Sat, 9/7/2019  Morning Run  1:15:22 7.72 mi  72 ft 
                    Run  Fri, 9/6/2019  10 Miles Easy with Michele.  1:24:01 10.14 mi  661 ft 
                    Run  Wed, 9/4/2019  Evening Run  11:22 1.30 mi  0 ft 
                    Race  Wed, 9/4/2019  2019 Hola Long Island Mile Track 4:35 1.00 mi  0 ft 
                    Run  Wed, 9/4/2019  Evening Run  18:27 1.83 mi  23 ft 
                    Run  Wed, 9/4/2019  Morning Run  51:19:00 6.01 mi  151 ft 
                    Run  Tue, 9/3/2019  Morning Run  1:41:22 12.05 mi  141 ft 
                    Long Run  Mon, 9/2/2019  16 miles with Jason (17 total)  1:00:28 6.57 mi  46 ft 
                    Long Run  Mon, 9/2/2019  16 Miles with Jason, Franklin, Anthony Diaz  1:30:41 10.57 mi  173 ft 
                          9H 34 M 65.3 mi 1,522 ft

                    Thinking should be done first, before training begins.


                    Stotan Disciple

                      Slammin - I forgot that you were running London next year....there’s a few bends on the course, but you’re good at running tangents and you’ll be fast enough to follow the blue line without cutting anyone up!  I’ll get the old lady to hire a top interior designer to give the place a makeover and I’ll see if I can get Meghan and Harry to greet you at the airport. 👍


                      Mikkey Love it!  That's the kind of hospitality we're sorely lacking on this side of the pond.


                      Cals, Great week you're a stickler for variations I remember when you use to vary 13.10-13.11. I even went out and tried it by the 4th day I was freaking tired. I didn't even make it to 4x. lol I think I turned around at like 3.7 miles on the 4th day.


                      JMAC, Jayluf and JTReeves Nice weeks.

                      I can't get over how identical your mileage totals are, all the J's in the 60's


                      DW Sorry to hear about the Post Tib, take care of it.  That's my GF recurring issue.

                      I use this machine its called a Tibia Dorsi machine she never does but it really helps.

                      My slowest marathon was due to anterior tibial tendenitis in 2017 Boston out for 6 weeks then raced Boston.  I remember DZ and Patrick blowing by me before even mile 13.

                      Thinking should be done first, before training begins.


                        Cal: Nice to hear from you!  Funny thing is that both Jmac and I can attest those weeks are scaled back from what old Jack ususally prescribes in his Q2 or above marathon plans!  Nice week BTW.


                        DW: Sorry to hear about the pets and hope the leg behaves.   Safe travels!


                        JT: Nice week and I feel like actual work can take more out of me than any run usually does.  Regardless nice job getting those miles and especially the LR done.


                        JMac:  Really looking forward to seeing you start your cycle.  Great job with the base these past few weeks.


                        Jay: Solid week especially coming off the HM.  Enjoy the taper time!


                        Nimmals: Great looking weeks yet again.  As mentioned before awesome job on those speedy races!  And yes I'd certainly be dead running that volume at those paces!


                        Me:  Very happy with my week overall and especially please with the 5K race effort I put in on Saturday considering the heat, humidity, and wind from Tropical Storm Humberto.


                        Was eyeing the race for a few days and finally jumped in sort of last minute to see where I was fitness wise heading into another cycle.  Obviously with our heat this was going to be an all "effort" based run and wasn't sure who would show up so figure I would try and place somewhere towards the top of the pack.  Race didn't start until 7:30 so I ran 5 super EZ miles to warm up.  Since we were right along the ocean start temperature was already 84 with a heat index of about 90/91 and winds were gusting out of the northeast at 20-25 mph with the storm just offshore.  Gun went off and I settled into a nice rhythm and noticed my pace was somewhere in the mid 5:20's (it was also downwind) and noticed there was only one guy out ahead of me already.  Rest of the first mile felt controlled and was about 10-15 seconds behind the leader with 2 guys about 4-5 seconds behind me.  Second mile started to hurt as I felt a bit overheated since the wind was still slightly downwind, but after we turned a corner at about mile 1.5 the headwinds really started to kick in.  While this helped ventilate me a bit the effort to maintain pace got even harder, but I somehow clicked off another 5:27 for mile 2.  By this time there was only one guy on my back and I perhaps closed the gap on the leader by a few seconds.  I noticed his form was really sloppy so I figured if I at least maintained pace I could possibly catch him, but that really never happened as every time I would surge a bit he would respond.   Last mile was just about all upwind with the exception of a few turns and the effort got incredibly hard especially when the wind would gust.  To my surprise I was able to still hit a 5:31 in this stretch which was certainly well above the effort level of those first 2 miles.  Turned the corner to the final stretch (which was still upwind) and watched the leader cross the line about 10 seconds ahead of me.  I also had about a 10 second lead on the guy behind me.  Course ended up being about 100 meters long based on lots of observations as I clocked in at 17:14.7 for 3.16/3.17 miles (started my watch a bit late too).  Very happy overall and considering the conditions believe it is probably one of my better executed 5K efforts and hopefully means I'm in at least mid 16 shape with much cooler weather.  Also gives me a decent starting point going into some of these bigger workouts coming up.


