2018 3:20 (and beyond) (Read 582 times)

runethechamp


    Nice races Fb and Pesto! FB, your race seems pretty similar to mine, you just held your own a bit better than me at the end.

     

    Jim - That sounds pretty awesome for your running buddy! ANd good to hear you're on your way back

     

    Darkwave - Nice week and very nice tempo!

     

    Brew - Good to hear the baby is feeling better!

     

    I had a week pretty much like I planned it, except I skipped Friday's short run because it was pouring outside. Instead I took the bike out for a good spin this afternoon and got to enjoy everything that comes with that. My goal for this week was 30 miles (ramping up slowly), ended up at 29.2, next week I'm aiming for 40. Also got a fair amount of hills worked into my runs as well.

     

    Weekly Summary
    Monday, Apr 02, 2018 thru Sunday, Apr 08, 2018

    <tfoot> </tfoot>
    Day Miles Pace Duration Description HR Egain Link
    Mon 4.2 10:18 0:43 Evening Run with some hills 126 (66%) 461 strava
    Tue 3.1 10:58 0:34 Evening Run 117 (61%) 331 strava
    Wed 6.3 9:19 0:59 Morning Run 131 (68%) 535 strava
    Thu 4.1 10:11 0:42 Beat most of the rain 128 (67%) 94 strava
    Sat 11.5 9:13 1:45 Hills and random shapes 145 (76%) 1466 strava
      29.2   3:43     2887  

    5k: 20:32 (1/17)  |  HM: 1:34:37 (2/18)  |  FM: 3:31:37 (3/18)

     

    Getting back into it

    Pesto


      Hi everyone, writing from my phone in Paris, so I’ll be short. Thanks for tracking!

       

      So, I ran a 3:01:11 in the end. Since I knew it was going to get quite hot towards the second half, I went out faster looking for a sub-3 with a positive split. Crossed the half around 1:28:30. The second half was a struggle as I was dealing with heat (it was sunny and around 68-69 I believe), some cramps and bad toenails/blisters (my shoes are too small!). But I managed to push through and not fade that much. At km 40, I only needed 2.2 more kms at planned marathon pace to get a sub 3, but just didn’t have it in me.

       

      Overall very happy with the race, I dealt with it mentally much better than in Berlin I think and got a 3:46 PR with a 4 min positive split.

       

      Ireally recommend Paris, the course is extremely beautiful (they say the most beautiful in the world and I can see why) and it’s very well organized. Now, off to eat pastries!

      5K - 18:03 (5.18) | 10K - 37:58 (2.18) | HM - 1:20:45 (9.18) | FM: 2:57:59 (10.18)

      pepperjack


      pie man

        Seems I missed the registration deadline for the downhill mile on Wednesday. Probably still going to go up, though.

         

        CB10 was fun.  A little surprised to see Centro cruising past at mile 2, several groups back from the lead pack.  With him and Meb that's a couple of Olympic medals in the race, which is always fun.  My time was slower than a harder course club challenge in February.  But not terrible considering the whole race felt like mile 16 of a marathon.  At least it didn't feel like mile 24 at any point.  Number 7 for me, so 3 more and I'm lottery exempt.

        11:11 3,000 (recent)

        jaimegu


          Hi, all,

           

          Congrats Pesto, 3h01 is an amazing result and your are getting closer to the sub-3.  ¡Bárbaro!

           

          FB: Nice job on your race.  I wonder if ir was good to follow a faster pacer for some time, or if it was better yo run in a controlled fashion a prevent the fade.

           

          Jim:  Congrats, and happy your legs are better now

           

          Keen: I heard you did very well this weekend. Congrats!

           

          DarkWave: Nice week... your 5K tempo is faster than my PR

           

          RLK/Smax: Thanks for the heat training info... I'm off to sauna  (I hope I don't need that in a week)

           

          OMR: Really happy for you. Hopefully the recovery will be very positive, too.

