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Beginner Q: spread distance over more runs (Read 280 times)

    Hi,

     

    I've been running for 1.5 years. I've noticed that I cannot progress running 2-3 times a week. I run 3km on average and I want to be able to run 5km with ease.

     

    From my experience in pull-up progression, doing 1-3 sets every day with a good pause in between them (or 1 set multiple times a day) but keeping the rep count lower (somewhere at 60% of your maximum rep count) works really well for progression.

     

    So now my idea is this: if I run, say, 3 km 3 times a week, I would be better off running 5 times in a week, 9/5 = 1.8 km each day, increasing weekly distance a little each week. This would 1 - cause less stress each run, 2 - prevent me from regressing before the next run.

     

    Has anyone made a similar switch or can correct me somehow?

    Daydreamer1


      I'm more familiar/comfortable talking in miles but since you framed the question in km's I did some conversions.

       

      Basically what it comes down to is this.  You're not running anywhere near enough miles in a session or on a weekly basis. If I run less than 24 to 32 km a week I never improve.  Quite simply you are not stressing your body enough to cause it to adapt. 3 km is barely past the mark of getting warmed up.

       

      I would suggest that you plan to run at least 4 times a week with a total of around 30-35 km per week. Runs of that length will stress your body sufficiently to cause it to adapt.  There is no way you will become comfortable running 5 km by just running 3 km.

       

      Remember the old saying:  If you want to run fast, train fast. If you want to run long, train long. While those may not be the exact words (I've seen them in numerous forms) the concept holds true. Train the way you want to run so increase your miles.

       

      And remember. Strength training and run training are only related in that they are both exercise. One stresses the anaerobic and the other the aerobic.  You can't compare the two like you might running and bicycling, or pull-ups and bench presses.

        So beginners who want to train to be able to run for 5 kilometers should start off by running 30-35 km each week (where every run is way over 5 km).

         

        Anyone else has an idea on how to PROGRESS to a greater weekly distance?


        MoBramExam

          How long does it normally take you to run your 3K daily runs?  Do you run them at an "all out" effort?

           



          beat


          Break on through

            If you're running  2 to 3 x 3Km each week, and you want to work up to 5Km, add another day each week for a few weeks. Then add another day, until you're running consistently 5 days each week.  I don't think you need to limit yourself to 9Km per week...  or 3Km per run.  If you aren't able to run more than 3 km, slow down, and you'll be able to extend the distance of a run.

            "Not to touch the Earth, not to see the Sun, nothing left to do but run, run, run..."

              How long does it normally take you to run your 3K daily runs?  Do you run them at an "all out" effort?

               

              18 mins (pace usually is 6 min / km). No, I run comfortable pace - more like jogging rather than sprinting if that's what you are asking. I could possibly run 5 km - I tried - but ended up with some micro injury that would take a few days to go away.


              MoBramExam

                 

                18 mins (pace usually is 6 min / km). No, I run comfortable pace - more like jogging rather than sprinting if that's what you are asking. I could possibly run 5 km - I tried - but ended up with some micro injury that would take a few days to go away.

                 

                Several ways to reach your goal, this is just one suggestion.  You will probably get others just as good or better.

                 

                Add a fourth day of running now.  Run for 15:00 minutes on three of those days.  On the fourth day run for 24:00 minutes (like beat suggested, slow down if you need to extend the run).

                 

                Add a minute to each run every week.

                 

                If / when you feel comfortable with adding a 5th day, start with 12:00 minutes on that extra day.

                 

                Should get you safely to 5K and you'll figure a lot of other things out that will help you progress going forward.

                 



                  Thanks MoBramExam and beat.

                   

                  However adding a day just like that doesn't seem right. It's a 33% jump from the baseline weekly distance. You cannot go over 10%. Running for 15 minutes 4 days in a week would seem more right as it's just a 10% increase. As fit I'll be adding 10% to the previous week's kilometrage.

                   

                  Thanks for the answers!

                  Daydreamer1


                    So beginners who want to train to be able to run for 5 kilometers should start off by running 30-35 km each week (where every run is way over 5 km).

                     

                    Anyone else has an idea on how to PROGRESS to a greater weekly distance?

                     

                    Running for the past 1.5 years does not really put you in a total beginner category, rather a failure to progress. The only way to progress is to stress your current ability. That concept holds true for almost all things in life for athletics to education and many other things. There are no easy shortcuts in life. If you want to run 5k with  ease you are at some point in time going to have to run more than 5k in training.

                     

                    The one thing I should have put in was if you can't run the entire distance at first, take some walk breaks.  There are actually training programs that incorporate walk breaks.

                     

                    I started dedicated running in 2011. Before that most of my runs were only 4.5 miles. I wanted to do a 25k trail race. I quickly found out that if if I wanted to run farther I was going to have to train that way and at times it would hurt.

                     

                    It seems as if your way of doing things has not resulted in any gains so you asked for advice. I answered with a option.  Many people have tried  doing something similar and succeeded.

                      If you want to get better at running, you will need to run five to seven days per week.  All of that running should be aerobic, you should be able to carry on a conversation while running.  There is no rule that you can only increase total distance a certain percentage per week, nor is there any rule about how far you have to run.

                       

                      Just go run.

                       

                      Let your body tell you if you are doing too much, or if you can do more.  It took me two years to get fit enough to maintain 30 miles (48 km) per week.  A friend thought he would try running and ran that far his first week.

                       

                      After you are running more days per week,  make one or two of your runs longer than the others.  Soon you will find that you are able to run farther each day.  At some point, a 3 mile (5 km) run will be a long run.  That point will be a few weeks after you are running at least 10 miles (16 km) per week.  Some time after that, a 3 mile run will be easy.

