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Five cross country practices per week - my 'new to running' kids cry 'too much' - what should I advise them to do? (Read 1246 times)

    OK, I'd like some advice or feedback. Especially from former (or current) high school cross country runners. My two sons joined their high school's cross country team for the first time this year. One is a junior, the other is a freshman. Both are involved in lots of other activities and like to do things after school with their friends like any typical high school kid. Neither has run for running's sake before, although the junior is a soccer player and is in pretty good shape. The cross country coach suggested they run during the summer, I think 20-30 minutes per day, 3 or 4 times per week. They both ran during the summer, but not as much as recommended. Anyway, they started cross country practice last week. They practice 5 times per week, so it has been quite a step jump increase in training for both of them. This week, they now are saying that they'd like to skip one practice a week. They implied that 'everyone does it' and that they were going to do this without consulting the coach. When I pressed them further, it turned out it wasn't because the training was too hard on them. Rather, they just want to have some time to hang out with their friends after school every once in a while (their best friends are not on the cross country team). As of now, school ends at 3:30 and practice starts at 5 and ends at 6:30. So it does really take up their after school time. Anyway, I only started running 2 years, when I was 42. So I have no experience with cross country teams or what the expectations are. I can understand where my kids are coming from, but my guess is the coach would not agree that "everyone skips practice" about once per week just because they feel like it. Certainly not without first discussing it with the coach and supplying a reasonable rationale for skipping practice. The only reasonable rationale I can think of is that if the step jump increase in training really is too hard for them, given their lack of experience, then maybe it is reasonable to discuss with the coach the possibility of a more gentle ramp up in training. I really want them to keep up with running, but I don't want them to 'shirk' their responsibilities to their new team or coach either. Any advice or thoughts on how to negotiate this little situation? Thanks in advance for your thoughts!
      As of now, school ends at 3:30 and practice starts at 5 and ends at 6:30. So it does really take up their after school time.
      What are they doing between 3:30 and 5pm?
        I wasn't a cross country runner in high school, but I played three sports a year (tennis, basketball, football). My sister ran CC in HS and college.. The only reason why we would have a late practice for any of my sports is available facilities. Otherwise practice starts right after school. I would guess it would be fine to skip the 5-6:30 practice (whatever practice actually is?) if they ran from 3:30 to 5:00 to keep their mileage up. Maybe skip the 5-6:30pm easy days and run on their own, maybe even in the morning before school. But go to practice on hard days (which are probably speed workouts).
          When I was in high school (and still at the local school today), if you miss a practice without a valid parent and/or doctor's excuse, you are out for a meet; if it happens often, you're off the team. I'd check on that policy before allowing them to skip practice... It seems really silly that practice is from 5 - 6:30. Our school did morning practices instead of after school ones if there was a conflict in practice location (like the use of the track), but the cross country team almost always ran on the city sidewalks or on country roads, so there were no conflicts! Not to mention that it seems to invite kids to possibly get into trouble in the time between 3:30 and 5pm (not that all kids would get into trouble)...

          "Life is short... running makes it seem longer." - Baron Hansen

          mikeymike


            Damn, kids are wimps today. It's official, I'm a grumpy old man.

            Runners run


            A Saucy Wench

              team practice is every day. if you are on the team, you practice. If you dont want to practice, then dont be on the team. Stuff isnt usually negotiable unless you have a conflict like another school activity (band, a second sport) or something else that is negotiated and agreed on with the coach. Hanging out with friends...not usually in there.

              I have become Death, the destroyer of electronic gadgets

               

              "When I got too tired to run anymore I just pretended I wasnt tired and kept running anyway" - dd, age 7

                Having run both cross country and track in high school, I can attest to it being a real commitment. We practiced five nights a week and the occasional morning in cross country. In track, we would go five nights a week and then three optional morning workouts. Almost everyone hit all eight workouts. That being said, it is a commitment they made to their coach, themselves and their teammates. As a teammate, I wouldn't want them there if they were not fully committed. Regardless of their level of skill, we could tolerate our slower team members, but would never tolerate one who didn't give 100%. I'm not sure how I would handle it as a coach. I'd have to speak with them before deciding. As a parent, I would press them on the commitment side of it, especially to their team. I'm sure you have had days when you would have rather gone golfing, but you went to work or some other thing you were committed to. In the end, I would require them to maintain their commitment. I believe I would be doing them a disservice as a parent if I allowed them to back out of something they committed to because it was harder than they thought it be, not as fun as they had hoped, or left less time for "fun" things. At the risk of offending some of the others who have responded, it is irrelevant when practice is.


                Bugs

                  Ennay said it right; work it out with the coach. Going to practice is a privilege.

                  Bugs

                    As a parent, I would press them on the commitment side of it, especially to their team. I'm sure you have had days when you would have rather gone golfing, but you went to work or some other thing you were committed to. In the end, I would require them to maintain their commitment. I believe I would be doing them a disservice as a parent if I allowed them to back out of something they committed to because it was harder than they thought it be, not as fun as they had hoped, or left less time for "fun" things. At the risk of offending some of the others who have responded, it is irrelevant when practice is.
                    While I think it might be odd or inconvenient that practice is at 5pm (see my earlier post), I agree that it is irrelevant. If you're on the team, you practice...every time. As far as the kids saying that "all the other kids are skipping," my parents would have flipped out if I said that! I quickly learned that that excuse would never work.