           

          Me: Will travel on Friday, I hope the jetlag doesn't hit me. This week will be short (40Kms), and next week will be just 42.2Kms

          Weekly Summary
          Monday, Apr 02, 2018 thru Sunday, Apr 08, 2018

          <tfoot> </tfoot>
          Day Miles Pace Description Egain Link
          Wed 6.2 7:41 Quick Run before the down 95 strava
          Fri 9.7 7:17 Skatås take 2. MP and hills 639 strava
          Sat 9.6 7:37 The orange cone season is on... bike paths 498 strava
          Sun 13.3 8:04 He said nature and hills... And he wasn't wrong 1128 strava
            38.8 7:42   2360  

            fb ~ congrats on the BQ.

             

            Pesto ~ Excellent race; sounds way too hot. Congrats.

             

            JimE - Solid job; even better that hips behaved. Does BAA cover any costs when they invite you?

             

            PJ ~ Umm, didn't you just run a marathon? Next year CB10 will be hot (since I plan on running).

             

            Looks like rain in Bora Bora.

             

            My week:

            M) 7.5

            Tu) 7.5

            W) 11.5 w/ 4 sets of hill medley (3 min/90 secs/30 secs)

            Th) 4.5

            F) 8 w/ hill sprints

            Sa) 11.5 w/ 5x1K@ I pace (3 min rec)

            Su) 4.5

            Total: 55

            rlk_117


            Resident Millennial

              pesto- so incredible, congrats!! i like your thought process of "it'll get hot later on so i should just aim for/accept a positive split". that makes a lot of sense. i guess it still takes a lot to keep the pos split within what you intend and not to spiral out of control.

               

              pj- centro was pacing someone, i forget who. he posts a lot of info like that on his instagram.
              which downhill mile? 

              jaime- i hope you don't need it, too! looks like today's weather there would be perfect if it happens next monday - high of 49 and partly sunny

               

              dad- hill medley sounds fun!  are your friday hill sprints similar to just a few strides? otherwise i'd think it affects you ahead of a saturday workout?

              i think i  posted the beginning of my week earlier. the rest of it was...
              th- 6.8mi incl 9x(200m@mile race pace + 200m jog). did 38-40 which is 5:20 pace and under. i find with intervals this short/fast you really can't pace/self-adjust during the interval - just go by effort.
              f- off running, but 90min strength. ideally i'd do the week's big strength training (i do 2 a week- one big, one lighter) with a workout day so that i get a complete day off, but i haven't been able to time that with work/other responsibilities.
              sa- 7.6mi incl 20min@LT tempo on the track. i wore the 4% shoes (a friend lent to me) and even though this was the appropriate pace to test them out, i still didn't realyl like them. i feel like they elongate my stride and lower my cadence (which is already kind of low) and are just so squishy. my foot doesn't feel super stable. anyway, the tempo was 4800m in 20:10 which is ~6:43 pace. was definitely sore from strength the day before and not fresh for the workout. only did it on the track so i had a safe spot for shoes (i switched into the 4% just for the workout part)
              su- slow 8.2mi
              = 48mi or so for the week, and maybe my first time with 3 workouts in a week in awhile. this speed stuff seems to keep me running either 6min pace or below or 9min pace+ - rarely in between.

              _________________________________________________
              mile, 5:26 /5k, 19:34 /10k, 41:00 /13.1, 1:31:49 /26.2, 3:12:58

              OMR


                fb:  Congrats! That's a solid return to the distance!

                Pesto:  Congrats to you as well, that sounded like a pretty good strategy to me!

                Jim:  Well done, hips that aren't barking at you is always good!

                 

                Hey to the rest of you.  Since at least a few of you are tapering for Bluggersville, you probably are looking for a distraction.  So, here's a link to some photos of my surgery.  Jim, I personally don't find them to be gross at all...well, except for the one I included of my leg post-shave.  ;-)

                 

                https://makrunning.wordpress.com/2018/04/09/arthroscopic-partial-medial-meniscectomy-and-chondroplasty/

                 

                Swelling is continuing to diminish, but I decided to stay home today rather than 1) stand in front of a class for several hours, and 2) walk on a fresh blanket of ice and snow, which seems incredibly daunting right now!  While I can walk on it, I'm not supposed to twist or anything, so being on a slippery surface has danger written all over it!  It has been a good spring here to have this procedure done...the longest, coldest winter we've had in quite a while, and another snowstorm potentially arriving this weekend, with several more inches of snow possible.  Hopefully it will warm up right around the time I am ready to get back on the proverbial horse.

