Forums >Racing>2018 3:20 (and beyond)
I agree that an 18 week plan is long and base building on top of that is tough. But that is what worked for me in 2015. From Jan - April I trained for and ran a 10k and a half. Then I wanted to see how I felt with some 60+ mile weeks and how they worked with my schedule.
For the month of May, I basically sampled some of the weeks from the Pfitzinger plan I would eventually start using in July. End of April through May's weeks were 61, 60, 68, 57 (cut back) and 61. I did some of the track, tempo and MP miles in the Pfitz plan. For June, I cut-back on the miles to about 40-50 mpw, but still did some quality.
Sadly I strained my calf running a workout on the Saturday before what should have been week 1. I took the first week off, eased back into the plan on week 2, and was plugged back in on week 3. The 18/70 plan starts with ~55 miles. Having already been there and more in the months prior gave me some confidence that I could do it.
Running 60 - 70+ mpw is definitely tough if you also hold down a full-time job and have a family. Well, I guess it wouldn't be so bad if you could always run 7 minute pace.
Ladies -- are you less likely to buy Nike gear going forward?
m: 2:55:04 | 10k: 37:14 | 50mile: 9:35
Cobra Commander Keen
Brew - Getting in more than 10, especially in the summer when the low is 80 and I have to slow down is difficult without really cutting into my sleep too much. My girls all being out of school for the summer (DW is a teacher) will help some, though. The days I can fit in doubles are because I work from home those days, so I can easily hit the treadmill or road on lunch for a few extra. Technically I could still do that working from the office, but the extra time to change, shower, etc. make that less worth it to me. Also, I have a completely irrational hatred of alliteration.
DWave - I'm glad I can open some doors. Discussing basketball would certainly be out of character for me!Thanks for the input. I think 70 mpw, which is only ~5mpw more than what I did for the half, is doable from both a time and "where I'm at in my running career" perspective. I know that a year or two at 60-70 mpw is going to do me more good than 90-100 mpw for 4 months followed by 4 months of no miles due to burnout or injury. Right now my schedule of having to be back by a certain time in the morning to help my girls all get ready for school keeps me from getting too greedy with mileage.
Ace - That 12 week HM plan was the first formal one I've followed, so I really don't know how I'd react to a longer one. Then again, I was much more motivated during that whole training cycle than I had ever been when making my own plan. Upon further reflection I guess I really should have been asking about workouts to do between plans that would keep me from getting stale on easy runs while still having a general benefit toward the upcoming plan.
FB - I have heard that as well, but haven't done much in the way of hill sprints. I do have a couple good hills in mind, though. Unfortunately the one on the dirt road was recently covered in very coarse gravel (thumb-sized or bigger chunks). Makes it uncomfortable to run on. Now you've got me curious as to what Nike has done.
Appetite weirdness - I wanted to eat just about everything during my taper. It was as if my stomach was trying to sabotage all the work I'd done by adding on extra weight to carry around the course. Post-race, that has completely gone the other way and I'm hardly hungry during the day at all.
DD3 is absolutely a morning girl. I skipped my run this morning because she got up at 5 and wanted to play. Good times. Can't wait until she's big enough to go for a run, though!
5k: 17:58 11/22 │ 10k: 37:55 9/21 │ HM: 1:23:22 4/22 │ M: 2:56:05 12/22
Upcoming Races:
OKC Memorial 5k - April 27
Bun Run 5k - May 4
Dad - Hill sprints as in 5k effort (or harder)? Some longer M-effort ones if I can find a suitable hill? Or more of a "just do what you can" sort of thing? Ok, scratch most of this.. You did say "all out", but I'm still curious about longer, lower intensity efforts.
Hill sprints are waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay faster than 5K effort ... SPRINT (as in "damn, I'm about to get hit by a truck if I don't get out of the way") but only for 8-12 secs.
But again, some good strides (20-30", ideally about mile pace).at the end of 2-3 runs may be a better choice now, esp. if you are new to this and going to build mileage to new levels.
I generally* believe in the broad funnel approach:
very early: endurance side: lots of easy miles (with "short" long runs ... at least 90 min, ideally 2 hours) and speed side: sprints (8-12 secs on hills or ~80m on flat)
early: more miles, including getting used to longer long runs (over two hours at minimum); on the speed side, maybe some longer repeats (150-300m at mile pace), and longer hill repeats, anywhere from 3-8K effort, 90 secs to 3 min. (See how you are lengthening distance, but slowing speed?)
next -- and this should be the heart of your program: introduce some moderate quality into MLRs and LRs, this can be long segments just slower than MP, faster surges, or "tempo" (LT to just slower than MP); on the speed side, I'd hit at least a couple typical "VO2 max" workouts (e.g., 5x1K @ 4K w/ 3' rec) or maybe some "critical velocity" (5x1K @8K w/ 1' rec) or 10K (4x2K @10K w/ 90"-3' rec) and some traditional LT
late: More 'MP' (+ or - 5%) supported by longer, slower tempos (closer to HMP)
*When I say generally, I also don't like losing touch w/ any given pace once you've developed it. So that introduces multi-pace workouts and all the complexities of balancing out your schedule. That's usually where I screw it up!
