RunningAHEAD - Topic: Pace accuracy

Mr Inertia

Suspect Zero

posted: 7/1/2008 at 3:07 PM

I've just recently started doing interval training as part of my marathon training (getting ready for number 3). What sort of pace tolerance should I allow myself when doing intervals? At what point does too fast or too slow start to minimize the effect of the workout? For example this morning I did 4 x 800 and I was trying to hit 4:05 per repeat. For the most part I was around 7:51 or so. I know there isn't a concrete answer, I'm just looking for guidlines. On a side note, I'd be curious to know how accurately others can judge their pace for this sort of thing. I'm guessing the elites can nail this sort of thing within a few seconds.

Scout7

posted: 7/1/2008 at 3:15 PM

Too fast, and you won't be able to maintain throughout the workout. Too slow, you don't get the same benefit. That being said, tolerance is going to be highly individual, based on the distance, the quantity, the purpose. I used to be able to judge pace pretty well, especially on a track. Of course, that was when I was on the track team.

jEfFgObLuE

I've got a fever...

posted: 7/1/2008 at 3:18 PM

Quote from Mr Inertia on 7/1/2008 at 3:07 PM:

For example this morning I did 4 x 800 and I was trying to hit 4:05 per repeat. For the most part I was around 7:51 or so.

Was this a typo, or were you really that far off? Surprised

On your deathbed, you won't wish that you'd spent more time at the office. But you will wish that you'd spent more time running. Because if you had, you wouldn't be on your deathbed.

Scout7

posted: 7/1/2008 at 3:25 PM

Quote from jEfFgObLuE on 7/1/2008 at 3:18 PM:

Was this a typo, or were you really that far off?

I think he meant his mile pace was 7:51.

runner92

Just Be

posted: 7/1/2008 at 3:34 PM

For any type of track workout, you want to find a pace that you can hit consistently within a few seconds for each rep, and it should feel pretty easy after the first rep but have you gasping for air and doubting whether you can finish on the last rep. It's a balancing act between pace and recovery time, both of which should be consistent. Recovery time should be 30 seconds to 2 minutes for a solid workout. From my experience 30 seconds to 1 minute recovery between reps is great. If you can't finish the workout at the same pace per rep, slow your overall pace per rep unless your recovery is less than 2 minutes - in that case try increasing recovery time up to a max of 2 minutes. If you aren't feeling like you're going to fall over in pain by the end of the last rep, lower your pace or decrease your recovery time between reps. It'll take a lot of personal trial and error before you'll find your optimal pace/recovery for any given rep quantity and distance combination at the track. When you do find the right combo, you'll know it because it will just feel right.

My Running Log | Blog of Running Lore

Mr Inertia

Suspect Zero

posted: 7/1/2008 at 4:37 PM

Quote from jEfFgObLuE on 7/1/2008 at 3:18 PM:

Was this a typo, or were you really that far off?

Nah, a took a lot of breaks, grabbed some lunch, made some phone calls... Smile

scyooze me - I meant 3:51

JimHowe

posted: 7/2/2008 at 10:57 AM

I like basing workout paces on current race fitness. This means avoiding goal-paced workouts that seem to be so popular. You might be surprised how fit you can get by using this as a guideline. What happens is that you ultimately end up doing your workouts faster, but you don't do so until your race times say you are ready. Of the poplular calculators that provide paces, I like this one: http://runworks.com/calculator.html From my experience it works better to do structured workouts based on specific paces and go more by "feel" on easy days and in races. This doesn't mean that the paces have to be exact, but I think it's good to stay as close to them as possible. If you are using current race fitness as your guideline it probably is going to feel right.

Age 60 plus best times: 5k 19:00, 10k 38:35, 10m 1:05:30, HM 1:24:09, 30k 2:04:33

Hannibal Granite

posted: 7/2/2008 at 1:41 PM
modified: 7/2/2008 at 1:43 PM

Quote from runner92 on 7/1/2008 at 3:34 PM:

For any type of track workout, you want to find a pace that you can hit consistently within a few seconds for each rep, and it should feel pretty easy after the first rep but have you gasping for air and doubting whether you can finish on the last rep It'll take a lot of personal trial and error before you'll find your optimal pace/recovery for any given rep quantity and distance combination at the track. When you do find the right combo, you'll know it because it will just feel right.

I agree you want to find a pace you can hit consistently and the first few reps should feel relatively easy, but I have to disagree about the gasping for air on the last one though. By the last rep you should be feeling tired and it will no doubt be more difficult (percieved effort) to hit your goal time on the last than it was the first, but if you are gasping you're going to fast. If you are doing a pure speed workout with lots and lots of rest, 3x300m @ 400m race pace with 10 minutes rest for example, then you are going to be breathing pretty hard at the end of each one and probably gasping on the last one- but that is a workout suited to a 400m runner not a long or middle distance runner. The only time someone training for a distance race (1-mile or farther) should be gasping for air is maybe at the end of a close race where a full-out sprint to the finish was required.