                   

                  pj-  which downhill mile? 

                   

                  dad- hill medley sounds fun!  are your friday hill sprints similar to just a few strides? otherwise i'd think it affects you ahead of a saturday workout?

                   

                  It's about 45 min outside Baltimore or an hour north of DC beltway, where I went to college (undergrad); I'll be there.

                   

                  Yes, Brad Hudson (via Canova) hill sprints: 8-12 seconds 98% effort, full recovery. They are different than longer hill repeats -- even very short ones, like 30 secs -- which go beyond neuro-muscular. I only did 4 b/c I hadn't done in a while (I don't like doing when the weather is crappy; too much standing around) and am rebuilding. Hudson actually recommends doing them the day before workouts.

                  pepperjack


                  pie man

                    Marathon was three weeks ago, should be recovering at some point.  Now I have to recover from CB.

                     

                    I think Centro's tweet mentioned both Chris Kwiatkowski (who lives local now) and Matty Jablonski (who is from Maryland but went UO) and was only a few seconds behind.  Damn, that's a lot of fast Poles who are also ex Ducks.

                     

                    edit: instragram not tweet

                    11:11 3,000 (recent)

                    rlk_117


                    Resident Millennial

                      pj- ah, makes sense. the MJ you mention is a local sub-elite here and runs for one of the teams (the closest one to "pro"/true elite) in our racing circuit.

                      _________________________________________________
                      mile, 5:26 /5k, 19:34 /10k, 41:00 /13.1, 1:31:49 /26.2, 3:12:58


                      Speed Surplus

                        OMR - Glad to hear things went well. Hope recovery is swift and you're back at it soon!

                         

                        Pesto - Nice race and congrats on the PR! Sounds way too hot for me. If you're heat sensitive at all, I would think you're ready for sub-3 in better conditions.

                         

                        Jim - Always nice to race hard and not feel like your body is working against you. Solid run.

                         

                        Brew - It's always stressful when kids get sick. And they get sick a lot! Just remember, they're building stronger immune systems for later. Good luck drinking your fridge empty! 

                         

                        Max - Aww, I guess I was the only one who really wanted a 7-hour Burundi racewalk report. Oh well. Hope you heal up quickly!

                         

                        My week:

                         

                        I had to miss Thursday (long meeting at work and two school events in the evening. I ended up doing 5x1 minute jump rope just to do SOMETHING, but man, getting 50+ miles is a big scheduling challenge for me.

                         

                        I got there, but I had to suffer to do it. Ended up doing 11 on Saturday with a reasonably brisk 10 in the dumping rain, which led to a sloggish 15.3 on Sunday. At least the weather was better, but my body was tired. Strangely, my arms and shoulders were more tired and beat-up feeling than my legs.

                         

                        I also tried out a hydration pack for the longer run and decided I don't like it much. I mean, I liked being able to drink Gatorade on demand (this is the first time I've carried fluids in literally a few years), but I think it adds too much weight (almost 4 pounds, and I could easily have filled it with more Gatorade - I ran out at mile 10 or so) and I couldn't get it to stay tightly fastened.

                         

                        Max - Any tips for hydrating in my tunnel marathon? I really don't want to carry water in my hand, but I'm worried that the aid stations won't be sufficient, and I'm wary of the rodeo-like situation when I'm going to be trying to run at 7:15 pace.