So, all that said, it really takes a while before these kind of details matter. Mostly, be consistent, stay healthy, slowly build volume (see DkW's post), add in some faster stuff, preferably at a variety of paces.
oregon ~ PJ answered, but yes, Annapolis is one of them. There's also a 25K in W. Md I'd like to do someday; pretty sure I'll PR that one!
pie man
I stumbled on this old Howard County Newsletter searching for old results. Has the metric, a 20k and a 30k! I might vaguely remember that 30k, but I was too young to run it.
Bonus my family's old race is listed in its first year (only was a 10k that year, became a 5M after).
http://www.striders.net/wp-content/uploads/public-archive/newsletter/1984/Footprints_March_1984.pdf
(page 6)
11:11 3,000 (recent)
... and a 30k!
There are like a billion races around here, multiple 20M, 26.2K, HMs, 20K, but not a single damn 30K.
Cool on your family race.
Strict WTF adherent
The latter years they included a half metric option (not sure I approve of that one).
That could be the worst distance ever.
Mother of Cats
I feel like this brings out the best in you. You pick a race you’ve wanted to do and trained for the entire time but ‘last minute’ decided to do. I don’t even think you can back out and do a second race the same weekend per your usual backup. So you’re sticking with the backup being ‘kicking ass’ because there isn’t another option. Also, DAMN you’re doing a lot of marathons. Unfinished business at CIM?
I feel like this brings out the best in you. You pick a race you’ve wanted to do and trained for the entire time but ‘last minute’ decided to do. I don’t even think you can back out and do a second race the same weekend per your usual backup. So you’re sticking with the backup being ‘kicking ass’ because there isn’t another option.
Also, DAMN you’re doing a lot of marathons. Unfinished business at CIM?
Heh. Full disclosure: I've done Grandma's full before. Did it in 2015. And yes, I'm coming back to CIM this year.
Also for Brewing - I think we should denote all paces by emotion, not competitive distance. So blah-pace, content-pace, angry-pace, hangry-pace, etc...
Did I miss something? Not sure what this is referring to?
I have never heard of a 30K race in the wild.
I'm guessing there are no 40Ks....because at that point you might as well just go for the additional 2.2K.
Upperbody strengthwork and core and 10 "miles" pool-running.
Everyone's gotta running blog; I'm the only one with a POOL-RUNNING blog.
And...if you want a running Instagram where all the pictures are of cats, I've got you covered.
Where are you folks that there are no 30k's?
Runners run
I still vote for 0.05K or 0.1K races (not in a track situation).
DC area, for myself. Where do these mythical beasts prosper?
I wouldn't say prosper but we have a few in New England. Stu's 30k in Clinton, MA is pretty famous. I forget how spoiled we are around here sometimes--but they are getting rarer even here.
Pesto: 41mpw sounds good to me! (As in, I hope to be there before long.)
Brew: Having spent some time on (or is it "in") the AlterG, I can vouch for the impact of losing weight, even if it is virtual. It is interesting to feel the difference between 80%, 85%, 90% of your body weight at the push of a button, and how that impacts the stress on your core.
Dwave: Curious...do you have a trainer watching you while you're doing all of that strengthening/prevention stuff? I've found that I tend to not do things correctly - at least this is my impression based on the fact that my PT keeps telling me what I am doing wrong.
Frustration/Anxiety: I wonder how much less stressful this past semester would have been if I had been able to run off all of the s***.
PT approved increasing the body weight to 90% today, which in reality is pretty close to 100% of my body weight when I ran Grandmas in 2014. 50 minutes (5.6M) on the AlterG today, eventually alternating between 70%BW @ 8.0-8.5mph, then 90%BW @ 6.6mph, for 2 minutes at a time. Feels good to get a little "faster" running in again.
Problem Child
Keen Yeah I need to figure out how I'll be able to get 70 following the plan because the weather here is similar (hot all summer long) and waking up early might be the only option. I got to stay home an extra hour Tuesday and help out a little. I told DW not to get use to it because I'm not switching my schedule (7-4, 30 minute commute) to be home later in the morning (jokingly) otherwise she won't get dinner (I start cooking when I get home). I'm sure if I stick with not having (too many) beer at night I'll be able to get out of the house for a 4:30am run. I just need to set something solid. Actually an alarm. Some solutions seem simpler when written.
Dad your advice seems to mirror what I had imagined myself doing this year. It's amazing how different a 2 hour run is from when I thought about it (man that is FOREVER) to when I did it (wasn't that long) but also mentally getting back into being out there for 2 hours.
DWave I think I have a new pace for today.
ace I would think "A" pace would be "Ace Pace" which is WAY faster than anything I can hit. I guess "Attitude pace" is halfway between marathon and half marathon. You know, don't slack off (marathon pace) but at the same time we're not really out here to try super hard for a while (half marathon pace) we just might want to get in more miles up front this week. LOL!
omr Good to know it actually makes a difference. The Lumo Run I have seems like I'd run better if I was lighter and more flexible. How's PT going?
18 week plans....I think it' all I've done. Garmin has a 16 week plan. Hanson's is 18. I guess for me it works but I can't say I've tried anything else.
Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.
VDOT 53.37
5k18:xx | Marathon 2:55:22
As a fat person, I also can vouch. That said, my PRs at every distance were set right around 180 lbs -- never lighter.