"You NEED to do this" - Shara

jEfFgObLuE

I've got a fever...

posted: 7/2/2008 at 2:19 PM

Quote from Hannibal Granite on 7/2/2008 at 1:41 PM:

I agree you want to find a pace you can hit consistently and the first few reps should feel relatively easy, but I have to disagree about the gasping for air on the last one though. By the last rep you should be feeling tired and it will no doubt be more difficult (percieved effort) to hit your goal time on the last than it was the first, but if you are gasping you're going to fast.

Agreed. For example, if the workout you're doing is for the purpose of boosting your VO2max, you won't get any more benefit running at faster than vVO2max* then you would running right at vVO2max. The faster pace doesn't give you any additional VO2max benefit, and puts more strain on your body. That being said, you probably do need to dig real deep every now and then during an interval workout so that you're prepared to do it in a race. * vVO2 max is the velocity at 100% VO2max. The fastest pace you can sustain for the duration of a 12-minute all-out run is approximately vVO2max.

On your deathbed, you won't wish that you'd spent more time at the office. But you will wish that you'd spent more time running. Because if you had, you wouldn't be on your deathbed.

ndippon

Non ducor, duco.

posted: 7/2/2008 at 3:05 PM

Im hoping I can ask a question that makes sense here. Here goes. I was supposed to do 2- 1.5 mile intervals today. I didnt reread the section that talked about pace so I figured that for me, I would feel good if I could do em just at a 8mm. (Dont laugh.) I was spent at a mile and a quarter, but had kept pace at that point. The last half mile sucked. Probably didnt help that it was 93 degrees outside. Is a 1.5 mile interval too long for a newbie or am I just a weenie. The plan only calls for 8 X 100s and these. Im trying to keep it simple.

runner92

Just Be

posted: 7/2/2008 at 3:11 PM

Quote from ndippon on 7/2/2008 at 3:05 PM:

Is a 1.5 mile interval too long for a newbie or am I just a weenie. The plan only calls for 8 X 100s and these. Im trying to keep it simple.

Try going just a little bit slower and you should be good.

My Running Log | Blog of Running Lore

ndippon

Non ducor, duco.

posted: 7/2/2008 at 3:14 PM
modified: 7/2/2008 at 3:15 PM

Didn't you just want to say "DUHH." MTA: Dont know why its all fuzzied up in my head. Running is HARD. Tongue

runner92

Just Be

posted: 7/2/2008 at 3:25 PM

Quote from ndippon on 7/2/2008 at 3:14 PM:

Didn't you just want to say "DUHH." MTA: Dont know why its all fuzzied up in my head. Running is HARD.

Hehe. Running is a way of life. Don't be intimidated by it. Just accept that it will take some time to learn and stay open minded but use common sense. Like with anything new, eventually you'll settle in and find a good niche that works for you. Best of luck! Smile

My Running Log | Blog of Running Lore

Tchuck

SMART Approach

posted: 7/3/2008 at 8:30 AM
modified: 7/3/2008 at 8:31 AM

Quote from ndippon on 7/2/2008 at 3:05 PM:

Im hoping I can ask a question that makes sense here. Here goes. I was supposed to do 2- 1.5 mile intervals today. I didnt reread the section that talked about pace so I figured that for me, I would feel good if I could do em just at a 8mm. (Dont laugh.) I was spent at a mile and a quarter, but had kept pace at that point. The last half mile sucked. Probably didnt help that it was 93 degrees outside. Is a 1.5 mile interval too long for a newbie or am I just a weenie. The plan only calls for 8 X 100s and these. Im trying to keep it simple.

Anda, 2 X 1.5 miles would be just fine for tempo pace but not super fast pace. Tempo pace should leave you a bit tired but not fried. You should have absolutely no problems with this work out if fit. If not, you are running too fast or not fit enough. Take your current 5K race pace and run this tempo work out about 35-50 sec slower than 5K race pace. This would be good for you. Do the second rep more at the 35-40 sec slower pace or just run by feel.

Run Coach. Recovery Coach. Founder of SMART Approach Training, Coaching & Recovery

Structured Marathon Adaptive Recovery Training

Safe Muscle Activation Recovery Technique

www.smartapproachtraining.com

ndippon

Non ducor, duco.

posted: 7/3/2008 at 9:01 AM

Thanks TChuck. I left the track because it was so very hot and went to the gym. I ran my second 1.5 mile interval on the treadmill closer to 7...I think it was 7:15ish. I was able to do it on the tmill no problem. Is there that much difference in the tmill from the track? Sorry to OP for the hi-jack.

Pace accuracy (Read 1119 times)