                         

                         

                        <tfoot> </tfoot>
                        Day Miles Pace Duration Description HR Egain Link
                        Mon 4.8 8:48 0:42 Treadmill shortchanged me for once 140 (76%) 0 strava
                        Tue 1.1 8:24 0:08 WU 132 (72%) 57 strava
                        Tue 3.0 6:48 0:20 Tempo Tuesday 161 (88%) 20 strava
                        Tue 2.8 8:36 0:24 CD 165 (90%) 153 strava
                        Wed 5.0 8:47 0:44 Easy recovery. Rainy 129 (70%) 124 strava
                        Fri 7.0 8:57 1:02 Treadmillllllllll 136 (74%) 0 strava
                        Sat 10.0 7:53 1:18 Lovely 10 mile swim 143 (78%) 134 strava
                        Sat 1.1 9:32 0:10 CD 136 (74%) 147 strava
                        Sun 15.3 8:39 2:12 Bit of a suffer fest after yesterday's run... 142 (77%) 485 strava
                          50.1 8:28 7:04     1120

                        5:27 / 18:49 / 40:32 / 88:12 / 3:12

                          ... my leg post-shave ...

                           

                          That shyt is going to itch like crazy real soon!!!

                           

                          I actually thought the other stuff was pretty cool.

                          Running Problem


                          Problem Child

                            Pesto NICE! 3:01 is scorching hot fast! Way to plan ahead. I'm sure it helped you execute well.

                             

                            april runners Enjoy the week. While you're turning your miles down I'm going to attempt to turn mine up.

                             

                            sc DW might not approve of the luck you wish towards me emptying the fridge. I DID get pretty much everything I'd think about drinking out and realize I won't be in the "cool kids with cool beer" game any time soon and I'm a LOT relieved.

                             

                            daniels blue plan I think I might go with this for the short term to aim for a 3:05, with fade, in Chicago. So it says 10 minutes E, 8x400 R pace w/400 recovery and 10 min E. The problem is my R pace is calculated to be 6:00/mi. SERIOUSLY?!?! Is this keen was talking about when he said it's hard? That's MUCH faster than my 5k time and I thought THAT was hard.

                             

                            Since I haven't run in 2 weeks, and I have to pace a 1:50 half marathon this weekend I thought I'd try it out. I think I can make it through the race. I'm also seriously wondering about Chicago just because it's 6 months away and I haven't been putting in any work. I need to lose weight, run more, and get my routine down when I get home from work. NeRP gets 4 month shots today so I took it off to be home with him after the appointment. It's 30 minutes to work so there really wouldn't have been much I did today anyways. Tomorrow is going to suck. Oh and there is a trail half marathon I kind of thought I'd do but NO WAY am I going to consider it my goal race. More just seeing how much it really sucks around mile 8.

                            Many of us aren't sure what the hell point you are trying to make and no matter how we guess, it always seems to be something else. Which usually means a person is doing it on purpose.

                            VDOT 53.37 

                            5k18:xx | Marathon 2:55:22

                            runethechamp


                              Brew - I think if you choose a Daniels plan and stick with it you should be in good shape for Chicago. I will be on a 2Q plan starting sometime in June and I'm already nervous about some of the workouts! The R sessions are usually not a problem though. They are fast, but you get a very good recovery in between. I know it says 400 job between the reps, but in Jack's lectures on youtube and in his book he's telling you to take a break of 2-3 times the time it took you to do the rep. If you are anywhere close to 3:05 shape it should be no problem. Looks like RLK had a reps workout last week with 200s instead of 400s.

                               

                              OMR - Love the photos, it's always cool (or scary) to see what goes on inside your body.

                               

                              RLK - Nice tempo and nice pace on your 200 reps.

                               

                              SC - Now I'm starting to wonder how 50 miles a week will work out for me when I get there . With the 2Q plan it seems like I will have a midweek run of 13-15 miles every single week and a weekend run of 15-20, so at least I will get a lot of the mileage there.

                               

                              And good luck to whomever is running in 1 week from today. Looking forward to the tracking and updates.

                              5k: 20:32 (1/17)  |  HM: 1:34:37 (2/18)  |  FM: 3:31:37 (3/18)

                               

                              Getting back into it

                              fb-guy


                                It's a RR! Read at your own peril.

                                 

                                Rome 2018

                                 

                                Pre-Race

                                 

                                I ran an average of 42 with a peak of 56. The cycle was pretty uneventful other than a tight calf that I handled with stair lifts and a tight IT band that I rolled.

