Forums >Racing>Sub 1:30 Half Marathon in 2018
Thanks Watson! Now if I had been the lucky one to run the 15k it would have been even better
CK - Great 15k and nice even splits!
Mick - Yes, that's what JD calls them, and he usually sticks with that pace and breaks the workouts up into cruise intervals if he wants you to spend more time at that effort. Other programs adjust the longer tempo efforts by reducing the pace a bit to get to the right effort level, and by my experience the end of the workout feels very similar in intensity that way (and usually with very similar HR).
Mark - I guess you should update my goal race on the 25th to be the Oakland Marathon, official goal 3:25. Not sure if that goal is soft or not but at the moment it seems about right. I might adjust it a bit after Wednesday, we'll see.
5k: 20:32 (1/17) | HM: 1:34:37 (2/18) | FM: 3:31:37 (3/18)
Getting back into it
RIP Milkman
Rune: yes this is where I mostly get confused. Daniels calls the tempos something that happens at your Lactate Threshold pace which for me is hard effort vs the somewhat manageable MP. But yes if you run 10 miles at that pace its still a hard workout. I just don't consider JDs plans really hard (the book version at least). The hm one I am following is manageable and I only got injured because I included a tempo workout every weekend with my ironman buddy on sundays. Big mistake that I am still paying for albeit much less now than 4 months ago (patella tendonosis).
I don't find his HM plan particularly difficult either at low mileage. His marathon plan, on the other hand, is VERY difficult. It's like the HM plan, except instead of just doing 2 or 3x2T workouts, he'll have you run 6 miles before starting them. I think if you're only running 30 miles per week let's say, it's hard to get a great cruise interval workout in. It's much better to just run 3 miles straight at T then 3x1T since he caps you at 10% of total mileage for T workouts. It makes a lot more sense when you're running 50+.
5K: 16:37 (11/20) | 10K: 34:49 (10/19) | HM: 1:14:57 (5/22) | FM: 2:36:31 (12/19)
JMac - Thanks for writing this, because it made me take a look at the program I had purchased for Amsterdam in October. I didn't find any of the staple hard workouts from Jack's programs in mine, and when I looked at it the program is basically the same 4 weeks repeated 6 times, with some increase in length over time . No other periodization is incorporated in the program. I feel like that's not what I paid for so I wrote them back and told them to take a look at it and revise or give me my money back! The very specific reason I wanted to do a long program was to get a very clear and good base-building period setting me up well for a speed period that would eventually lead into marathon-specific workouts towards the end. I got really grumpy realizing this now so they better have a good answer for me when they write me back.
Well, I think his plan has a bit more periodization than that. For Phase I, he doesn't have any sort fast running beyond strides. Phase II has a lot of R pace running, but no I Pace. Phase III is the hardest, because that's where he introduces I pace work. Then, phase IV is where it should all come together. The one thing he does throughout is T pace work though, which makes sense to me.
However, I'd say that 24 weeks of his program would be incredibly boring. He recommends a minimum of 4 weeks in each phase, and that's generally what I do (12 weeks for II-IV, which is a good length for HM training since phase I is just base building).
Yes, just looked up the specifics and he has his 4 periods as you described. Problem is, in the program I just got there is none of that. Just a 4 week cycle repeated 6 times. So yes, I told them to get back to me with a proper program.
Maybe the long program will be boring, but so be it. I wanted to try a 24-week program at least once to see how things would work out when I allowed myself the full recommended 6 weeks for each cycle. It will be interested to see what they have to say when they respond.
JMac, Rune - races added. Blair had originally suggested adding non-HM races, at the time I thought maybe we just stick with HMs given the nature of the thread, but there seems to be a fair bit of interest in including all races and the admin involved is negligible so hey let's include anything 10km or above.
Blair - yeah that wind can be brutal and unforgiving. Every now and then I'll get a windy day on the waterfront here and you just have to adjust your expectations even though it's frustrating. I guess the thing I tend to console myself with is that you never know what weather could be like on race day so it's helpful running in different conditions, but to be honest I've still sworn out loud at the wind on more than one occasion.
JMac - nice one on the mileage build!
Jaime - nice RR. Sounds like the wind really made it tricky - the tailwind never feels as strong as you hope it will! Also I wouldn't underestimate the impact of those flooded sections, running with wet heavy shoes can certainly suck up a bit of energy. Overall nice job in what sounds like pretty challenging conditions. Those are the races where you've just got to be a little philosophical and bear in mind that when conditions are sub-optimal, that's normally gonna result in a sub-optimal time as well.
Keen - nice job on the 15km. Those races where you can finish strong are really the most satisfying and the ones that runners respect the most! It looks like a pretty cool course.
3,000m: 9:07.7 (Nov-21) | 5,000m: 15:39 (Dec-19) | 10,000m: 32:34 (Mar-20)
10km: 33:15 (Sep-19) | HM: 1:09:41 (May-21)* | FM: 2:41:41 (Oct-20)
* Net downhill course
Last race: Waterfront HM, 7 Apr, 1:15:48
Up next: Runway5, 4 May
"CONSISTENCY IS KING"
Mick its the same in NZ we dont have a huge track/cross country ethic at highschool. There are some schools that put in more effort but my sons school was pretty non serious about running and thats partly why him training with me for a couple of months enabled him to win his x country. I dont think at 27 I would have been motivated enough to be a runner but at 42 I was. Mid life crisis etc....
Commanderkeen very nice 15k. The comfort in your finish suggests that this in fact could be your half marathon race pace as 15k is about when a half starts to suck donkeys balls.
Bloody hot here. Struggled to run 10kms in 30 C yesterday afternoon but immediately bought some beer for when i got home !