                        Running for the past 1.5 years does not really put you in a total beginner category, rather a failure to progress. The only way to progress is to stress your current ability. That concept holds true for almost all things in life for athletics to education and many other things. There are no easy shortcuts in life. If you want to run 5k with  ease you are at some point in time going to have to run more than 5k in training.

                         

                        The one thing I should have put in was if you can't run the entire distance at first, take some walk breaks.  There are actually training programs that incorporate walk breaks.

                         

                        I started dedicated running in 2011. Before that most of my runs were only 4.5 miles. I wanted to do a 25k trail race. I quickly found out that if if I wanted to run farther I was going to have to train that way and at times it would hurt.

                         

                        It seems as if your way of doing things has not resulted in any gains so you asked for advice. I answered with a option.  Many people have tried  doing something similar and succeeded.

                         

                        Thanks for your input. What you are talking about is progressive overload which I am familiar with and I know how it works. However my question was about the way of doing it. I wrote about the 10% increase above.

                         

                        P.S. marathoners do not run marathons in training, do they? Smile So your idea of training beyond your goal isn't really true.

                          If you want to get better at running, you will need to run five to seven days per week.  All of that running should be aerobic, you should be able to carry on a conversation while running.  There is no rule that you can only increase total distance a certain percentage per week, nor is there any rule about how far you have to run.

                           

                          Just go run.

                           

                          Let your body tell you if you are doing too much, or if you can do more.  It took me two years to get fit enough to maintain 30 miles (48 km) per week.  A friend thought he would try running and ran that far his first week.

                           

                          After you are running more days per week,  make one or two of your runs longer than the others.  Soon you will find that you are able to run farther each day.  At some point, a 3 mile (5 km) run will be a long run.  That point will be a few weeks after you are running at least 10 miles (16 km) per week.  Some time after that, a 3 mile run will be easy.

                           

                          Thanks for this. It's really really in my plans to run 5-6 days per week. Thanks for sharing the experience.

                          keeponrunning


                             

                            Thanks for your input. What you are talking about is progressive overload which I am familiar with and I know how it works. However my question was about the way of doing it. I wrote about the 10% increase above.

                             

                            P.S. marathoners do not run marathons in training, do they? Smile So your idea of training beyond your goal isn't really true.

                             

                            Planning to run 5km is in a completely different category than running a marathon.  To run 5km comfortably, you'll have to go over that distance in training.

                            The way basic marathon training works is that you train hard enough during the week that the 3 hour long run you do feels more like the last part of a marathon rather than the first. Training for a 5k doesn't really work that way since you aren't going out for nearly as long.  If you do, say, 45 minutes for a long run in training for a 5k, you're probably going to have a decent run.  If you go much over the 3 hour mark in training for a marathon, you'll be too exhausted to hit your hard workouts hard.

                            As for increasing mileage, listen to the other runners who have posted.  They know what they're doing for the most part.  As a side note, I never followed the 10% rule when I was starting-- I feel like that rule applies much more once you hit 25-30km/week.

                            Sulphur Springs 50km-- Ancaster, ON-- May 28, 2022

                            Tally in the Valley 12 hours-- Dundas, ON -- July 30, 2022 (Support SickKids Toronto)

                            Stokely Creek-- 56km-- Sault Ste. Marie, ON-- Sept. 24, 2022

                             

                             

                            Daydreamer1


                               

                              Thanks for your input. What you are talking about is progressive overload which I am familiar with and I know how it works. However my question was about the way of doing it. I wrote about the 10% increase above.

                               

                              P.S. marathoners do not run marathons in training, do they? Smile So your idea of training beyond your goal isn't really true.

                               

                              I think keeponrunning put it well in his post about the difference in 5k training and marathon training so I won't elaborate anymore on that.

                               

                              What I will say is that it is actually very common for me to put in 22-25 mile long runs in my marathon training.  If possible I like to precede or follow that with a 10-13 miler or a hard effort on the bike.  Often work issues get in the way and I can't do that but I've had good success with that when I can do it. But again talking marathon or ultra training along side 5k training is so different that it's barely apples to oranges.

                                Thanks MoBramExam and beat.

                                 

                                However adding a day just like that doesn't seem right. It's a 33% jump from the baseline weekly distance. You cannot go over 10%. Running for 15 minutes 4 days in a week would seem more right as it's just a 10% increase. As fit I'll be adding 10% to the previous week's kilometrage.

                                 

                                Thanks for the answers!

                                 

                                I think the point MoBramExam was trying to get at is having one day that is longer than all of the others. For example, you say it takes you 18 minutes to complete 3km and you run 3 times per week. That equates to 54 minutes of running per week. Instead of running 18 minutes 3 times per week, you could run 18 minutes 2 times per week and run 24 minutes 1 time per week. That would give you a total of 60 minutes of running that week. Then the following week you could progress to 18 minutes 2 times per week and one run of 30 minutes. And so on, and so on.

                                 

                                Or if you wanted to run 4x per week. Start with 3 runs at 14 minutes and then one run at 18 minutes.

                                 

                                You can vary the times of the other runs  during the week (say 1 run 10 minutes, 2 runs for 12 minutes, 1 run at 18 minutes, etc.), but you should be doing one long run per week that is longer than all of your other runs for that week. This way you are only progressing 10% each week, but you are steadily increasing your endurance.

                                 

                                I hope this helps Smile

                                -Pain is temporary, internet results last forever!

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