2018 3:20 (and beyond) (Read 582 times)

Keen - Coming over here to respond! It's so dependent on what you want. If you REALLY want to succeed at the marathon and are willing to give it your all, you should be doing serious base building. That would require you to be running 80-100 MPW given where you are at of almost nothing but easy running with a tempo mixed in here and there. But it requires serious dedication. If you're looking to just continue at your current mileage of around 70, I would still limit quality work as much possible. Tempo runs are about the most you should do, and an occasional race if you feel like it. In Daniels terms, I and R pace should be gone, and no cruise intervals. Just throw a 20 minute tempo in (or 60 if you're feeling adventurous) once every week or two, and that's it.

Keen If it was me, and I was smart and had started training in January instead of cramming everything into 5 months which scares the S-H-I-T- out of me, I'd keep doing what you were doing. Keeping those threshold runs and speed work going. Maybe even start back over at 400m repeats up to 1,200m repeats along with some marathon paced (scariest part to  me right now) runs in there. You could also do the JD Blue plan which seems to be around 50 miles a week depending on how long you go on weekends.

For real though, the thought of running fast scares me. Plus I started this morning off on the wrong foot so it's probably going to be a bad lunch run. Plus it's getting hot. Listening to Pantera isn't helping improve my mood either. I can't imagine why.

Attitude adjusted. Apparently 7:20/mi pace is what I need when I'm just upset over EVERYTHING in my day. Too slow to call it a tempo run, Too fast for "marathon" pace, too little confidence boosting aiming for 42:30 Sunday. I don't know what to make of it other than it's over and I feel better.

Confidence builder: My PR is a 3:12 marathon. If I was in that shape at 175 lbs (kind of my current weight) but dropped to 168 lbs I'd be under 3:09. 161 lbs is 3:02. I guess losing weight should be an option.

Wahoo! Thanks for all the replies so far, keep 'em coming. I think I'll be able to get 9.3-10 or so miles during weekdays, with a good possibility of short (3-4 mi) doubles 2-3 days per week. Then maybe 14+ miles on a weekend day so long as DD1's soccer games allow. So ~70/wk could be doable. That seems like a big number now that I type it out; it seemed smaller adding that up in my head.

JMac - Thanks for wandering over here. Sub-90 has been really quiet today! Tempo's I can do - I love those. ~60 minutes for a tempo is about M pace, so about what I did Monday. DD1's soccer schedule over the next few weeks conflicts with a couple 5k's I was planning on, but there's a 5k/HM the first Saturday in June I'm looking at now.

Dad - Hill sprints as in 5k effort (or harder)? Some longer M-effort ones if I can find a suitable hill? Or more of a "just do what you can" sort of thing? Ok, scratch most of this.. You did say "all out", but I'm still curious about longer, lower intensity efforts. 

Brew - I still have a bit of a fear of running fast, but having specific paces for different workouts and estimates for different race lengths helped.
Glad you got things worked out. That PR is a world ahead of mine, and you were heavier for yours than I was for mine, ergo...

Oregon - The 20 is mostly because of this race's proximity to the OKC marathon (usually 3-5 weeks prior), the .6 is just a leftover because the course skips and out-and-back that makes up the missing distance for the full. I just checked the past few years and there were only a handful of people running between 7/mi and 7:45/mi, with the fastest at 6:46/mi (he won by ~25 minutes!). Considering that I know at least one of the 7x runners is a sub-3M/1:21HM guy this screams "training run" to me.
It must be difficult getting in runs with the other half out of town. I doubt I could manage it. How old are your kiddos again?

 

Hmm, special Georgetown math?

Um....yeah, with a SMAX bent.

 

just curious. What is the injury prevention stuff?

Well...first of all, it's better described as "injury prevention and leg strengthwork" but I'm sometimes too lazy to write it all out.

I have several different exercises that I do, depending on what is open.  The mainstays are:

• Loading up a barbell in the power cage and doing lunges forward and back, trying to fire the glutes rather than the hamstrings.  I load the bar up to a point where 5 reps is challenging.
• step-ups onto a stool.  I vary the height of the stool, and also sometimes carry weights in my hands or a medicine ball in front.  Focusing on the glutes on this one as well.
• doing side steps using a band to provide resistance, to work my glute medius and glute min.
• laying on my back with my feet on an exercise ball and doing "eccentric hamstring curls."  (basically raise my hips while my knees are bent, then slowly straighten my legs before lowering my butt to the ground.
• eccentric calf dips using a stair step.
• single leg deadlifts using a decently heavy dumbbell in one hand.  I do one set of 5 with the same hand and leg (balance on left, hold weight in left hand), and one set with opposing hand and leg.
• Pistol squats (I use a bench beneath my butt for help.  I haven't worked up to a perfect-all-the-way-down one yet.  Goals)

CK - you have expanded my little world with the brackets idea.  (though at first I misunderstood what you were referencing and wondered why we were discussing college basketball)

As for what to do before a marathon training cycle - you've gotten a bunch of different ideas.  I personally think a 18 week cycle is very long, and that "base building" on top of that is a recipe for burnout.  I also think it's best to progressively increase mileage over the years, rather than jumping it up in one condensed block.

I think of increased mileage as a "tree with fruit."  You can only eat so much fruit at once, and if you shake all the fruit off the tree at once by jumping from 70 to 100, that's a lot of fruit wasted.  Better to just shake a bit of fruit at a time.  3 years later, you'll be in much better shape if you progressed from 70 to 80 to 90 to 100 each year than if you jump from 70 to 100 at once.

I jumped up to very high mileage early in my running career - by my third year running I was up to 90+.  And I suspect that's part of why increasing mileage doesn't help me much now.  I got too greedy and shook the tree too hard too soon.

Hi to all others!

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8 very easy to yoga 9:19), yoga, and then 4.5 very easy (9:07) plus drills and strides.

Annapolis and Howard county still do their metrics (well, Howard county seems to have cancelled to last year upon fitrther examination)

My group did one for a few years until the Gwynns Falls trail became unusable.  The latter years they included a half metric option (not sure I approve of that one).

CDR K ~ Work the extremes: 1) as much mileage as you can handle, preferably w/ doubles; don't worry about your pace -- if you naturally progress to near tempo pace, great! if not, NBD and 2) raw speed, hill and flat sprints, all-out, full recovery is ideal; strides probably suffice. You don't need much of this.

Very wise.

Brew -- I think the average elite weighs about 130. You have have a long term goal.

Frustration -- I'm pretty much upset over everything all the time, and if I hadn't taken up running, DW would have dropped me years ago.

CK -- somebody said that hill sprints are like weight lifting using your body. Great for strength and I am guessing for form as well. I have a local hill; hmmm. I also agree that any plan longer than 16 weeks is just too much -- at least for me; you can only take a plan telling you what to do every day for so long, and then you start doing workouts you don't want to do, and then burnout. Base building with enough quality to build strength and form might be a good WTF way to go for a while.