55+ PBs 5k 18:36 June 3rd TT
" If you don't use it you lose it, but if you use it, it wears out.
Somewhere in between is about right "
Keen - sorry, I meant nice 15k to you.
I guess Daniels does what must people does and assumes marathon people are more hard out than half people?
PRs: 5km 18:43 (Dec 2015), 10km 39:59 (Sep 2020), half 1:26:16 (Sep 2016), full 3:09:28 (Jun 2015)
40+ PRs: 5km 19:31 (Oct 2020), 10km 39:59 (Sep 2020), half 1:29:39 (Jun 2018), full 3:13:55 (Sep 2022)
2023 PRs (hope to beat in 2024): 5km 20:34, 10km 41:37, half 1:32:32, full 3:21:05
2024 PRs: 5km 20:25
Kapasan Baba
Hello guy's i am new here.
Go go Racing
Best Regard
HazratDeewana
Hi
Tourism Guider at Kapasan wale baba and Chittoor Dargah in India.
Jmac: I never looked at it this way because I assumed the tempos are a percentage of your total mpw. The more easy miles you run, the longer the tempos you can sustain. But I am planning to run 10 mpw more as compared to the last HM and will see if the longer tempos feel harder. Right now I am still adjusting to the higher base mileage and everything is seni hard...
Rune: let us know if you end up ditching the 24week plan and we can put together a plan based on JD's 3rd edition.
HM: 1:47 (9/20) I FM: 3:53:11 (9/23)
2024 Goals: run a FM & HM + stay healthy!
running metalhead
Sorryfor posting this so late:
Weird week. Temperatures way below 0°C, rather around -10°C. I missed the Q1 session planned mid week and the rest of the trainings (E runs. BUT I did my first ever PODIUM!! Well, kinda, as I went away before anybody told me anything. I was 3rd in my category, Male 45, and 15th of the race. The time was "good" but I could have done better: 1:35:19 My pacing sucks and I went away too fast so that I was almost all the race trying to get on pace.
Weekly SummaryMonday, Feb 26, 2018 thru Sunday, Mar 04, 2018
- Egmond ( 14 januari ) : 1:41:40 (21K)- Vondelparkloop ( 20 januari ) : 0:58.1 (10K but did 13.44!!!)- Twiskemolenloop ( 4 maart ) : 1:35:19 (3th M45!)
- Ekiden Zwolle (10K) ( 25 maart )- Rotterdam Marathon ( 8 april )- Leiden Marathon Halve ( 27 mei )- Marathon Amersfoort ( 10 juni)
Hazrat - introduction please.
Enric - nine half. Yeah, km's 2, 3 and 4 were much too quick.
Piwi - Yes, that's pretty hot weather to run in. Some beers always help though!
Enric - Good work not blowing up completely after that start , I know I would have.
Mick, JMac - After reading a bit about the different JD plans it looks like I somehow got sent a 4-week cycle plan. I still can't imagine going through that 4-week cycle six times though, that can't be a very effective way of training for 24 weeks for a race. Hopefully they will get back to me with a revised plan, if not I have the 2nd edition of JD's book at home and the 3rd one arriving in the mail tomorrow. If I have to build up the plan myself it would be great with some help so I appreciate that offer.
Enric- congrats on the podium finish! And nice job recovering after you went out a bit quick. I went through an unfortunate phase a year or so ago where my first km tended to be the fastest of the race... I am quite glad I stopped doing that.
Hazrat - welcome, please post a bit of an introduction - age, background, running goals (there are some examples at the start of the thread).
Piwi - I know everyone else on the thread thinks its amusing when us NZers complain about our (generally mild and temperate) weather. But I feel a bit vindicated by the news yesterday that it was actually NZ's hottest summer on record in most places, including in Auckland (me), Tauranga (Piwi) and Upper Hutt (Watson).
Hot Weather Complainer
Enric- congrats on the podium finish! And nice job recovering after you went out a bit quick. I went through an unfortunate phase a year or so ago where my first km tended to be the fastest of the race... I am quite glad I stopped doing that. Hazrat - welcome, please post a bit of an introduction - age, background, running goals (there are some examples at the start of the thread). Piwi - I know everyone else on the thread thinks its amusing when us NZers complain about our (generally mild and temperate) weather. But I feel a bit vindicated by the news yesterday that it was actually NZ's hottest summer on record in most places, including in Auckland (me), Tauranga (Piwi) and Upper Hutt (Watson).
I've never really paid attention to my heart rate stats but had a look yesterday and found my 60 minutes with pace sessions average about the same heart rate as a long easy run in hot weather. Obviously that's pretty much as high as the heart rate gets, except races. No wonder I nearly collapsed on Saturday...in nice cool conditions my heart rate on the long runs is about 20bpm slower than the speed sessions which is what I'd expect.
With 4 weeks left to the next race, I think I'm tracking okay especially looking at my last 2 races when for one reason or another, the last 2 months didn't go to plan. The only better build up I've had (fingers crossed it continues of course) was my 2016 ChCh half where I got the PB but that was 9 months of almost perfect training and with working from home during that period, I had a bit more time. I need to get out of the mindset that I need to do that to match the PB - my different workouts at the moment are just as tough as then and my times are similar.
Can you also include my next race on the original post (or do I have more time to do to qualify )
5km: 18:34 11/23 │ 10km: 39:10 8/23 │ HM: 1:26:48 9/23 │ M: 3:34:49 6/23
2024 Races:
Motorway Half Marathon February 25, 2024 1:29:55
Christchurch Half-Marathon April 21, 2024 1:27:34
Selwyn Marathon June 2, 2024
Dunedin Half Marathon September 15, 2024