                                 

                                My goal was 3:34:59 (BQ-5) ,and my stretch goal was to start with the 3:30 pace group, feel strong, and close in the 3:20s. Looking through my training logs, there wasn’t a comparable cycle in my past, other than my second marathon (9 years ago) when I ran a 3:19 on a low base and 38 miles per week. But I was 9 years younger (and hadn’t had the celiac problem). So another bit of logic was 3:28 (3:19, plus 9 years).

                                 

                                I was still concerned that I would have GI problems, or just get dizzy/lightheaded and crash.

                                 

                                Rome Marathon

                                 

                                The race is about 15,000 people, mostly Italians, but also a really fun mix of other countries (not that many Americans). I saw a Croatian running club with about 20 people taking a group photo with their flag, plus Spanish, French, English, etc., and lots of flags on runner’s shirts, and on the course. The Italians tended to wear “club” race gear, rather than shirts from previous races. I can’t confirm the numbers, but there seemed to be fewer women, as a percentage.

                                 

                                The organization was excellent (it’s the 24th edition), and it’s a round trip, so the logistics really worked. The was a runner entrance behind the Colosseo onto Via Dei Fori Imperiale that runs along side forum that held bag drop, porta-potties, hang out, and the corals. Considering this is Italy, it all went really smoothly, and it was suitably Italian - really loud. Lots of fun. The race goes off in three waves, off-set by 5 minutes. They only accept race results going back two years for seeding, so my pervious 4:09 got me a bib in the 7,000s in the second coral. But the second coral had 3:15 and 3:30 (and slower) pace groups. I was little nervous about congestion at the start, but other than some jostling it was really easy.

                                 

                                The course has lots of turns, in order to hit 500+ historically significant sites (funny), but turns weren’t a factor. There are 4+ miles of cobbles, which were pretty difficult, but also not really a factor. Although DW saw someone fall, hit his face, bleed like hell, get aid, and then get back up and keep running.

                                 

                                If you are looking for Marathon tourism (our hotel had some American runners), I would highly recommend it. I’m sure it isn’t as pretty (or elegant) as Paris (thinking of Pesto), but if you like Italy, with all of its noise, chaos and grit, you’ll like the race.

                                 

                                First quarter

                                 

                                Basically, the start really sucked. I headed off with the 3:30 pacers, and quickly found out that (1) my watch wasn’t accurately tracking the course, and (2) that my HR was higher than I had expected or wanted. It was a huge “oh shit” moment. We passed though the first 5K mat and I saw that my watch was so far off that is wasn’t going to do any good for distance or pace. And the HR monitor locked in after a couple of miles and quickly shot to 135. I had been hoping it would start around 125 and click up about a beat a mile (averaging out hills) into the low 150s for the finish. No such luck.

                                 

                                At that point I’m thinking maybe I should just stop now. When I was in race shape the first half was easy and fun, 13-20 sucked, and you raced home. So I am in complete no man’s land.

                                 

                                Second quarter

                                 

                                I had taken one goo 15 minutes before the start, and was drinking Gatorade at every 5K water station. But not feeling strong or energetic. So I took a second goo and ate a few shotblocks and started to feel a little better. I decided to stick with the 3:30 group, if for no other reason than I wasn’t getting accurate information from my watch. But I knew I could not do 3:30 for the whole race. At mile 12 we ran up the Via Conciliazione (the wide avenue leading up to St. Peter’s) — and someone (Pope?) was giving mass to a huge crowd in the Piazza. Running and the church meet on a Sunday morning. That was memorable. I’m telling myself if my HR hits 145 at any point before the half I need to throttle back. But it stabilizes a little, so I hang with the group. We hit the half at exactly 1:45, and the pacer is waving his arms and giving thumbs up, and everyone is cheering him. But I know it’s going to be hard from here out. It took a lot more than I had hoped/wanted getting to this point.