                        Rest of the past week was just lots of EZ running with the exception of Wednesday where I knocked out 24 200's.  Forgot how much those hurt (in a good way) after about 14/15 of these!


                        Weekly Summary
                        Monday, Sep 09, 2019 thru Sunday, Sep 15, 2019

                        <tfoot> </tfoot>
                        Day Miles Pace Description Link
                        Mon 10.2 7:56 How I missed running beachside strava
                        Mon 5.2 7:37 Afternoon Miles strava
                        Tue 11.1 7:56 Warm + strides strava
                        Wed 3.0 8:36 Warm up strava
                        Wed 0.5 8:10 Still warming up strava
                        Wed 7.2 7:31 Lots of turnover: 4 X (6 X 200R +200 jg) strava
                        Wed 2.0 8:33 Cool down strava
                        Wed 4.5 8:15 A bit of grass before dinner strava
                        Thu 9.3 8:06 Soreness strava
                        Fri 7.2 7:52 EZ + strides strava
                        Sat 5.0 8:20 Long warm up 💨 strava
                        Sat 3.2 5:27 Turtle Krawl 5K'ish 💨 strava
                        Sat 6.2 7:33 Long c/d with progression to M strava
                        Sun 6.5 8:15 Back over 80 strava
                          81.1 7:53    

                        5K: 16:15 (3/20)  |  10K: 33:40 (4/20)  |  HM: 1:15:53 (12/19)  |  FM: 2:40:30 (1/20)


                          sorry folks, really did plan on contributing again but I've been busy getting operations on my finger after an annoying running fall. it has wiped out most of my upcoming runs so i'll get back on here in a month or so.

                          JMac - the review of my enire year's racing is that i managed a good 10 mile in spring and another a couple of weeks ago but everything else has been average.


                          gory finger picture available on request.

                          Upcoming; 14th Sep Scottish veterans XC trials, 289th Sep Great Scottish Run 1/2, 12th October TAMA half marathon, 27th October Leeds Abbey dash 10k


                          Taper Czar

                            Nimmals - getting people to slow down on easy runs I think is your MO! One question for you on easy running since you are the leader of it: how do you feel about what the pace should be during a workout like a tempo-long-tempo, maybe something like 2T + 10E + 2T? Do you want to keep the pace up during that Easy portion, or can it be slow like every other easy run? Also, your mention of tibial tendinitis gave me bad reminders of my winter. It's a real bitch of an injury.


                            Weather - I feel like you always perform very well in 5Ks even though your training is so marathon focused. It may be something to consider, skipping a cycle and just hammering 5K style workouts, keeping your mileage to only 60ish miles per week. I think there's a good chance that on a good weather day you could drop a 15:XX.


                            Also, I'm such a Daniels fanboy that I just bought his 2nd edition of his book used for like $5. I had to see what these "Training Plan A" and "Elite" plans were all about.


                            Jay - are you racing Berlin? Your taper seems less than most would.


                            Finbad - pics please 

                            5K: 16:51 (8/19)  |  10K: 34:49 (10/19)  |  HM: 1:15:28 (3/20)  |  FM: 2:36:31 (12/19) 


                            Next Race: Whatever COVID-19 will allow me to run 


                              Yep - Plan is to race it. With volume on the lower side and since I only have brief blocks of marathon specificity (usually less than 6 weeks), there really isn't a need for an extended taper. Technically speaking it's probably only week of the race where I'm tapering.




                              Jay - are you racing Berlin? Your taper seems less than most would.



                                JMac: I'd be curious to hear what Nimmals might consider EZ pace outside of those tempo portions as well?  Thinking of a a simple 20 minute tempo myself later this week, but combining within my LR after lots of EZ miles.

                                5K: 16:15 (3/20)  |  10K: 33:40 (4/20)  |  HM: 1:15:53 (12/19)  |  FM: 2:40:30 (1/20)