                    "Life is short... running makes it seem longer." - Baron Hansen

                    Teresadfp


                    One day at a time

                      This is a reply from my 16-year-old son, a junior who started XC preseason yesterday: I would recommend that they go to all of the weekly practices because they made the commitment to train when they joined the team. They should be aware that it will take a little bit more effort to begin the sport since they've never done it before. Part of the excitement of running is realizing what your body can do with some training. It may be that I'm not the typical runner, but when I started, I kept pushing myself even when every easy day felt like a workout. As disheartening as that sounds, my body adjusted after a while and I made varsity cross country my freshman year, so the work did pay off. If the start of the season does feel too difficult, I would probably just slow down on the recovery days in order to keep the easy days easy knowing what I do now, but your sons should make the transition to five days a week because it will better prepare them for races (It is much worse to run a race without quality training and easy recovery days). On my team, people who miss practices without a legitimate reason miss the upcoming race, but the five-day week and the long practice hours are required if you want to be prepared for races. The people who skip practices are usually the people who never really get that much better unless they have massive amounts of natural ability. Even if the people with natural ability do well with apparently no effort, I have found that there is no substitute for consistent training over time. Half the excitement of cross country is knowing that you trained hard and that your effort is going toward something. I'm not saying that a four-day week won't lead to improvement, but highschool coaches will map out an entire training schedule before the actual season, so it really is necessary to attend practice for the full five days if you're interested in gaining the full benefits of that training plan. If the intensity or the distance is the problem with the step jump increase in training, then I have two responses: If the intensity is too great, run slower on the easy days; workouts on the harder days can only get so hard, and the harder they feel, the more strength you will gain from them. This concept is not true on the easy distance days. Faster days are important because the muscles that you use when you're running faster are being exercised, which is good for faster races. However, recovery days are equally important because you can gain strength over a longer distance, which is beneficial to your endurance, but if these days don't feel somewhat easy, then you aren't getting the maximum benefit of the recovery run. If the distances seem impossibly long, then I would look at your current level of fitness and the weekly mileage that your coach recommends. Since your sons are just starting, they shouldn't have to do more than thirty miles per week approximately. The maximum amount of weekly mileage that they were doing before cross country was about sixteen miles (4miles/day, 4 days/week), so in the beginning of training, they probably shouldn't be doing more than thirty miles a week. Since sixteen miles a week is less than the mileage that beginning runners normally do, the preseason workouts with the increased mileage probably would feel too difficult, but if your sons are running less than thirty miles a week for the first week or so of training, there isn't really an excuse; sure it's hard in the beginning, but they can handle it (as long as they have appropriate nutrition and hydration every day, 1 mile = 100 calories, drink the loss of water weight during the run). Cross country is time consuming, but it is rewarding if you put the effort into it. I hope this helps, and I really am 16. This is just a small part of what I have learned throughout my running experiences.
                      JakeKnight


                        team practice is every day. if you are on the team, you practice. If you dont want to practice, then dont be on the team.
                        What else is there to say? Oh - that they should HTFU for Phelp's sake. I sure wish I had a free training program where somebody would coach me 90 minutes a day five days a week.

                        E-mail: eric.fuller.mail@gmail.com
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                        JakeKnight


                          If the intensity is too great, run slower on the easy days; workouts on the harder days can only get so hard, and the harder they feel, the more strength you will gain from them. This concept is not true on the easy distance days. Faster days are important because the muscles that you use when you're running faster are being exercised, which is good for faster races. However, recovery days are equally important because you can gain strength over a longer distance, which is beneficial to your endurance, but if these days don't feel somewhat easy, then you aren't getting the maximum benefit of the recovery run.
                          Smile That sounds so familiar.

                          E-mail: eric.fuller.mail@gmail.com
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                          zoom-zoom


                          rectumdamnnearkilledem

                            team practice is every day. if you are on the team, you practice. If you dont want to practice, then dont be on the team. Stuff isnt usually negotiable unless you have a conflict like another school activity (band, a second sport) or something else that is negotiated and agreed on with the coach. Hanging out with friends...not usually in there.
                            Yep. When I was in HS I ran track, did basketball cheerleading, concert choir, show choir, competitive public speaking, one act play...only way I could miss practice for one is if there were a conflict and the conflict were of greater importance (ie I could miss track practice if I had a play or music performance). But to miss practice just to miss practice...no way in hell. My folks would have made me quit the team entirely for that sort of lack of commitment.

                            Getting the wind knocked out of you is the only way to

                            remind your lungs how much they like the taste of air.    

                                 ~ Sarah Kay

                              I guess I'd say, take it from the 16 year old above. I'd not condone skipping, but if they decide XC is not for them, let 'em drop it - especially if they give it the old college try. It seems like they know the commitment thing from other activities and life's to short to stick with stuff you don't like. Maybe find out why they joined if they seem lackadaisical. As for "the other kids do it" you could always ask them the old "if the other kids were jumping off a bridge, would you" question. Or maybe kids aren't jumping off bridges anymore.
                              vengeancewins


                                Well, I'm a Senior XC runner and I have NEVER intentionally skipped a practice. If you are on a team, you should be dedicated to that team and show up every day. If they don't want to show up, they should quit. They joined the team knowing the commitment they would have to make and if they don't want to make that commitment,they probably aren't meant to be runners. And the friends thing shouldn't be an excuse at all. If they see their friends all day at school, it really isn't a necessity for them to hang out after school every day. That's what the weekend's for. So either tell them to HTFU or quit. Running requires dedication, not excuses.
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