                                 

                                Third quarter

                                 

                                I consciously let the pace group go and run by feel/HR for a couple miles. I see 143, 142, 143, 143 AHR for four miles (14-17) and don’t give up too much pace (15-20 seconds each), which makes me feel a little better. Somewhere along the way we are running through a real, local neighborhood (it must have connected a couple of the monuments on the NW side of the city) with very little crowd support, and on the second floor of a basic, concrete apartment block a grandmother is looking down on us through a small window making it clear that she thinks we’re all crazy. A couple of guys I was running next to were calling out, trying to get her to smile, but no luck. I got from the half to 20 without a huge problem — giving up time, but not blowing up.

                                 

                                Still drinking gatorade and eating gels, Plus, they have 4 sponge stations in the second half, so I dunk myself with water (three full sponges) at each station to stay cool. I was still wet at the end of race.

                                 

                                Also, Rome is full of baroque churches that all look the same, and there are three papal basilicas (huge) that all look the same - at least when I’m running. So, we keep running past churches and I don’t have a clue where the hell I am.

                                 

                                Four quarter

                                 

                                I start trying to figure you how long this race is going to be. My watch ended up counting over 27 miles, and it was getting further out of line at each of the 5k marker; so I couldn’t do the math for how out of whack it was. I gave up on that and started doing the calculations in kilometers using my watch for overall time and the markers at every 5km — when it struck me. I didn’t know how long the f-ing race was in kilometers. It’s 42 point something, but I didn’t know what the point something was. .1, .9, .5? Wft.

                                 

                                Do you how long a marathon is in KM?

                                 

                                Now I have no idea how much longer I have to run, or what pace I need to run to break 3:35. Fun. A few times I do the math in miles using my watch, and sometimes it looks good and sometimes it looks bad. I think seriously about throwing in the towel and just running 9’s going in, and then living with the result. My stomach is sour, so more gels are off the table.

                                 

                                That, and I’m basically tired, and couldn’t pick it up even it I wanted to.

                                 

                                Lot’s of carnage on the last 10K. Three guys down with ambulances, and lots of walkers and stretchers. It’s hot (68 by the end), and I think it really got to a lot of people. Still, there were a few clouds, and lots of shade from the narrow streets and taller, old buildings.

                                 

                                There is a long-ish uphill stretch in a tunnel at mile 25 (at least it’s dark and cool). It’s a lot tougher than I was expecting; HR shoots up, and I have a serious “well crap” moment. The last water station was giving out larger bottles of water, so I take a few sips and pour the rest of it on my head and back, which really worked.

                                 

                                We peak the hill, and its down hill to the finish, but I still don’t know how much is left. We turn left, and I hope to see the finish. No. We turn right and I hope to see the finish. F-no. Finally, we turn left again and I can see it. I have about 50 seconds left on the clock, and it’s far, and we’re running on cobbles. Really? I have to sprint to the finish and just beat 3:35. HR explodes. With the hill, the last mile was the slowest of the day, but my finish was OK.

                                 

                                It’s a beautiful day, and I meet DW and my family outside the finish area, and we go have a really good lunch. That’s Italy.

                                 

                                What’s next

                                 

                                I’m trying to make sense of where my fitness, energy, health, etc, lie. I’m really happy to get back into Boston and to run a “normal” race without any issues. Yay. Can I get back into serious race shape over the next year or two? I really don’t know. I still can’t figure out if I have slowed down (40 minutes) primarily because of the celiac, or because I have run fewer miles; and if the celiac still has a role in my current fitness, and if it is — is it going to go away over time. Or whether I can add miles and pace, and start improving race times again. I really have no idea.

                                 

                                But, I believe that I have passed the point of thinking about my running and fitness as a proxy for overall health, illness and mortality. It’s going to be great putting all of that behind me (not being able to run and being in the medical system for a couple of years truly sucked), and if I am slowing down just because I’m getting older, I am really OK with that.

                                 

                                Last note. While my “energy system” could only give me the strength to run 3:34 today, the rest of my body seems to be fine. I wasn’t sore today, and ran a comfy 4@9. I think I’m built to go faster.

                                 

                                Who knows what is going to happen next. But then as the say (at least in team sports) — “that’s why you play the games.” Whatever is going to happen is going to happen. I feel so lucky to be here. Hopefully I can keep it all together for Boston 2019.

                                m: 2:55:04 | 10k: 37:14 | 50mile: 9:35